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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 10:53 am 
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Robert Walls
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Blue Vain wrote:
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The bottom line is the Carlton list is ordinary at best, and the coach has plenty of Blues supporters baying for his blood. His problem is that the Blues beat St Kilda and Geelong when they shouldn't have.


That quote lacks sense IMHO. Carlton beat the Saints and Cats because they were better on the day. They played with confidence, tackled hard, caused the turnover and punished the opposition who were running forward of the play.
You dont beat quality opposition by accident.
I'd also like Wallsy to define "ordinary".

I understand he's frustrated and so am I but coming out with statements that are diametrically opposed to statements of 6 weeks ago are embarrassing.
Yes we're playing poor football at the moment but it's more about mindset than talent. We need to start working harder and many other aspects of the game will fall into place. Like most other teams we score quickly when we force the opposition to give the ball up. Whether by tackling or applying pressure and causing turnovers. When you cause turnovers, you catch the opposition out on the transition and space and often the corridor are yours to utilise. That results in open forward lines and quick ball movement.

Our biggest issue at the moment is we're only getting an opportunity to get our hands on the ball at stoppages and kick ins. You wont win many games of footy that way. The opposition have set their zones up and any forward ball movement is slow or high risk. Forget corridor footy, forget playing on. They should be viewed as outcomes, not pre-determined actions. If you tackle with intent, hit the contest hard and get the ball back off the opposition when they're in an attacking mindset, the corridor and the opportunity to run the ball in space will be yours. Then you'll see the confidence, attacking run and skills return with it.
The challenge then for the coaches is to retain the correct balance of attacking/defensive workrate.


100% spot on as always BV :thumbsup:

I know what Wallsy is trying to do with this article, but making silly comments about the list which contradict what he said earlier in the year about the same list is just stupid and so stereotypical of about 90% of football media morons out there.

If he was going to have a crack, why not have a decent go at the football club in it's entirety? Players, coaches, development staff, administrators etc. are all responsible in some way for our current position. Players don't lose their ability overnight and there is a lot more to football than how much talent your list has. To write an article which really only focusses on the quality of the playing list whilst only lightly touching on other issues is really poor journalism IMO.

The funny thing is that he will be writing exactly the same article about 1 of the 3 teams he mentions at the end the next time it turns pear-shaped for them.

Just could have been so much better an article in every way.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 11:34 am 
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John Nicholls
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That's where success stems from today, just ask Collingwood, Melbourne and Fremantle.

Errrrm...

How much success have Melbourne and Fremantle had?
Aren't we above Melbourne on the ladder?

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 11:53 am 
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Ken Hunter
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Obviously when he talks about success, he's talking about achievements in July 2010 :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:04 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

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I agree with Walls and reckon his player views were on the money as well.....while Ratten is a novice coach and struggling I thinks its unfair to expect great results with this list. Too many holes, no cover in some positions, and no spine to build a team around. We have total reliance on one player ie Judd to perform miracles and its not a reciepe for premiership success.
The footy dept needs a review from the coaching dept, recruiting, through to the fitness gurus...

re: Geelong and A graders.....I'd be happy to add Ottens, Mackie and Enright to our list and call them D graders, labels mean nothing...try trading for them?...Geelong would want A grade payment in terms of picks/players.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:08 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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I totally agree with Walls.

Hopefully it makes our boys wake up.

Hopefully the trigger we need

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:08 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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SnickerS wrote:
jimmae wrote:
Over the top Wallsy. Hits more notes than it misses, however.


What parts do you consider over the top Jimmae?

Opinions on particular players ability ???

In his mind we've gone from having the Midas touch to the exact opposite, and both times it's got to do with the game plan and the quality of the playing list.

No discernible game plan is just rubbish, as is calling our list mediocre. Have a look at the discussion Robbo has with Ratten in today's Herald Sun. I do agree that the trade for McLean may have been too early, but he is 24 and will be around for a sustained tilt if he's capable.

That he calls the selection of Johnson a disgrace is ludicrous. We used our PSD pick on him; we missed out on diddley squat Walls. Absolute best case scenario, we draft Jurrah in the national draft and forfeited our PSD, or we could have taken Cousins. Would anyone have done that at the time? I still wouldn't have picked Cousins, and no one picked Fev for reaching a new low.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:10 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Effes wrote:
The comments on Bower just show how little Walls actually knows about each player - the guy has struggled with injury for the entire season.

You only have to look at who Walls rated as A-graders on the Geelong list to see how out of touch he is.

Image

Mooney, Ottens, Mackie, Enright A-Graders? :lol:

He's been out of touch with the game for a long time now...nice to see him give the club a bake but in terms of substance he is lacking.


...and Hawkins a B-Grader? You have to be kidding me.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:21 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:25 pm 
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Rod Ashman

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geez wallsy, 6 weeks is a long time in football .

by your strange logic weve gone from top 4 to "ordinary list at best" in that timeframe :donk: :screwy: :screwy:


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:38 pm 
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Bruce Comben

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Some exerpts from Walls' column...

The bottom line is the Carlton list is ordinary at best. :oops: :mad: :oops:

The basic game plan has become a "mystery". :confused:

Chris Judd is the Blues' only A-grader. :clap:

Marc Murphy and Bryce Gibbs could be A-graders but need to develop further. :thumbsup:

Gibbs seems lost at the moment. Either play him on a quality tall forward or work him as an inside midfielder who is expected to win hard, contested ball.At the moment he does neither. : :donk:

The Blues need to build their midfield depth. :wink:

It is the key-position players that are the problem. :razz:

Down back the Blues struggle. Not one defender can run, bounce and deliver a spearing, 55-metre pass. :sad:

Paul Bower appears to lack a passion for the contest. :banghead:

Bret Thornton may well have played his last game. And that's fine. He's been too loose, too undisciplined and isn't hard enough. :cry:

Chris Johnson should not have been recruited Too slow, poor awareness and too many mongrel kicks. :oops:

Andrew Walker has promised plenty but delivered little over seven seasons. :banghead:

Astute recruiting and development is the way to go. :thumbsup:

Richard Hadley, Brock McLean and Johnson hinder the development of the Blues. :oops:

Jarrad Waite? Time to stand up and deliver. For a player who should be in his team's top four his inconsistency and ridiculous suspensions have greatly hurt the club this year. :banghead: :screwy:

Michael Jamison gives no dash, drive or attack. :confused:

Aaron Joseph lacks poise and polish. :razz:
Supporters should look beyond the coach and question those who recruit and develop at Carlton. :roll: :mad: :thumbsup: :thanks:


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 12:51 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 1:04 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Mr Grump wrote:
Some exerpts from Walls' column...

The bottom line is the Carlton list is ordinary at best. :oops: :mad: :oops:

The basic game plan has become a "mystery". :confused:

Chris Judd is the Blues' only A-grader. :clap:

Marc Murphy and Bryce Gibbs could be A-graders but need to develop further. :thumbsup:

Gibbs seems lost at the moment. Either play him on a quality tall forward or work him as an inside midfielder who is expected to win hard, contested ball.At the moment he does neither. : :donk:

The Blues need to build their midfield depth. :wink:

It is the key-position players that are the problem. :razz:

Down back the Blues struggle. Not one defender can run, bounce and deliver a spearing, 55-metre pass. :sad:

Paul Bower appears to lack a passion for the contest. :banghead:

Bret Thornton may well have played his last game. And that's fine. He's been too loose, too undisciplined and isn't hard enough. :cry:

Chris Johnson should not have been recruited Too slow, poor awareness and too many mongrel kicks. :oops:

Andrew Walker has promised plenty but delivered little over seven seasons. :banghead:

Astute recruiting and development is the way to go. :thumbsup:

Richard Hadley, Brock McLean and Johnson hinder the development of the Blues. :oops:

Jarrad Waite? Time to stand up and deliver. For a player who should be in his team's top four his inconsistency and ridiculous suspensions have greatly hurt the club this year. :banghead: :screwy:

Michael Jamison gives no dash, drive or attack. :confused:

Aaron Joseph lacks poise and polish. :razz:
Supporters should look beyond the coach and question those who recruit and develop at Carlton. :roll: :mad: :thumbsup: :thanks:


Wallsy sure uses a lot of emoticons in his article. I fear the standards of football journalism may be slipping.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 1:05 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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fraser murphy wrote:
Wallsy sure uses a lot of emoticons in his article. I fear the standards of football journalism may be slipping.

:lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 2:05 pm 
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Adrian Gallagher

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With Walls it's either all duck or no dinner.

Truth lies somewhere in between.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 3:51 pm 
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Laurie Kerr

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Walls is spot on with this article.

Every Carlton player should read this before the game. And after the season when the unsigned Carlton players want to renegotiate their contracts in light of the GC and GWS take a good hard look and realise.. "YOU ARE SH*T UNLESS YOUR NAME IS JUDD"

We paid too much for Betts and Gibbs this season. Russel seems to be one of the few that is probably earning his pay packet.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 4:45 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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not so sure he is spot on.
listening to sen this morning, they where discussing st.kilda trading this year, and brereton brought up the issue, that not having a good trade period for one year doesnt hurt, but having two bad trade periods in a row, can kill a side, as it creates a real gulf in the sides balance.
and i think it is that, more than anything, that alludes to the problem facing carlton currently. its where the article about geelong v carlton is probably closer to the mark.
i think, the problem with our list, is we are devoid of the players around the 25-27 mark, the ones that should be making the difference, and this is due to the draft penalties we had to deal with. i think we have been paying the price and are still paying the price for it now.
look at our list (not im going by year born, nothing else)
Players aged 29 - Scotland
Players aged 27 – Judd, Waite, Carazzo
Players aged 26 – Simpson
Players aged 25 – None
Players aged 24 – Jamison, Russell, Betts
Players aged 23 – Murphy, Warnock
Players aged 22 – Bower, Hampson, Grigg
Players aged 21 – Ellard, Gibbs, Robinson, Garlett, Henderson
Until we have a core group of players, aged between 25-29, rather than 21-24 like they currently are, we aren’t going to be challenging for the flag.
It is excusing them for their performance last week, not at all, but sometimes i think we all forget, where we are actually coming from. We still have a long way to go, infact, you could argue, that fact that we are filthy about the way we are going, shows what we expect of the team even though they are fairly young when compared to other sides.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 4:48 pm 
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Rod Ashman

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Effes wrote:
The comments on Bower just show how little Walls actually knows about each player - the guy has struggled with injury for the entire season.

You only have to look at who Walls rated as A-graders on the Geelong list to see how out of touch he is.

Image

Mooney, Ottens, Mackie, Enright A-Graders? :lol:

He's been out of touch with the game for a long time now...nice to see him give the club a bake but in terms of substance he is lacking.


Wallsy is clearly measuring the Cats on a different basis than Carlton. At the moment, The following are NOT A-Graders: Corey, Ottens, Mooney, Mackie

The following are NOT B-Graders: Hawkins, Stokes, Byrnes, Wojcinski, Hunt, Rooke.

By this assessment, Carlton’s A-Graders would be: Judd, Murphy, Gibbs, Waite, Simpson, Kreuzer
B Graders: Betts, Bower, Carrazzo, Walker, Russell, Thornton, AJ (no worse than Hunt this season and certainly more productive than Rooke…), Jamison
C Graders: Yarran, Garlett, Fisher, Henderson, Setanta, Johnson, Grigg, Hadley, Warnock, Hampson, Ellard, White.

Having said that, his article about us in The Age is pretty accurate as far as holding the players accountable is concerned. I think as far as talent is concerned he is a little hysterical. We definitely have some holes to plug but we are much closer than he presents - our best team, playing at their best, with an effective gameplan is top-4 competitive. We fall away when any of those factors are not present PLUS we lack the ticker (hardness, resilience, relentlessness) to compete with top 4 CONSISTENTLY. IMO.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 5:44 pm 
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Robert Walls

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Hard to believe he's a premiership coach. He sure has changed his tune. If we win tonight he will prob do another 180. Bit like most tcers. Look, Waite, bower, kruezer are our best 3 talls and all have had injury affected 2010s, and the coach hasn't been able to develop a pies/hawks/saints overall defensive mindset, and we don't have a gun tall fwd... Lots of issues. But it's a young list so they have improvement in them if coached n developed well so to say the players are rubbish is a knee jerk reaction.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2010 7:11 pm 
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Bruce Comben

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I can only think that Walls is laying the blame at the players' lack of skills as a way to somehow inspire them. It's almost a last resort and he likes dramatic licence. Just maybe the players will be so affronted they'll play possessed. Let's hope they read the Age.

But I'm feeling a bit deja vu, recalling the Collins and Pagan years of calling them Z class players and then they lived up to those expectations.

Another strangely anticlimactic feeling I'm having, as if you're interested is that we were waiting for the chance to redeem ourselves against the Scum but now there's more at stake and oddly enough, I don't feel nearly as desperate about the outcome - I'm waiting for asign.


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