Jesus was a commie chucky.

The point I was trying to make about branding is that to me it is a symbol of the corporatisation of something that was once community based. A sponsor does not sponsor a club unless it see's that it gets a commerical return, that in some way it makes a profit, they do not have the club at heart. And they will dictate in some ways what happens within a club. While I am grateful for what Richard Pratt did, a white knight in the manner of a Pratt is a rare beast in football and to me, it is in a way sad that we had to rely on him to save the club. I am no fool I understand that the modern game requires vast amounts of money to operate, but the penalty is that the everyday fan gets pretty much excluded from the Grand Final.

When you step back and look at the clubs as a whole, there is really no difference between them, the old tribal loyalties are slowly dying and half the clubs are either constructs or no longer have ties to thier orginal areas, two clubs died to promote the 'modern' game. So when there was talk of Carlton merging or relocating, I knew that I would no longer follow the senior game as Carlton would cease to exist and I was not going to support the new 'brand' Carlton. Anyone remember New Coke?

I support a football club for all its faults, warts and troublesome players. Not a brand that gets promoted like a X-Box with its red eye of death built in. Not a brand that gets upgraded when a new 'improved' model is released.

It is not the sushi and Crownies in a coporate box I savour but the sights and sounds of a crowd in full voice and the memories of past deeds and yes tragedies.

I support a football club.

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A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty" -Winston Churchill

L.M 35-06

Its here and now and its called Centre Square as well as any other "GF package" sold by the AFL.

You and I can't buy a GF ticket, then on sell it to someone for a tidy profit. But the AFL can Was the scalping law to protect the fans or the brand?????

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Everything before the word "but" is horseshit - J Snow

You will be really pissed off when you miss out on Grand Final tickets because some latte sipping theatre going corporate, goes to his or hers annual football match.[/quote]


I know what you mean. In 2003, I got freebie corporate tickets to the Brisbane v Collingwood Grand Final. And when I swanned into the 'G, I felt a bit bad that I was keeping a hardcore, lifelong, heart & soul pies supporter from attending the game live.

But halfway through the last quarter, when they were streaming out in their thousands, I figured I'd probably done them a favour.

you should be ashamed JohnM. You saved one of them from the humilation!

And see, how much better would it have been if you'd scalped it for a grand????

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Everything before the word "but" is horseshit - J Snow

Yeah. But I got to see collingwood utterly pantsed in a GF. Live. Rhyce Shaw pooped himself and fumbled right in front of me. I saw real, live tears stream from collingwood faces. All from the comfort of a corporate seat with free beer and party pies.

I reckon I got my thousand's worth

What about those long suffering Fitzroy supporters who had to wait...oh, that's right.

See that's the point though. Every organisation has a brand. You look at it in corporate terms, but a brand isn't a corporate entitiy. A brand rests and lives in the minds of people outisde the organisation, whatever that organisation is. An organisation may try (bloody hard) to influence the perception of their company, but ultimately, external perception of an organisation defines a brand and that isn't always contolled by the organisation. That holds true for Carlton, just like it holds true for the Fitzroy Reds in the ammos. So while I admire your sentiment, it's not a sound argument. You do support a brand, because you have a perception of Carlton and you associate with it.

bingo Punter 22

ditto punter.

BTW (as I alluded to elsewhere) BM doesn't have a problem associating himself with a brand that is responsible for more human misery and murder than all the American and multi-national corporations combined.

Ouch!


According to Glen Beck I am a Nazi as well as a Communist.

No wonder I get confused.

Oh and for the record, my political beliefs are Social Democrat, which is vastly different from Stalinism and Maoist thought.

And as for the capitalists not being as responsible for more misery than my 'brand' I am sure the third world would agree.



Not!

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A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty" -Winston Churchill

L.M 35-06

Nearly forgot to add

Flowering capitalists, everything is a commodity to be brought and sold, even the footy club you barrack for.

And the last post ceremony in Canberra


They have no shame.

_________________
A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty" -Winston Churchill

L.M 35-06

It's all just words anyway, of which everyone puts their own personal perspective to. At the end of the day we all have to take responsibility for what drives us to follow the Blues. Each to their own etc etc.

Beck is a goofball, why bring him up? Your avatar is the brand (with stylish blue instead of red) of the Soviet Union, responsible for the starvation and murder of 10s of millions of people at their own hands (outside of WW2) and promoted an ideology that killed millions more (Khmer rouge, Mao, etc).

I'm sure you're a nice warm-n-fuzzy leftie who wouldn't harm an organically grown lentil, but why do you wear the hammer and the sickle? Coz it's cute? Why would anyone, let alone a social democrat, associate themselves with a doctrine that is antithetical to the rights of humans?

Capitalism is the worst way to allocate resources in order to improve human life, except for all the other ones. ie - it's not perfect, but it's better than the alternatives.

P.S. social democrats are also capitalists whether they like it or not.

Umm I think we are off topic

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A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty" -Winston Churchill

L.M 35-06

I support a football club too.

Trouble is, if Carlton doesn't brand itself and position itself correctly - be that in pure marketing terms, or in footy department terms - we might not have a club, or brand, to support.

Club, brand, in the 21st century we can't have one without the other.

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