We are coming! Why, how does our list really rate? Not easy and for me it shows that whilst we have potential or depth isn't as good as a lot of people think and a few injuries this year could have us in trouble. To me it falls away quickly.

Put your list down in best to last as they stand now.


1. Judd
2. Fevola
3. Gibbs
4. Waite
5. Walker
6. Murphy
7. Kruezer
8. Stevens
9. Simpson
10. Houlihan
11. Jamison
12. Thornton
13. Grigg
14. Bower
15. Carrazzo
16. Scotland
17. Hadley
18. Betts
19. Armfield
20. Cloke
21. Bentick
22. Robinson
23. Russell
24. Wiggins
25. Browne
26. Pfieffer
27. Johnson
28. Anderson
29. Warnock
30. Hampson
31. Austin
32. O'Hailpin
33. Yarran
34. Garlett
35. Bentley
36. Bannister
37. Jacobs
38. Fisher
39. Hartlett
40. Joseph
41. Edwards
42. Ellard
43. O’Keeffe
44. Stanton
45. Tiller
46. Hill

there's no i in team

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

hehe.

Ok, its easy to poke fun at these things, and well done at having a go at rating them from 1-46.

Seriously though, I know you've been going back and forth with BV today over Fisher, but you can't really believe he's the 39th best player on our list.

_________________
"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Yes I do. As it stands today thats where I rate him. Simple.

Simple and clearly wrong.

I hope you're just trying to make a point rather than being serious.

_________________
"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Given there are two Benticks in the list ahead of Fisher, then Fisher is actually rated 38th.

If someone in our leadership group is the 38th best player on our list we are still, and always will be, a RABBLE!

Not at all, thats my opinion and I am not scared to express it. Who says yours is better? This site is all about opinion.

Instead of just criticising have a go yourself.

Yes that he is wrong.





There is informed opinion and there is opinion where you start to doubt yourself but you have openly committed yourself so you blow it right out of proportions almost as if to convince yourself agian and get rid of all doubt, having Fish at 39 is just that. It's totally silly.

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The problem will be made. for the solution to be sold, to your face before your eyes, tolerance is now the new danger

I've already congratulated you on having a go at it and I woudn't change much at all apart from Fish. I'd put Fisher at about 20 and have Murphy at 4 or 5

_________________
"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Define "informed opinion"?

Once again, happy to criticise but not to stick your neck out. You also seem to have focused on one thing. Surely there is more to the list than that?

The point of the list was to show the vulnerability of our list and the percieved depth is maybe a bit premature. IMO at the moment we have potential but not quite the depth.

As for the Fisher position lets just say time will tell! Maybe I could of had him a few places higher but it wouldn't be by much. If you think he should be higher, where then and above who? Some of you guys are happy to criticise but won't back it up or stick your neck out with your rating.

IMO and as I have said before he is not up to the modern game.

25. Browne
26. Pfieffer
27. Johnson
28. Anderson
29. Warnock
30. Hampson
31. Austin
32. O'Hailpin
33. Yarran
34. Garlett
35. Bentley
36. Bannister
37. Jacobs

Be interesting to hear how each of the above are better than Fisher, especially the guys on the rookie list.

Made some changes cj as I think your list seems to be more about potential/possibilities rather than actual performance week to week.

I dropped Walker as he hasn't had the chance to perform consistently. Simmo IMHO is a lot higher on the list than given credit as is Scotland.

I brought Cloke up a few notches as I think he peformed well at the end of last year when moved forward and also so far in the NAB. I dropped Hadley as he promises a lot but has yet to deliver.

I bought Banno and Fisher up several notches as I think pre injury Banno showed consistency and good form in games and was really missed last year. Some people consider Fisher to be a one trick pony but if all of our players could mark the ball as well as he does, then I'd be happy. There has got to be a place in a team for a guy that can pluck the ball they way that he does.

1. Judd
2. Fevola
3. Gibbs
4. Murphy
5. Waite
6. Simpson
7. Kruezer
8. Stevens
9. Walker
10. Houlihan
11. Jamison
12. Thornton
13. Grigg
14. Scotland
15. Carrazzo
16. Bower
17. Cloke
18. Betts
19. Armfield
20. Hadley
21. Bentick
22. Robinson
23. Russell
24. Wiggins
25. Browne
26. Bannister
27. Johnson
28. Fisher
29. Warnock
30. Hampson
31. Austin
32. O'Hailpin
33. Yarran
34. Garlett
35. Anderson
36. Pfieffer
37. Jacobs
38. Bentley
39. Hartlett
40. Joseph
41. Edwards
42. Ellard
43. O’Keeffe
44. Stanton
45. Tiller
46. Hill

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“It is a state of mind, a system of belief, a way of seeing the world, a deep faith that, because you are Carlton, you belong to something great.” - Mike Fitzpatrick articulating what Out of the Blue means.

i'll have a crack and i wont rank the rookies or new guys, still way to early to tell.
ranked on 'best' as in the current worth/output given to the club when on the pitch, obviosuly the guys who are regularly injured fall down the list a bit.

1. Judd
2. Fevola
3. Gibbs
4. Murphy
5. Waite
6. Simpson
7. Jamison
8. Betts
9. Houlihan
10. Scotland
11. Stevens
12. Thornton
13. Walker
14. Kruezer
15. Carrazzo
16. Grigg
17. Bower
18. Cloke
19. Wiggins
20. Armfield
21. Bentick
22. Fisher
23. Hadley
24. Warnock
25. Johnson
26. Browne
27. Hampson
28. Russell
29. Anderson
30. Bannister
31. O'Hailpin
32. Austin
33. Hartlett
36. Edwards

and the rest
Yarran
Robinson
O’Keeffe
Tiller
Jacobs
Garlett
Pfieffer
Bentley
Joseph
Ellard
Stanton
Hill

I don't mind giving it a go.

1. Judd
2. Fevola
3. Gibbs
4. Simpson
5. Murphy
6. Stevens
7. Waite
8. Jamison
9. Kreuzer
10. Walker
11. Grigg
12. Bower
13. Hadley
14. Houlihan
15. Thornton
16. Scotland
17. Betts
18. Carazzo
19. Browne
20. Cloke
21. Russell
22. Armfield
23. Wiggins
24. Robinson
25. Bentick
26. Fisher
27. Johnson
28. Anderson
29. Jacobs
30. Hampson
31. Warnock
32. Bannister
33. Austin
34. Garlett
35. Pfeiffer
36. Yarran
37. Oh’Ailpin
38. Joseph
39. Hartlett
40. Bentley
41. Edwards
42. Ellard
43. O’Keeffe
44. Stanton
45. Tiller
46. Hill

Ideally Yarran, Robinson and one or two of the ruckmen push into the top 22 to take the places of Carazzo, Scotland, Cloke and Thornton as we move forward. I give Stevens another 2 years, 3 at a stretch.

Don't think it will be too hard a task to delete 3 at seasons end as I think we have about 6 of Garry Lyons' list-cloggers.

Anyhow thats my thinking....feel free to tear it to shreds

actually if our leadership depth fell that far, we'd be flower awesome!

True.

Or we'd be St Kilda.

i've had this idea in my head that maybe guys like carrazzo, houla (but in a good team he would be very valuable), fisher, hampson and bentick could potentially be involved in a deal with GC17 to try and swindle them out of some highish draft picks.

i reckon we could make a fair go and covering these guys, although houla and hampson have the most appeal, but a top 10 pick wont come cheap or easy.

would be an ideal time to get another couple of first rounder somehow.

slightly off topic.

while i think fish is a bit better than 39 i honestly see his carrer in the cross roads. could see him in a cheap deal going to someone like richmond or freo. apparently he was very nearly sent to st kilda last year. they love their fishers it seems.

interesting debate.

Well, can i inform you that Fisher took the most marks for us last year at the highest level. He kicked 35 goals, equal second with Betts.

Can I also inform you that Robinson is yet to play a game in the season proper, Ditto to Yarran & Garlett . Warnock is yet to Don the Navy Blue at all, Hampson has never dominated an AFL game joined by Austin and O'Hailpin. And yet you have these players ahead of Fisher when 'rating our current list'.

I know what you are on about I do believe he has agility issues but he does not and never will belong at 39th on that list today regardless of how you invisage his future.

_________________
The problem will be made. for the solution to be sold, to your face before your eyes, tolerance is now the new danger

I can't recall Fisher ever dominating a game either.... for a marking forward, I would define 'dominating' as (among other things) most goals for the match.

As it currently stands, and I think that is the crucial caveat, the following factors are against Fisher:

1. He struggles to kick 40m let alone 50m. Thus he will be up against it to warrant selection for roles that are played mostly across half forward.
2. He's not a great kick.... Good, but not great. The 'rolling zones' render his lead-up (Tarrant, Riewoldt, etc) abilities useless.
3. He's not quick... Good motor, but no speed. Again, a zone across half forward does him no favours.
4. His strength has always been his ability to mark overhead. He might have a place in the square, but we've got better for that job.

Don't get me wrong, i'm a fan of his, but the reality is that Fisher is more or less a list clogger.... The "more or less" part is that unless you're handed a monster like Tommahawk, it takes a while for strong marking forwards - especially ones with a bit of nouse - to develop. So, while he might be seen as a list clogger, he is a bloke you can turn to when you need a job done.

He is a goal-a-game player. If you need more than that, or you think you can do without that one goal, then pick someone else.

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"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter" - Winston Churchill.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion of course .

But the proverb about brains and statues comes to mind here !

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Get the facts first.
Then you can distort them at your leisure.