I have indicated in the Freo thread and last weeks pregame discussion that I would have replaced Setanta for Hendo for various reasons; not one being that I have put a line through his name.

As for the Melbourne game, there's no bias from me at all. I explained my position, but you have decided to throw the bias line at me.
Here I go again:
I know what his stats say in the Melb game, but I know that he had a hand in nearly every goal in that first quarter and the stats don't show that. There was a shepherd, a tackle and a tap on which didn't involve a kick or a handball, but the result my friend was what mattered most; GOALS to our forwards. We were up 5 nil. That first quarter set up the win, don't you agree. He had a hand in them. Fact. Not bias. Therefore he had a hand in our win. I'm not saying he was sensational.

I too would like to see more than the 1%ers from Setanta, and whilst Hendo is doing more than that on the possession ledger he gets my nod for selection, ahead of Setanta. This does not imply Setanta is finished for the season. In fact a fit and in form Setanta (as he was for most of the first half season), is an important assett for us in 2010.

2010 is what I'm focussed on, and I like the idea of pressure sor spots in the seniors and selecting on form.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

You fools who criticize Setanta. It' s as if you expect him to be a Kennedy or Rewoldt. The guy has kicked 25 goals in half a season. How many goal assists? Does he ever lose his feet in a contest? He may have played 2 or 3 bad games this season but he has plenty of friends there. You might want to analyse our forward set up against North where we had no one deep for the first half, before you criticise Setanta. Theconsensus on this forum asked Setanta to kick 40 goals this year. He is going give you that. Compare that to Clokes first 7 games last year (3 goals I think). If you want a young forward, they take 4 seasons to develop and they won't give us what Setanta has this year.

+1
If he's tired give him a rest, but also give him a fair go!
There is little to replace him with atm btw.

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It's the jumper

Quote "You might want to analyse our forward set up against North where we had no one deep for the first half,"
On TV last night Wallsy and Luke Darcy showed the obvious lack of forward structure in Carlton's setup, compared to North. Someone has to stay near home to keep the defenders honest and score the opportunistic goals.

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It's the jumper

Been a contributor this season has the Irishman and I like him as a player....been down in recent weeks and I would freshen him up in the twos and reward Henderson for his efforts.
Wouldnt give up on Santy and he can play his part in the team IMHO.....does work better with his three helpers.

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen

I know there is a lot of people who like him because of .... but what benchmark are we setting ourselves if we don't make the relevant changes as required and set a standard that needs to be adhered too?

We will not get anywhere unless we make the hard decisions as and when needed, ie. Waite/Thornton/McLean ommissions. Just because his Irish doesn't mean we need to turn a blind eye. That's what got us into the mess with Fevola!

This is a really interesting thread. Sydney's got me persuaded about a couple of things.

Firstly, there's never been a player stay on a senior list for so long whilst delivering so little.
Where many others have got the "not up to it" message he's been blessed with a "still learning
the game". I don't actually have a problem with this though. We were crap, he appeared to have
the required physical attributes and the hope was that he'd eventually get the idea. The indulgence
has to stop now though. It annoyed me a bit when he was discussing his decision to play on from point
blank range against Hawthorn and he said that he was used to having to play on because that's what
you did in Gaelic. Flower me mate -- how many years do you need to understand things and get old
habits out of your system?

Secondly, I agree that his performance hasn't been up to scratch the past month. I differ though in my
assessment of his year. I reckon he's done enough to stay on the list. On the plus side he competes well,
he's slotted some nice goals from the 50m and also some nice opportunistic goals. 25 from 12 is a pass. Just.
My big issue with him is when does he take overhead marks? Even uncontested ones I reckon I've seen him
spill more than I've seen him take. I've got more confidence in Eddie in an aerial contest than I have Setanta.
Give him a spell in the two's until he can take grabs and judge him on performance only. He's been around too
long to be considered a project player anymore.

What's fallen by the wayside is the conspiracy theory that Ratten doesn't rate him and he only got games when Raten had no-one else to play.

The full circle.

Fickle.

I liked that theory

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Sorry,

Again you don't understand his role. Just like spalding and McClure his number one role is to create a contest in our forward line, so the little guys can crumb. If he takes one or two marks a game that is a bonus. Let's start looking at how many packs his in when Waite et al floats across and takes a mark. I don't know how old you are but there is nothing wrong with an old style center half forward. Sure big bodied one grab players are preferred but you only get half a dozen of them in an era. I st

Spalding and MAclure werent frightened of body contact and to draw any comparison with them is insulting to them - Particually to Maclure

Setanta is a more like Adrian De Luca but with poorer kicking action and less awareness

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

and he's still twice as good as fumbles

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This might sound extreme in the context of alleged sexual assault, drunken violence and a drug trafficking charge...

dear SB although you can post you cannot post as well as the great posters of Carlton, in fact so poorly do you post that I think its an insult to all the other posters to even call what you do posting.

I remember posters like Deano and Synners - now there were posters! Heck even tommi is a real poster who always commits totally to his posting.

So from now on lets say what you is not posting but something altogether different, just so that we keep the images of Synners and Deano pure.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Danny you know as well as me that I could never be as good as those two great posters and one day when I grow up I might join them over at the Adults only SCE where I can belittle and abuse other posters at will with out the fear of being banned

there is one thing I have that they dont have - I dont flip flop and change my opinion I have only ever targeted 4 people on this site

Pagan
Fev
Setanta
Rudd

I reckon my average is looking pretty good and would almost put money on it by November this year I will batting 100

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

I have to be careful here that I don't get sucked in here to Setanta bashing
as I can see some +ves about him. However ... you cannot seriously be suggesting that taking overhead marks is an optional attribute for a tall forward. Just "being" in a pack whilst a team-mate who has judged the flight of the ball better and takes the grab is no crime -- so long you're not always the one who's just being there. He needs to do some grabbing too sometimes.

He can do it. He took some great grabs last year in the game that Fev cleaned him up in. But he's not doing it now and he should be given a spell until his form
returns.

Oh and for the record my earliest football memory was the 1972 GF ... nice way
to get started.

it is not who you target SB (as you'd know if you looked at how many people accept Setanta needs a rest in the 2's) it is how you target and that, in the end, is what really matters.

So when a poster says so and so (battler) is doing a job like so and so (club champion) it is lazy argument to say battler should never be compared to champion - he wasn't, just the task!

Argue the merits

ie is Setanta playing a similar role to Spalding?
Don't turn it into a Setanta is not as good as Spalding etc. - no one said he was.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Gee SB, you've really gone out on a limb with all 4 of them
1) Blind Freddy could've been pissing in his sisters pocket whilst dancing with her along media street and realized very early on that Pagan was not what we needed
2) Fev had his critics since 2002. Being Critic barcode # 546781238996 entitles you to nothing more than being one minute part of the class action
3) Setanta..hurling background, project player, experiment......a masterchef recipe for the "I told you so doomsayers"
4) Rudd....with an infantile political system that basically forces us to vote Lib or Labour, roughly 50% of the vox pop will target the other rough 50% anyway

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If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you!

Danny I,m sitting in the pub discussing footy - I'm not trying to acheive posting greatness and wouldn't be surprised if I was the most ignored poster on the site


99

they were all pretty popular

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Did you say Pub?

I wish I was thet with you, regardless of your position on Setanta.

First and foremost you are a Carlton supporter.

Like you said, you've targeted Setanta and you're doing a good job of it.
That aside, along with the alternatives to Setanta you have put forward, I'm sure you love Carlton like the rest of us.

Have a drink for me.

Mmmm, I think I'll have another one before this State of Origin starts at the Beach Rd; plenty of atmosphere there.
I'll be the one with the Carlton top on.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

James Hird mentions Setanta in his Herald Sun MVP column today.




He then went on to say that despite all the above, he is still shit and a useless irishman who doesn't know the game and even though Ratt's floods way to much this shouldn't stop Setanta from kicking goals 80mtrs out from goal on the wing.

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"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit"
- Aristotle