Cazzesman, I hope you're right. I can also see the potential, not only in Austin but others as well. I just hope that most of it gets realised.
However, as it stands now, the team is not in great form and is not playing like one of the best 8 teams in the comp AFAIC, regardless of its ladder position. I was certainly hoping to see a more consistent, higher level of play and output then what we are getting now. Let's see what we get this week against one of our nemisis

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C'mon Blueboys!

Again your are missing my point here. Im not gonna come out and say it but i think i've said enough

Amen to that brother Melvey

Regards Cazzesman

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Ricky Gervais - “Everyone has the right to hold whatever beliefs they want. And everyone else has the right to find those beliefs f***ing ridiculous.”

Excellent post Livolover, some posters get too carried away in speculation, innuendo and poorly based opinion (very little analysis) and it just becomes a slanging match of egos and one upmanship.

Whether it is in the best interests of Cazz to give out too much info or not - these types of questions to those with a more detailed understanding of the goings on within the club (and in areas of their expertise and experience) are very worthwhile.

There is a definite need to question the workings of the club and I think this is shown in the intense debate of Ratts and his worth, raised within the framework of questions like you have asked I think it can work.

Just frothing at the mouth and using blanket statements which are at best cheap shots and at worst outrageous manipulations of the truth are unhelpful. And yes Im talking about you Melvey, in particular.

The Freo game showed that Freo are crap and that Carlton have Chris Judd playing in the number 5 guernsey.

It showed very little else.

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They will know that they've been playing against the famous old dark blues

I think everyone is very understanding of the team being a work in progress - we're very young, and had a crap list so we needed to bring in young players and give them time to develop.

But most people I speak to are uncomfortable with the coach being a work in progress. And justifiably so.

We need the best coach available, not someone learning on the job. Then players who are justifiably a work in progress can learn how to play to in the best environment to the best possible structures.

That is the gripe that many of us have right now.

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They will know that they've been playing against the famous old dark blues

Yarran's progression has been slow and steady for a kid in his 1st 6 months of an AFL life. Big move from WA leaving behind some family and best mates. Big change in lifestyle and the move up to being a professional sports person as a 17yr old. New mind set is required to process all the information thrown at him. It's like being a 17 yr old starting a new job in a big office with a great deal of mental and physical demands to adjust to.

It's an interesting thing when you hear seasoned AFL players say they missed out on having a preseason due to off season surgery. Those players all talk about hard hard it is to play catch up football with their fitness base. As a result many struggle to have an impact even though they may have had 3 or 4 previous preseasons to fall back on.

Yarran had limited preseason and a limited training regime in 2008 due to injury. So when you understand a 17 yr old has had such a lack of preparation it is easier to understand why he has been slow to show his real potential. Rich has had virtually 2 full years playing in the WAFL, often as an onballer so he is physically fitter and physically more developed. People compare the 2 because they came in the same draft but realistically they are far apart preparation wise.

It's like parts of the media saying that Watts was a poor pick because he has done very little so far. those comments just make no sense. Lets wait 4 seasons and then judge them all after they have 50 games clocked up and are physically prepared to take on 22 games a year.

Skill and talent wise Yarran is easily the equal of Rich. Yarran is quicker, a better mark and far superior on his non dominant side.

Judge them all when they are on a level playing field. Supporters just have to let go of the need for 'Instant success, instant gratification' that they cling to.

I haven't gone to any training sessions this year post preseason.

Regards Cazzesman

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Ricky Gervais - “Everyone has the right to hold whatever beliefs they want. And everyone else has the right to find those beliefs f***ing ridiculous.”

thanks cazz.

that was exactly the answer I was hoping for.

re yarran, we just need to cross our fingers and be patient ....

This is a fair point and understandably should be be part of the discussion.

I believe that when the decision to appoint Ratts was made, it was understood that he lacked experience as did Voss and some other assistants who were named at the time (Bond comes to mind).

On the flip side we had just got rid of an experienced coach who had lost the players and in the mind of many members was not the right fit. It was deemed essential to get back 'the spirit of carlton' back and to promote the culture that we as a club had known.

Had we gone with the other hopefuls/options that were around then, we would still have had someone learning on the job, and also having to learn about the club. Ratts clearly was the most qualified of all the applicants in that area.

As for the players Carlton have now set up the player development academy which has Darren Harris at the helm, and I think it is obvious that we beginning to see the fruit of that.

And that gripe is what being a supporter is all about. Very few have a long term view of anything. All the Coaches in the AFL had to start somewhere and they all failed when they started. Every damn 1 of them. They were all a Work in Progress.

Did you hear Mathew Lloyd last night on OneHD suggesting that Sheedy was past it to some extent. He said Coaching was probably a young man's game for the most part. What makes Voss or Buckley or Hardwick any more of a chance to get it right than Ratts? What does Voss and Buckley have that Ratts doesn't have?

Regards Cazzesman

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Ricky Gervais - “Everyone has the right to hold whatever beliefs they want. And everyone else has the right to find those beliefs f***ing ridiculous.”

edit

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Cazzesman is in damage control.

My info does not come from within football admin or board members but like i said i think i've given away enough hints to suggest what the true feeling within the change rooms is

Your hints are become tiresome.

So please stop making comments about something you cannot post on this forum.

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“It is a state of mind, a system of belief, a way of seeing the world, a deep faith that, because you are Carlton, you belong to something great.” - Mike Fitzpatrick articulating what Out of the Blue means.

Yep I'm holding back the tide of damaged neurons.

Regards Cazzesman

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Ricky Gervais - “Everyone has the right to hold whatever beliefs they want. And everyone else has the right to find those beliefs f***ing ridiculous.”

Cazzesman thank you very much for all your feedback, it is much appreciated.

I suppose one of the underlying reasons I started this thread was due to the fact some other teams with less top picks (Essendon*, Adelaide) seem to be quite noticeably ahead of us. I know it's not all about high picks, but I think everyone agrees they are a factor.

While Ess are on the same number of wins, we can't hide from the fact they seem to have it all over us in on-one-one duels this year. And two of their top picks (Hurley, Gumby) haven't played in these games against us this year, which makes it all the more frightening.

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It's a small world, but I wouldn't want to paint it

Voss has Brittain sitting along side of him - and that is a big plus

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Unless this 'true feeling' is common to all those in the change rooms (whatever that means) it is once again a blanket staement! and it certainly qualifies as being innuendo, so give it a rest!

Sure there may be some ruffled feathers within the playing group, it is very normal.

On to matters of greater importance, thanks Cazzeman insight into Yarrans progress is appreciated.

We are a fair way behind both teams when it comes to an experienced core of players - partly due to drafting/trading before 2002 and partly due to the draft penalties.

The Essendon* team which beat the Swans on the weekend contained:

Stanton 23
Welsh 26
Winderlich 24
Lovett 26
Watson 24
Lucas 31
Lloyd 31
McPhee 26
Davey 25
Dyson 23
McVeigh 28
Slattery 23

So they have a core of Lloyd/Lucas/Fletcher/Watson/Welsh/McVeigh/Davey/Winderlich/Lovett who SHOULD be in their prime (besides the first 3) based on their age.

Majority of our teams who have played this year are still babies. Judd/Fevola/Thornton/Carrazzo(injured a lot of the year)/Simpson/Houlihan. Stevens and Scotland out of the team.

Everyone goes on about #1 picks but they are still extremely inexperienced. So is most of the team...compare that with the scum's core group still running around.

That's what cheating the cap and neglecting recruiting does along with poor management of the club.

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"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch

In regards to Adelaide, they are an example of a club who has drafted very well without top picks while already having a core of senior players. They have been able to prepare for the retirements of Mcleod/Goodwin/Edwards for 3-4 years. So they can gradually introduce the younger players like Vince, MacKay, Van Berlo. Also drafted very well in terms of KP forwards with Tippett and Walker. I posted in TalkingAFL some time ago that I think they could develop into a powerhouse because they have got depth in most areas and are well coached.

In that core is Mcleod/Thompson/Edwards/Goodwin/Bock/Rutten/Maric/Porplyzia/Stevens.

We haven't had this sort of core group for a long time...we have one now but it's very inexperienced and still has deficiencies (such as KP forwards)

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"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch