Beano has raised some questions that probably deserve a thread of their own. Especially as we're lucky enough to have some contributors to the official website here at TC…



Should we ban him?



Yep … good point. molsey/Jarusa/anyone, are you able to give an update as to what may be the cause here? Any clues as to what's likely to happen when the Telstra deal ends?

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Hopefully the Club will have learnt something from the whole Telstra website farce.

I like the contributors, but the overall site is garbage. Messy, disorganised, and a re-hash of the crap that's on the main AFL website. Which includes stories totally unrelated to Carlton being the "feature" story on the front page.

Also, the site is badly organised and hard to navigate sensibly, not that that is a surprise for a Telstra site.

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

Don't know all the ins and outs, but as far as I know Carlton have 1 person who updates the website, and even then that is not his primary job. Keeping the website updated is just a small part of his overall job within the communications department of the club.

I have heard that clubs like Essendon* have had 3 or 4 staff who work full-time on their website.

For the resource that are available I think the CFC website does a terrific job.

The new Telstra deal this summer should be interesting however it alone will not change the 'resource' problem at the club (in fact things will probably become worse with respect to internet money entering the club). Until the finances at the club are turned around (which is probably still at least 2-3 years away) I don't forsee any additional resources being put into the website until more money is available.

To do the types of updating with photo's etc that Beano describes would at least mean one full-time employee devoted to the website.

The guernsey issue is a different one and I am not sure about that, there seems to be a good range of clothing at the Carlton Shop to me, but maybe there isn't??

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Yep, that is true.

As you said many of the problems regarding navigation etc. are due to the strict Telstra/Sportal contract that the CFC (and other clubs) have to follow.

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Ah CB, dont ban me, I am a blue through and through , I even know the club song, not bad going for an Irishman huh?
Interesting that the Hawks and the Saints have kept their own sites and are much MUCH better than telstra sites. If the upkeep of the site is a problem regarding employees, surely to God between the three forums the club have they could at least have a couple of guys and gals to do a few hours here and there to keep the looking good.
Organisation breathes success, from the top right down to the guy who sweeps the stands after games

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Beano, the Hawks and Saints are also Telstra sites, in fact the only non-Telstra site is Essendon*'s as they were the only club not to sign up.

Your idea about volunteer contributions to the site is a good one. as an example I have a window in the next 5 years or so where in theory I would be able to contribute to running the site.

It is a difficult issue though. How is it handled technically. I'm sure the Telstra contract precludes anyone who is not a sanctioned employee of the club from accessing content. So we are again stuck with one person who can change the site.

If it means just more people giving content to the person who has to put it up on the site we are in the same situation as the bottleneck would occur at the actual 'addition of content' stage where the resource available is only a part of one employee's job.

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One of my favourite topics.

The pure & simple reason for our website being of a perceived lesser quality than others is funding. Saints make a mill and can devote resources to this sort of thing. Not sure I care about their o/s holiday but training pics like the ones Mordan put up last week would look great on site.

I agree with Jar Jar, that our site is exceptional when you consider that it's Steve's part-time job while he handles media, looks after 400 letters/emails a week and arranges player functions. Its a big job. Is this good enough? Hell no, but its not Steve's fault, its a Club issue. jarusa and Danny will know how frustrated I get when articles don't go up, when interviews don't happen after I've taken time off work etc. Its bloody frustrating.

Until the Club turns the numbers around, or has a reappraisal of key issues and devotes more resources to the site (Think Collo, ask yourself whether internet marketing is his forte?), we will be stuck with what we have. And what do we have?

* I think its a better looking website since the redo in July 2005. the main problem is the telstra stuff which has to go up I'm told
* They've kept the player profiles up to date since draft day (Other than rookies, and I'm on to that now)
* Content is better spread with Carlton articles, volunteer articles and sportalstate-the-obvious comments meaning there's a new thing to read, or two, each day
* Kiddy section coming through

With all this, Carlton was the #1 website until about July, when our decline down the ladder meant a sudden lack of interest for many. Until then, we were at the top and the Club was pretty proud of the efforts. All this means extra revenue for the club, so even if you don't like Buzz articles read them and post your views on this site.

The grand plan is that at the end of this contract Carlton will be armed with a high ranking website and not a low ranking one, so they can pick the best offer available to them. That happens at the end of this year so the volunteers will stick around until at least then. There is a suib-committee of the Board looking at this but it really hasn't kicked into gear yet.

Thanks for your feedback guys. Like other aspects of the club's operations, I just can't wait until we're back at the pointy end again.

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As Jarusa said, it's going to take time.

It's disappointing, because increasingly the website is the main-client facing aspect of a footy club. it's no longer your home ground, its not your gaming venue, and its not really what you do at home grounds. The Carlton website should be seen as a main entry point for interested people and hopefully for the conversion of fans to members. Therefore it should take pride of place in the expenses budget.

It's just a damn shame that once again, we're 2-4 years behind the others.

I remember posting on TBV that I saw Graeme McMahon on Talking Footy talking about how the website is the main interface between the club and all their supporters, from local, through to international, and that it's in their interest to make sure the website is accessible to all, and has as much information as possible to distribute to whoever wants it.

I'm sure that it will improve. Couldn't really get much worse from the point at which it was a while back.

I realise I'm in Sydney, but I would be happy to contribute however I can to the club with my skills. I have offered this before, but been given the brush-off.

I will be in Melbourne (probably) in January, I'm hoping there may be a way I can fit something in to help out. Keep in touch with me and I will keep you updated.

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

Yes, it is, but this 2-4 years behind is not in policy, its because of funding. So we're necessarily behind if that makes sense.

I know the Buzz team were writing an article about Sydney fans and teh Sydney swans - not sure if they sent it in yet. Did you want me to contact them to get you involved?

Sounds good.

In terms of funding, why is it that sponsorship cash isn't allocated towards those areas?

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

Funding is always a matter of priorities. Of course the club could find the money to employ a full time web person if they decided that it was a higher priority than some of the things that currently get funding.

People who don't use and understand the internet (I'd hazard a guess that would cover most if not all of the board), I think view it as a new area of business. They feel they have to have a "website" with "webiste content", and that now they have this extra expense, that sits separate from the rest of the business.

Really, a website is just another communication tool. It's just another way for the same kinds of information to be communicated to a target audience (in this case members and supporters). It sits alongside print (ie. the inside carlton newsletter etc), as just another way of getting the same kind of information out there.

If you compare Inside Carlton to the website, it's the same sort of stuff. There are interviews with players/officials, games for the kids, selling carlton merchandise etc. Yet, the club seems to be producing two different sets of overlapping information. I don't care how I get it, in the post or on the web is all the same to me, information is information. So they have all this stuff, that's already written, nice photos etc, but they don't put it on the website. Sure, they still need to produce both versions, but it would mean a lot more content for the website that is already written (and would save Carlton money if I could specify on my membership form that I don't need the printed Inside Carlton).

I've also never seen any of the web articles in Inside Carlton. Why not? There would be an audience that doesn't read the website, but does read Inside Carlton. Surely there'd be some stuff that they'd be interested in. And it's already written, no extra effort (or money).

The internet is also an immediate medium. There is no lag between publishing, the the audience reading what's been produced. This opens up so many possibilities. Training reports would be silly in print media because they'd be old news by the time they got out. But they can be posted a couple of hours after a session on the internet. That immediacy gives a real feeling of involvement to supporters. Suporter involvement equals better attendances and more memberships. The club has done well with the draft, having articles up almost straight away, so hopefully they're coming to terms with this.

Hmm this has turned into quite a rant. I'm just frustrated that the internet and a footy club with a large and wide spread supporter base are a great match. There is so much that could be done, but it's not. And all things considered, it's a damn cheap way of doing things, considering what you can achieve. Outlaying 100K/year to run a decent website might sound like a lot, but when compared with the benefits it's not much money for an organisation the size of Carlton.

Agreed Mordan, some excellent points.

There are people behind the scenes trying to open up the club's eyes to some of the possibilities you have outlined, but it just going to take some time and some lobbying.

If you sent a letter similar to what you detailed above to the club, it would be read, everything helps.

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While I agree with most of what you said, i disagree entirely with the above statement. If the club performed a business analysis, they could examine what the technology could do for them.

For example, the site should have a database backend that allows each member to log onto the site. Perhaps even to customise content (eg only display those things of interest). This allows members to feel increased ownership of the club.

It might also allow the club to push more membership renewals through the website, saving time and effort of those employed at the club. These resources could then be redirected into the website...

To get the most out of a website, it needs to be part of a reengineered business model by someone with the understanding of both tradtional business models and the Internet. I would harzard a guess that club costs could be reduced and those resources used to substantially improve the site.

Just my two cents worth....

Good points steve, but Mordan is still right I reckon. The website is just another communication tool, but my interpretation of what you're saying is that it can be a bloody powerful asset if the concept is embraced and implemented properly.

We're all on the same page, which is great to see and I think if we follow up Jarusa's suggestion of shooting off an email to the club then I think that may help, or at least, it certainly won't hurt.

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Don't get me wrong I agree with Mordan's points. What I disagree with is that an Internet site is viewed as only 'another communication tool'. In that way it is viewed as an additional cost and then you get boards not wanting to commit resources to it.

What I am saying is that if you look at the costs of business across all of the CFC, there will be ways of using the Internet to reduce costs in other areas of administration. The club needs to examine how it uses the Internet as a method of communication and how that can reduce costs in other areas of its business. And there will be areas that can have reduced costs if this process is handled correctly.

Looking at the Internet as only another communication tool ignores the fact the the Internet can be used in many ways to reengineer business processes that have been handled differently in the past.

What the club needs to do is to examine how the Internet should be INTEGRATED with the clubs tradtional business processes, and how this can lead to savings which can then finance the building of the communication side of the Internet.

I don't disagree at all. If I were making decisions, properly integrating membership and the website would be high on my list of priorities. You're in fact saying exactly the same thing I was. In this case, it's another option (tool) for members (to communicate with the club re membership) instead of a phone call, or visit to the club. It's not anything new, just another way of doing the same things.

And I guarantee in the long run it will work out cheaper to set up the website to handle membership transactions, than to provide extra staff in the membership department to handle phone calls etc. Plus it provides a service to those who want it, and you're right, it would probably even generate extra revenues. You get someone buying their membership online, and they might just chuck in a DVD of the 1995 grand final while they're there. Or a jumper for their niece or whatever. They probably wouldn't make the trip down to buy it from the shop, but convenience is a huge factor in how people make their purchases.

Ok, I was writing my last post while you were writing this. I still think we're saying exactly the same things. It really is just a tool. It's another way (often better) of doing the same things. You're talking about re-engineering business processes. Exactly what I'm talking about. It's not about coming up with new things, it's about doing the same things better. Is it just a tool that allows you to do things in new, often better ways.

Perhaps my use of "communications" is what is confusing the issue. I'd consider that to cover pretty much all interaction between the club and it's supporters and members. Using the website to handle memberships and sales, is all about communications.

All the PSD and Rookies are now up in Player Profiles on the site.

Good effort by the Club.

I guess if they can focus on the little things and then take up the big things when there is some Board support we should be happy.

Jarusa, have you had a chat to Steve about getting on the Sub-Committee or at least presenting to it?