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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:34 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6406
BlueDave wrote:
Liked the player run down from WAG. Agreed with almost everything. Would probably not be quite so hard on Jacobs...he stood up when he got a chance earlier this year and may yet have something. Other than that, on the money. Good job.

+1


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:37 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

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Blue Vain wrote:
Insipid effort by about 8 players tonight. Blame the tactics as much as you lioke but our inability to win one on one contests was telling. That's got nothing to do with coaching, it's all about the players having a dip and showing pride in their performance.
Too many passengers.

Care to name them BV.
Stevo and Houla were the standouts for mine.

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:03 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Location: Romsey, Victoria
BrianSetzer1 wrote:
The way I was feeling last night I would have smashed him 4 you!

Pklz wrote:
Had to sit next to these !@#$%& old mental flower who refused to move his knee so we could walk past and he was sitting on the end of the aisle so it wasnt a hard thing to do...

He threatened to smash us :screwy: and said if my mates missus walked through again he'd hit her :eek: :fight:

Security didnt do much about it, they were good though. They knew we were just going about our business but thought itd be easier to move us instead of them...

Good news is I drank enough to not remember most of the game.

I had $50 on the Bombers to win...I dont even want to cash it. Dirty flower money :hitcomputer:

The worst thing was that they were @#$%&! Blues supporters :donk:


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:16 pm 
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Robert Walls
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walkers a gun wrote:
We are in serious trouble. Last night’s games showed me that things needed to change at the club, from the playing group, coach and match committee. Only a small number of players show pride in wearing the Carlton jumper, our coach is weak, reactive and easily bullied. Our coaching staff is full of underqualified coaches with no prior success, our recruitment department still haven’t figured out that football is becoming a fast man game, our players are slow, none of them apart from a handful are natural footballers with hand and foot skills and a real understanding of the game. Our list is 5 years away from any special and by then player like Judd and Fev might be gone. We had a chance to push for O’Keefe from the swans and instead we pushed for Warnock. We need another forward don’t we? We have the best future ruckman in the comp in Krooze so why would we chase another potential ruckman when there are other things we need? Stevo is gone, we had a chance to get a natural complete footballer in Rich and we got Yarran (we copied hawthorn with rioli). We could have had a midfield of JUDD, murf, gibbs and Rich, looks good doesn’t it. Team selection has been a problem all year and that also includes where the players line up. Here’s my take on our list and i put it to anyone to provide facts, proof or valid reason as to why I may be wrong on anything here.

1 Walker - has potential X – Factor, speed and grunt but has bad shoulders :clap:
2 Russell – don’t get me started :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
3 Murphy – STAR :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
4 Gibbs – not what I expected, slow, cheep kicks, not hard enough, goes missing
5 Judd - STAR :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
6 Simpson – Great value, hard runner, massive heart, good skills :clap: :clap:
7 Bentick – time to go, too slow, cant kick
8 Kreuzer - STAR, he really gets me excited :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
9 Johnson – this is a man who couldn’t get a game for Melbourne, need i say more
10 Hadley – the games has passed him, bad knees, way too slow
11 Warnock – Unknown
12 Robinson – Grunt, speed but lack awareness and foot skills
13 Yarran – skilful but lacks aggression, determination, motivation – not what you want from a pick 6 in a very strong draft but im happy to give him time.
14 Fisher – great mark but too slow, cant kick
15 Browne – good signs, strong body, reminds of Dean Rice
16 Grigg – tries hard, aggressive but too slow, poor skills
17O'hAilpin – has been poorly developed by the club, has been given a real chance. I like his aggression and his efforts.
18 Bower – coming along but needs tom work on his disposal and decision making
19 Betts – thanks god we have him, about F-ing time :clap: :clap: :clap:
20 O'Keeffe - Unknown
21 Austin – Im a big fan, runs hard, good closing speed, good size, good skills, cant wait to see him in 2 years time :clap: :clap: :clap:
22 Hampson – taken too long for my liking, great athlete but doesn’t seem comfortable with the footy or the game
23 Hartlett – injury prone, has got grunt, massive kick, might be too slow but should be given a chance
24 Stevens – Time to go, too fat, too slow, doesn’t offer anything to the team anymore, sets a bad example to our kids by the way he has prepared himself for football
25 Fevola – STAR and for those who put his efforts down don’t have a clue about football and can be put in the same category as Robert Walls who is Fevs biggest hater :clap: :clap:
26 Anderson – good speed, aggressive but hasn’t been given a chance, needs to work on skills
27 Armfield – great speed, very hard at it but one of the worst kicks in the game, bad decision maker also
28 Cloke – JOKE, too small for ruck and too slow for a forward, bloody useless
29 Scotland – very composed with the ball, good skills but has been played in the wrong position, should be up the ground or in the middle :clap:
30 Waite - STAR :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
31 Bannister – i like him but i think the game might be too fast for him
32 Thornton – underrated, he has been the sole defender in the worst team over the past 7 years, give him a break
33 Houlihan – time to go, in big games he get found out, the softest player we have ever had
34 Wiggins – so lucky he’s good mates with Ratts, i didn’t know the CFC was a charity
35 Tiller - UNKNWON
36 Pfeiffer – SEE YA LATER
37 Edwards – Should have gone last year
38 Garlett – I like him alot, cant wait for 10 more kgs
39 Jacobs – Taken to long to make it, couldn’t get a game in the past when we were screaming for a ruckman
40 Jamison – love him, i hope his shoulders hold up
41 Hill - UNKNOWN
42 Stanton - INKNOWN
44 Carrazzo – like him, ball magnet, used wrong all the time, should be a midfielder :clap: :clap:
45 Joseph – WOW, how good is he going? :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
46 Ellard - UNKNOWN
47 Bentley – A BLOODY JOKE, this seriously must have been a joke on us when we got him


Can someone please email this to the match committee????
Thank you!


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:17 pm 
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formerly BlueRob
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The problem is not the coach ... the main problem is we lack leg speed ...

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:43 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Effes wrote:
Punter22 wrote:
I am really surprised no one has brought up Armfield here. I'm sure he's a lovely bloke, but FFS, until he learns to dispose of the pill he shouldn't be playing.

Granted he does get his own ball, but he is possibly the most unbalanced player I have ever seen. Tima and again he rushes when he doesn't need to rush, he fresh airs kicks and constantly puts the other players around him to disadvantage by sub-par disposal. Not to mention how easily he loses his feet, gets turned around and is led to the ball by his opponent.

Running like a lunatic means nothing unless there's at least a minor level of skill and smarts behind it.

There's a difference between getting experience into players vs basic learning of the mental and physical skill set required to play AFL. In Armfield's case he needs the latter, and the place for that is the Bullants, not the seniors.


I very rarely get into a player like this, but right now he just isn't up to it. Hopefully one day he will be, but we still have a chance to make something of this year, and he costs us every time he's around the contest.


His first job was to stop Davey...he was ok in that regard but didn't blanket him.

When he gets the ball he looks like he will make a mistake with it. Doesn't seem to have any composure at all. Runs his arse off out of defence but then doesn't know what to do with it.

You just know he lacks the composure/football brain to make the right decision and/or dispose of it well.

He wasn't the reason we lost but can you see him improving his disposal or decision making?



He wasn't the reason for loss, and I don't want to overplay his importance, this is a just an observation made over time and today I'm an angry ant. :mad:

I'm not sure whether he can or can't develop to the level required, but for right now that must be found out in the Bullants. This team has a season to play for over the next couple of weeks and we can't afford the luxury of players that far behind the curve to be involved.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 11:18 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Either Dannyboy is on holidays or he has taken this loss pretty bad :cry:

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2009 11:42 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 7:13 pm
Posts: 21075
Location: Missing Kouta
Bluey44 wrote:
Can someone please email this to the match committee????
Thank you!

You should email that post to the club and post their reply to win the POW.

I'd trust the Visy Park groundsman to make better footy decisions than 95% of the members on this site.

What a crack up.
walkers a legend wrote:
12 Robinson – Grunt, speed but lack awareness and foot skills

Jobe Watson is a terrible kick of the footy...

I don't who you're watching, but Robinson can kick and has the self confidence/killer attitude that Russell lacks.

Potential gun.

I can see Robinson becoming a similar player to Welsh and moving into the middle after two to three pre-seasons.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:02 am 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Fri May 18, 2007 2:10 pm
Posts: 2868
Devastated. Insipid, slow, soft and reactionary. The players were just as bad!

I normally jaw off until the final siren no matter how bad it's been but tonight I had to sit there and cop it. I hate Essendon* and their supporters but we just embarassed ourselves. As a carlton supporter I deserved everything they gave me, which was heaps


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 2:08 am 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:50 pm
Posts: 2123
BlueRob wrote:
The problem is not the coach ... the main problem is we lack leg speed ...


I don't see how it can be that simple. Geelong and St Kilda are the top two teams and while neither are 'slow', neither are known for their leg speed. Essendon* are certainly 'faster' than both in terms of pure speed but these teams beat them every time (particularly Geelong).

I would, however, argue that we don't generate enough run when we have the ball. We are too stagnant too often. I'm not sure whether that's because we don't work hard enough or simply lack the players. Missing Walker hurts us in this regard but he won't solve the problem himself.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 3:43 am 
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Ken Hands

Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:10 am
Posts: 463
Location: WA
keogh wrote:
BlueDave wrote:
Liked the player run down from WAG. Agreed with almost everything. Would probably not be quite so hard on Jacobs...he stood up when he got a chance earlier this year and may yet have something. Other than that, on the money. Good job.

+1


+1 Agree a bit hard on Jacobs - otherwise pretty much exactly how I see the list. Good summary WAG.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 10:23 am 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:38 pm
Posts: 7640
A bit harsh on Gibbs only 20 - bit early to mark his card - hasnt been exceptional this year but still shows very good signs


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 10:33 am 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 12:06 pm
Posts: 939
Whilst others are applauding WAG's post..

walkers a gun wrote:
We are in serious trouble. Last night’s games showed me that things needed to change at the club, from the playing group, coach and match committee. Only a small number of players show pride in wearing the Carlton jumper, our coach is weak, reactive and easily bullied. Our coaching staff is full of underqualified coaches with no prior success, our recruitment department still haven’t figured out that football is becoming a fast man game, our players are slow, none of them apart from a handful are natural footballers with hand and foot skills and a real understanding of the game. Our list is 5 years away from any special and by then player like Judd and Fev might be gone. We had a chance to push for O’Keefe from the swans and instead we pushed for Warnock. We need another forward don’t we? We have the best future ruckman in the comp in Krooze so why would we chase another potential ruckman when there are other things we need? Stevo is gone, we had a chance to get a natural complete footballer in Rich and we got Yarran (we copied hawthorn with rioli). We could have had a midfield of JUDD, murf, gibbs and Rich, looks good doesn’t it.
[edit] Team selection has been a problem all year and that also includes where the players line up. Here’s my take on our list and i put it to anyone to provide facts, proof or valid reason as to why I may be wrong on anything here.


Geez just throw a blanket over all of the indigenous footballers WAG - after all they're all the same, huh.

One of the silliest things I've read on this site.


Last edited by Mrs Caz on Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
quoted edited to remove breach of rule 3.2


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 10:41 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Yeah Yarran should have won the game for us.

:lol:

Ok. i also think Rich would have been struggling playing for us also.
We are often all at sea.
No matter what kid it is.. if there is no gameplan... they shall struggle.

People cant tell me Rich is better than Gibbs.
But Gibbs is strugging currently under a sea of uncertainty in the pattern of play.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 10:43 am 
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Wayne Johnston
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frank dardew wrote:
A bit harsh on Gibbs only 20 - bit early to mark his card - hasnt been exceptional this year but still shows very good signs


Agree.

Still would like to see Gibbs as our rebounding defender.

Our main avenue from kickouts must be structured around getting the ball to Bryce around the defensive 50 and him spotting up others further afield...

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 10:52 am 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 12:06 pm
Posts: 939
Synbad wrote:
Yeah Yarran should have won the game for us.

:lol:

Ok. i also think Rich would have been struggling playing for us also.
We are often all at sea.
No matter what kid it is.. if there is no gameplan... they shall struggle.

People cant tell me Rich is better than Gibbs.
But Gibbs is strugging currently under a sea of uncertainty in the pattern of play.


Missed the point and by a fair margin, sailor man.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:05 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:26 pm
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Location: Parliament House, Canberra
walkers a gun wrote:
We could have had a midfield of JUDD, murf, gibbs and Rich, looks good doesn’t it. [edit]

1 Walker - has potential X – Factor, speed and grunt but has bad shoulders :clap:


You do realise that Walker has indigenous blood don't you? And that he was our first pick in 2003? Would you lump him into the that category? :roll:

I support anyone who wants to have a rant but when they are completely illogical and bordering on racist, then, in my mind that's unacceptable.

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Last edited by Mrs Caz on Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
quote edited to remove breach of rule 3.2


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 11:51 am 
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Trevor Keogh

Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2005 9:20 pm
Posts: 789
Location: Melbourne
Friday night was a disaster but I think we must all remember that we have come from a long way back and our recruiting department with the draft the way it is can't provide a full list of new players overnight. We still lack quite a few players and depth to cover injuries and so we have either recruited traded or retained some players on the list for specific roles.

By my calculations we are still 5 players short of having a good team and that is without depth. We could certainly use a couple of players with height pace and good skills down back who can open up the game and give our forwards the chance one out plus a contested marking CHF and HFF and another in and under onballer with pace to take the pressure off Judd. However as I posted last year I am still concerned with the fact that we are still getting beaten by the same teams using the same tactics and that is a MC and coach issue.

WAG,

I think you have a few assessments wrong.

Jacobs has been the best tap ruckmen at the club for some time however he needed to work on his fitness so he could cover the ground and his opponent in the AFL. IMO if fully fit he would be selected in front of Hampson and it was a shame he got injured.

Carrazzo is a ball magnet but pace and disposal are major issues. When kicking his passes seem to be slow and high. IMO his best spot is at the bottom of the pack in the centre feeding out a handpass but he gets exposed against players with more pace. As we gradually get a stronger list he may struggle to find a position in the team.

Gibbs is going to be a star. Makes good decisions, has good skills and pace and IMO is still another pre-season away from his best.

Grigg is coming back from injury but has pace height and good skills.

Bentick has been working on his pace and injury has denied us the chance to see if he has improved. We are desperately looking for another in and under onballer with a strong body to take the pressure off Judd. Hadley Bentick Carrazzo Pfeiffer have all been tried with Bentick the most successful.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 12:02 pm 
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Wayne Johnston
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Carrazzo has to go back into an offensive midfield role to assist Judd.

Gibbs rebounding off half back.

Ando to come in with a 'run with and run off' role. He'll have a crack.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2009 2:40 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25192
Location: Bondi Beach
MIL wrote:
The Hoff wrote:
They don't know what to do: whether to play on a man or guard a divot.
Some sort of action is required.


Ratts presser said it all. "Some of our defenders will learn from that........when to attack and when to stay on their man". Learning from a young Bummers team FFS !!!

Also said, we were slow to move the ball and "I suppose Garlett could have helped there, but Fisher did a really good job and was one of our best......."

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:


Well @#$%&! me swinging.

I agree they should know by now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Get LAIDLEY on board to guide the MC

We need someone who lnows something about the modern game.

Also, while they're at it...lets get someone in from Geelong like St Kilda did.

Lets get the best avaiable...with balls to make the hard calls.

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