I wont say who he was because that would be unfair to him but the last comment is absolutely pathetic

He is a successful senior coach in his own right and he is responsible for part of the teams overall development in an area of the game which happened to be involved in the biggest win in Grand Final history

Yep we had lost the game because I know why we were doing it. we were limiting the damage.

Your clutching at straws now

Sparky......


im asking if they learnt how to block for judd or the ball carrier....
.. or had a kick out strategy...
or linked up to the forward line....
or opened up the forward line....


???????


what was the POINT of wasting six minutes apart from wasting six minutes because you cant do the basics

I never said i want a shootout...

i said i want to see structures on the field so that players understand a role as a combination .........

cant do that???

cant see anything like that????

we wanna waste the time on the clock?????

youre not going anywhere!!!!!


thats it!!!!


cant you see that a level of preperation is required to play football???

things like kick outs... set plays... blocks and protecting the ball carrier... talk.... opening up a defence... etc.....

... and if you cannot do any of those things properly... you can tempo footy till the cows come home .. and so flower what?????

Thats not the game is it!!!!

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Just for those that REALLY dont have a clue understand can understand...

If you have 22 players and rely on the few...

... and then you dont have kick out strategies...
.. you dont blovk for the ball carrier/....
..you dont make room for the forwards .. and you have only a plan for one forward...
... you dont tackle or kick to position...
yu cant run the ball out....

... but youre a REALLY REALLY REALLY good Tempo footy team????


well youre [REDACTED]!!!!

cos the tempo is just shit... cos there is no highpoints to compare to tempo...

in fact cos were so incoherent at times...our version of tempo footy is the same things as we usually do.. only its longer.. more uncontested and more confusing as well as slower....

We still dont block.. run with the footy... contest or move the ball into the forward line with purpose...


Thats our going to school is it??

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I understand.

So let me get this straight, you issue isn't so much with tempo football, it is using the tactics when a lot of out fundamentals (and yes I agree with this) are lacking?

I understand the need to improve on the points you have raised, but if they can play tempo football effectively - why wouldn't they? It negated Geelong's run, and we scored as well.

Other skills (I hope) will come with time, just remember how young the side is.

Will you admit that the tactic worked in both the Pies and the Eagles matches??!

We would have run the risk of losing both matches if it weren't for the benefits of...


TEMPO FOOTY!




You hate it 'cos it's true.

Hey sparky

I beg to differ

You see we were ahead in those games and we did it for shorter periods of time.

We were 19 points down and we started at the 20 minute mark. The only reason we got a goal was because
1 We turned it over anyway
2 Ling was a dumb arse giving away 50

Can you see the difference

Synbad wrote

im asking if they learnt how to block for judd or the ball carrier....

They did try to block for Jud, but were pushed out of the way on some occasions and Ling was standing opposite to the ruck in some others and ran past the ruckmen to hit Judd front on. Most of the time it is the umps job to protect Judd as the majority of the hits and blocks on Judd were illegal.

.. or had a kick out strategy...

How do you know what the strategy is? It could be that the players aren't excuting the strategy rather than the lack of it.
or linked up to the forward line....
or opened up the forward line....

The problem is more that the other forwards don't work hard enough to provide and option and we are lacking in genuine forward players that can make space or take a contested mark

Its not about what we did against Collingwood or WC.. its about becoming a rounded team.....

What were not doing far outweights what were doing when it comes to tempo...

Tempo is bullshit unless you learn to play the game....and you wont learn to play the game if youre hiding from the teams that can play the game...

basically our gameplan and preparation is flawed in many cataguories..so instead of rectifying our shortcomings were attmpting to sweep them under the carpet...

The bullshit before half time wasnt as clever ploy...
Stevo never went harder after it..
Bower still got hammered because there was no talk..
Judd had noone blocking for him....
Fev NEVER got near it after half time...
Eddie was still our only defensive forward...
Did we become more contested ???

So whats the point?????

When we have situations to address... why time waste???

We still got thumped!!!...

.. and in FACT we played better before the 'Tempo' than after it...FACT!!!

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Synners, I agree with your sentiments on areas we can improve on 100%, but are you getting what can be achieved on the training track a little muddled with what can be achieved on the field?? Just a little?? We can and should work on the things you are talking about, but I think it is a somewhat different monster to playing a bit of tempo footy when situations call for it.

If they were pushed out the way thats a free kick isnt it????
Who was pushed out of the way protecting the ball carriers???
Can you give me specific examples on when Scotland Carrazzo or Stevens were protecting the ball carrier????

Stevens couldnt even protect a limp Bower...

How can i say what the kick out strategy was????Youre right.. you tell me what we were trying to do... i dont know!!!...

Footscray didnt have any genuine forwards at all.. let alone a Fev but Eade still made their forward line competitive...

I keep asking which other club has 2 or more forwards who have kicked over the dozen?????

Surely we dont have the worst forward line in the comp???

Do we???

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What we are saying is that the situation didnt warrant us kicking it around for 6 minutes.

We wont improved in the areas we should if we continue with the tempo too much.

Gilly were uncontested except Judd... we dont work for each other... we have the most uncontested touches of any team already... and you think we need to be more uncontested again????..(aka the tempo thinggy) and thats what this team needs to learn????


What we do need to learn is a whole heap of other things that come with planning... REAL PLANNING...

....were not worrying about those things but were going to worry about 'tempo footy' are we???

By the way which club has had the most UNCONTESTED possesions in the AFL this year????
Most possessions???

We need the Scotto Stevo Carrazzo mindset do we???

And Judd can be in the coalface on his own right???


Add the Eddie and Fev stat and youll find were struggling for ideas...
My question is why are we struggling with kick out ideas...

Yes Were trying to kick the ball out as soon as we can so its closest to the ball kicks it ut.. (setanta).. but is that because we cant set up for a kick out and were going to go random .. (no planning??)

What did Greg Williams say about the midfield???

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Well I recall at the time being surprised we were going to play it with 6 minutes to go, seemed a bit excessive to me as well....

on the second point, I don't think 3 unwarranted minutes of tempo footy is going to set us back too much.....aside from the more obvious stuff like blocking for players, the more tactical stuff is best perfected on the training track, which we have 5 days to work on, then we have 100 minutes of footy to try to apply it under game pressure, 6 minutes of tempo footy with the premiership side in full flight I don't believe is setting us back too far, I don't see that it will be repeated to that degree all that often so I suppose I probably don't make as much of it as others.

I think there's merit in the skill of playing tempo. There's a time and a place. Personally, the tempo footy in the last 6 minutes of the 2nd Q didn't make any difference to our development or to our detriment. It only proved they can do it.

It would be better to be a better team and do the things we wish/need them to do: block, shepherd, talk, link....

I think there's an obvious fitness concern/ issue.

My view is the Blueboys were out of breath and out of their depth against Geelong; in terms of skill, strength, teamwork, work ethis and fitness.

What it clearly looked like to me at the moment when Judd raised the ball was that he was exhausted, battered and in need of a break; that's Judd I'm talking about.

If that was the case, then I guessed at the time that Judd may have considered that if he (being our superman) was rooted, then surely the undeveloped 'kids' must have been as rooted if not moreso and there waere some signs appearing...goals were being scored with ease from by the opposition; something that hadn't happened at any previous stage of the game.

Our lack of competitiveness in the last minutes of every quarter have been apparent since round 1. Why would it be a surprise that the same was happening against Geelong?

We haven't got the required level of fitness to compete against the Geelongs for 100 minutes!!

I don't think Ratts could get the kids' fitness levels to match the Geelong players' standards in 2008, let alone overnight for that game. He hasn't got the cattle to compete at the required level from a fitness perspective, so how in the hell could he get them to execute his game plan, let alone any game plan against a team of seasoned ultra fit, ultra strong footballers? Impossible. We were lambs to the slaughter. The onslaught was stemmied; albeit for only 6 minutes.

We have a long way to go with our skills, and our fitness levels must (and will) improve but it will take the next preseason and the next year and the preseason after that. That's realistic.

Steroids and human growth hormones are illegal to use to expedite their fitness levels, so its going to be a process of baby steps over the next couple of years. There's no other way around it.

Now, whether Ratts is a good teacher or has the knack of coaching with success, well that remains to be seen; it's too early to judge with the cattle he has at his disposal.

I believe that having Jamison, Waite, Walker, Bannister, Hadley, Houlihan and Anderson would have added a bit of strength and aggression to the team's fabric, alas they were not.

It's always good to hear Synbad's and keogh's view. Whilst you may not agree with all they have to say, there's some credence somewhere in their argument; they don't suffer from the rose colored glasses syndrome I do at times. They say what they see...and some of it is true.... to a degree.

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Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...... judd is in need of a break Gilly....

he is!!!

he is doing it alone.....

there is no infrustructure in play around to help him....


.. and same can be said about Fev...

We do not do the basics...... and the basics are a few things but very important for any football team...

... the game is shared over 22 players.... not the ball.. the game...

you are still playing when you dont have the ball...... you can still run into space... block.. decoy.. tackle... etc...

assuming you know what t do .. right????

i dont think our players have a clue what theyre doing if they dont have the ball.. or not in possession of it....(except judd hadley and gibbs)

thats where the learning for improvement is.. not tempo footy.. tempo footy in our situation is when you have no answers....

too early for that when we should be doing basics..first!!!

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Mate, I agree with all you have said and I hope these things are being worked on..... Judd needs a lot more help, both blocking and sharing some of the clearance grunt work, strategically we are constrained by not having at least one more prominent forward drawing good defenders....it all needs to be worked on, but I don't see the 6 minutes of tempo footy (albeit somewhat excessive) as a scapegoat.

I think we're on the same page, just looking at it a bit differently. I see the same ills, just probably think these things are best worked harder at during the week, not the last 6 minutes of the first half against the reigning premiers in full flight.

Nah the circle work that lasted 6 minutes is indicative of where were at for ideas....

thats how i saw it....

nothing to do with tempo.. just where were at for ideas ....



now that was done before half time....

so are people suggesting our players are [REDACTED] with their fitness 20 minutes into the second quarter???


or did we just tell geelong were not in the contest....before half time... 20 odd points down????


what was the point of it you have to ask yourself...

.. and because there is no real point to what we did 6 minutes prior to half time except sweep our lack of planning under the rug.....it was lame!!!

its not going to get you anywhere in this elite competition....


im interested in which team has the most uncontested possies????

is it us???

.. if it is and we have a whole heap of other flaws in our planning and structures.. why go with even more uncontested and unaccontable game style???

why work on something thats already a weakness to make that weakness bigger????


like how can you make a huge flaw stronger by getting better at your huge flaw????


and gilly... these things are problems becase they have not been addressed pre season or during the week.. so come 3.15 on a saturday afternoon.. (or whatever) half way through the secnd quarter... we go circle work....



frget they are the regning premiers.. theyre a footy team that youre competing with.... and you have a champion centreman doing it all on his own for the rest of the team.. and there are few ideas on how to help him.....

circle work isnt one of those.... cos youre not going to play a full 100 minutes that way.....
weird.....

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we rank 4th in UP...behind Geelong, Hawthorn and Richmond

Would we be first if it wasnt for Judd????


Ok dumb me.. Ratts must be onto something.....

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