Think a lot of us, me included have been sucked in to a degree by the classic pre-season form guide.

We have been woeful the past fortnight.

Today, as was the case last week, we really only 1 player who was clearly a true winner for his team. This week it was Waite and last week it was Judd. Nobody else today could genuinely say they comprehensively won their own battle for their team. Not even Judd, as Mcveigh's 3 goals were crucial esp the 2 before half time which really blew the game open a bit for Sydney.

I think our team has been exposed for being a lot more average than we thought. Avg players can look good in the summertime.

How poor has Hadley been the past 2 games? He has hardly fired a shot.

Simpson can't kick, esp for goal.

Russell continues to start OK then fade badly as the game wears on. He's in his 5th year now, so you can't use the 'he's just a kid' excuse anymore on him.

Cloke - slow and average.

Bower - after 4 pre-seasons still doesn't have the body to even remotely compete against the true KPP forwards.

Houlihan - up until this week has provided value mainly for being a great set shot from tight angles, but that's about it really, did you see the bit today against Sydney where when the ball hit the deck near our goal the lack of leg speed of Cloke and Houlihan was plain to see and just not good enough for the modern game.

Thornton - he's OK at taking uncontested marks down back, but outside of that he lacks urgency when he gets it and in recent weeks has become a turnover merchant.

Johnston - just not up to it, for a supposedly great kick he has had crucial (and inexplicable) turnovers the past fortnight. Just not a genuine, hard, true defender, and from what I saw today doesn't chase hard enough.

What else have we got? Stevens, being played out of position by Ratten and is 29 now.

Ditto Scotland while he's a good solid player is 28 so time is ticking

Carrazzo - ball magnet but can't kick and looks like that won't change

No point talking about the kids for obvious reason. But in saying that I personally think some of them look like battlers and nothing more. Sure hope they got the Yarran pick right, cause rich looked a million bucks last night.

Class is required to go all the way, and right now I reckon a lot of our list is merely average. And if you don't believe me, then I suggest you point out the clear winners we have had the past 2 weeks. There's been 1 in each game, IMO. Our summer form seems like a long time ago now. Have we really gone forwards? The reality that every AFL skipper picked us to make the 8 is looking decidedly dodgy at the moment. There was a patch today when we really started to look like the Carlton of recent old. We looked like a rabble, like we'd caved in. Warning signs are ringing folks. Next up we have Dogs and Hawks.

Time to wield the axe and see what some of the others have to offer. Let's see what Setanta can offer. It'll be his last chance surely. And bring in Austin as soon a possible. If the backline is loaded up, then play him forward. Everyone says he could be a forward one day, so let's see what he has to offer. And why not give Yarran a run? They gave Garlett a go. Sure, his form was better thn Yaran's, but Yarran has shown a bit lately and the MC inexplicably gave Garlett one too many weeks in the Ones (just like they did Robinson). Yes, the MC need to take some of the heat for the last 2 weeks also. Robinson has gotten quieter as the weeks have past, surely Scotland ould have been better suited to today's game than Robinson?

_________________
It's a small world, but I wouldn't want to paint it

This from the poster who reckoned Murphy was overrated after the 2007 Best and Fairest count.

I like your style.

robinson has been one of our hardest at the contest early in the season - i say that may have worked in his favour for selection this week

i dont expect him to play next week

_________________
*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

Depends how highly we were rated.

Dont think its as bad as you say. We need to get value for our efforts or we lose our way. No reason for us not being 5 goals up at quarter time. If fev had of nailed his chances then he would have been a different player for the rest of the game.

Still, we need to mature and improve to make our way up the ladder.

A little bit overrated. We're certainly top 8 talent-wise though.

2 bad losses in a row to inferior, but smarter, better drilled teams.

From what I've seen of the last two weeks, Brett Ratten is overrated!!!!!! (and btw, I love the guy) but you call a spade a spade.
His selections cost us the game against ess.,players have lost all confidence and his absurd gameplan for the SCG has me asking some serious questions.
P.S Stevo is a softcock

_________________
If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you!

Before the season started most people rated Carlton as a finals side in 2009.

There are another 18 weeks left to determine whether that rating was overs or unders.

_________________
|♥♥♥♥♥♥| http://www.blueseum.org |♥♥♥♥♥♥|

This is a typical over reaction. I am very frustrated - but this is as usual complete

Football games are nowadays decided by marginal factors. I am quite sure that if Jamo was playing and Fev fully fit, things would already look far better. The MC also made some big mistakes at the selection table the last couple of weeks and the tactics today were not working - or better they did not work after the first qtr. - I am sure the guys idid not follow instructions and dropped the bundle because of the demoralising lack of scoreboard pressure. Does not mean the whole team is crap.

I am quite sure the team will improve during the season as it did last year (injuries aside). However we dropping the last 2 games hurt our ambitions to play finals.

_________________
TC suffers from the social media illness - the death of respect and constructive discourse by keyboard.

I love Ratts but +1.

_________________
You want the flame? Give us the marbles!!

I don't agree with this at all. It's not as though we've been done by top quality opposition here. We've been done by a depleted bottom 4 side and now a depleted side on the downward slide (who have been playing shithouse so far, mind you), two teams that shouldn't have posed any problems for us if we were fair dinkum about finals. I think it's fair to expect a bit more than what we've been dished up.

_________________
WADA medical director Dr Alan Vernec describes Essendon* FC drug case as biggest scandal in team sport the world of sport has seen. #WC2WB

#GUILTY

+1

dont know about players losing confidence, but his gameplane is questionable.

This is unfair. It worked a treat in the first qtr - his tactics do not control that we can not kick straight. The players clearly lost the bundle and stopped doing what they did in the first qtr.

I am not blaming Ratts for that. I am however critical of our selections.



Well they beat Hawthorn in Sydney...... so this is a bit of a statement isn't it? They have played OK at home, shithouse away.

_________________
TC suffers from the social media illness - the death of respect and constructive discourse by keyboard.

Not anymore we aren't

Flowering pathetic, the Swans are a slow side however they dictated the terms, we were forced wide and forced to hold the ball.

We all knew how they were going to play but did we try to move the ball quickly? NO Did we use the middle NO

Setanta must play next week, he couldn't do any worse than Cloke

Am I the only one that sees Waite turn it over so much, so many on here praise him but I close me eyes when he gets the ball.

What are they doing with Stevens playing behind the ball in defence. In the last quater he played in the centre and actually started to do what he does best and get clearances.

Many are playing like millionaires, talk about getting ahead of themselves.

We are better than Essendon* and the Swans however we lost because we were outcoached and paid for team selection.

We have not achieved anything and players need to know that no one played is guaranteed a game and by making minimal changes we have created egos.

And finally Murphy was very slack in his effor in the third quater to allow Bird to run around him and kick the goal. Luv you Murh but you need to run just as hard the other way.

'WE'VE PROVED NOTHING'

Richmond made us look like a bunch of superstars.

The lions had a poor 10 minutes that cost them the game.

Essendon* pull our pants down.

And Paul Roos should be coaching Carlton.

..a seriously shocking display.. ..our usually good ball users were way down on their efficiency, even with decent numbers.. ..Betts being the only multiple goal kicker is an indictment.. ..and that's no disrespect to Bettsy btw.. ..not enough gut running, tackling pressure was weak.. ..just a shizen performance..

_________________
..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Whenever anyone says we lost to a bottom 4 side, you really are only basing that on your own estimation.

Sydney were not bottom four last year, so don't assume that we lost to an inferior team because we didn't.

_________________
“It is a state of mind, a system of belief, a way of seeing the world, a deep faith that, because you are Carlton, you belong to something great.” - Mike Fitzpatrick articulating what Out of the Blue means.

They'll win most games in Sydney, lose most away. Middle of the road team.

I meant Essenscum

_________________
WADA medical director Dr Alan Vernec describes Essendon* FC drug case as biggest scandal in team sport the world of sport has seen. #WC2WB

#GUILTY

yep!
our best chance to beat the swans and what the F!!!!!!!!!!!!
need at least two more key defenders and one more key forward.
week in week out its always up to the mids, judd, murphy, gibbs and stevens, time for russell, bower, houilhan, simpson, cloke, thornton and wiggins to put there hand up!!!!!
bower has no body strenght and cant play key back.
cloke is far to slow.
houilhan is far to slow/soft.
russell must learn to tackle and place his head over the ball.
robinson/joesph/jacobs time for a spell only because they can play.
dont know who is our goal kicking coach but F!!!!!!!!!!!!! we cant put teams away early, same thing happened last week with the scum.
i hope we go after a key defender with our first pick come this draft!
austin must come in along with yarran.