Yep last years draft when I was complaining on not drafting any potential forwards to groom, I was criticised saying we have enough forwards. We have no-one. If Fevola doesn't give a shit which he doesnt at the moment, then we have no-one.

I think waite is doing an excellent job down back, but I think he would be more damaging forward.

Our recruiting needs a lot to answer for. Yep I am taking a swipe, I have the guts to................ We did not even go after any forwards or backs in the rookie draft, which I think is what the rookie draft is for....... By all reports Joseph who reportedly bad skills is not doing much and Hill who also has bad skills is not doing much either. Yes it is very early still but for goodness sakes, we dont need anymore players with poor skill..... I think if you have bad skills you will always have them......

send waite to CHF.
give bower waite's position at CHB.

i would rather waite be damaging up forward, then restrict good players and not do anything else down back.

look how easy this is, i should be coach of carlton.

I doubt this "bombing the ball long to our forwards" will changed, Ratten likes it this way.
So we should bring in Kruzer to play full foward, or even hAackland in the forward so they can take big overhead marks. Together with Betts staying inside the 50m at all times.
Seriously this long kick to the contest is killing us.

Erm, no. It's the exact opposite. He wants the boys to learn how to slow the game down and find a target. The problem is the execution, as the boys are so indecisive that before you know it, the flood is on.

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..i reckon there's 3 big marking types that can play CHF..yer got Waite that's naturally suited to it, but he's meant to be the CHB solution..and by doing that he makes our CHF problem.. ..so, if he stays back, then it's out of either Cloke(our ruck), or the big Setant.. ..supposedly neither cloke nor setant have the footysmarts to be CHF.. ..well, get the smarty footballer back at the club for specialist forward training.. ..cloke and setant have something which is crucial for chf and cant be trained, and thats heart.. ..both will run and crash all day long.. ..as an outside the box kinda idea, i'd play walker as a lead up high marking chf and just let him off the leash..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

The only time we look good is when we play on quickly, and can kick it to fwds who are either one out or free. When our two best on ballers are 70% fit (Judd and Stevens) we can't play that game effectively. The fit guys can't kick (Carrots etc), and the turnovers kill us.

Playing the stop and prop possession game is pure crap. Look at the good sides, Hawks, Geelong, Collingwood......geez no careful builds up there, just lighting quick transfer of the footy. Until we're fit/good enough to run the lines, we'll be hammered.

We need someone at CHF to straighten us up, that much is clear. Whether that is Hartlett or Cloke I'm not sure. I actually thought Cloke might have had his best game for Carlton last night as a ruckman but he is worth a shot as CHF due to his size and long kick. Kreuzer of course is another possibility but we can't expect too much from him at this stage. Hartlett's suspension was untimely but he is another one who needs to be given a chance as it is clear that we need another target when we go forward.

We also need Eddie or somebody else to play as a stay-at-home crumber. I also thought Eddie did reasonably well last night playing as a lead-up small forward as he got himself into the game a bit more which is an area of his game of which I have been critical of in the past. However the problem with Eddie pushing too far up the ground is that if he is the one kicking the ball into our forward-50 then logically he isn't going to arrive in time to the contest/player to which he has kicked should the ball spill to ground. So we need somebody else to get to the contests and swoop on the ball that comes to ground if Eddie is up the ground.

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Formerly Blues-Back2003.

Carlton is well drilled at taking possession of the ball, slowing it down (watch the players signal to each other to slow it down) then the chipping it around begins. The opposition floods back. The players get sick of chipping it around and bomb it to Fev and Fisher who are always outnumbered.

Ratten has got this tactic all down and the players are very disciplined.

The sides who are now playing quick transitional play, are those teams who has redifined the way they play.

One example is Hawthorn. Criticised early for over possesing the ball, and at times refered to as an ugly team to watch. Over the course of the last two years, Hawthorn as increased its ability to maintain the football whilst moving it very quickly to its forward line.

Hawthorn now dictate the terms on which the game is played. They are confident (skill wise) to control the ball, and at times arrogant in the manner they press forward.

The times Hawthorn cannot dictate these terms are when they are hard pressed by sides like Sydney (refering to game at MCG late '07). Sydney placed great pressure on the ball carrier, and the perepheral players looking for the "give it to me possession". Subsequently the ball carrier is forced to kick, when they would prefer not to.

I am hopeful that Carlton, will pass this phase, sooner than later, and finally be able to dictate our game plan.

PS: Like Cam Clokes previous games, do agree with suggestions to push him to CHF, maybe once we introduce another ruckman.

Good post. This is why I think Ratts' gameplan needs to be developed more and perservered with. The problem is the fitness, skills, confidence and commitment (or lack thereof) of those executing it.

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This is why I think Ratts' gameplan needs to be developed more and perservered with. The problem is the fitness, skills, confidence and commitment (or lack thereof) of those executing it.[/quote]

Just watched a bit of Scum v Cats. Boths sides played on at all times, and the game is a million miles quicker than the crap I watched last night. I'd rather us try and execute a play on game style and fail, than muck around gathering possies then bombing to Fev for it to be swept away. The pin point possession style game is just too stagnant and easy to defend against for mine.

Again, it's the execution. Ratts' gameplan isn't to chip the ball around all day, it's to make better decisions and kick the ball to a free player. It's the players that are turning that into a chip-chip plan, as they're all stagnate and unsure of themselves.

The whole 'play on at all costs' plan is what we had under Pagan, and look where we ended up with that. Ratts wants the players to make better decisions, and you can't suddenly make good decisions at 100% speed when your skills aren't up to it. You have to be able to hit a player on the chest off a step before you can do it running at full speed, otherwise you'll just see the ball fly over our heads like last year. It's the players who are the problem, not the gameplan.

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We need to get Judd involved more!! I'm not sure if his still adapting to the team, or whether he could play in a better position?? But he is a match winner and needs to get more of the ball! His average over his career is a goal a game. His played two games for us and hasnt really come close to scoring. We need to use him more effectively!!

Centre Half Ruck Rover Back Wing.............!


kindest regards tommi

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that'siti'mnotchangingthistagain......!

I have no idea why our forwards always line up in a straight line between the goals in the F50. It means that all the space is near the boundary and consequently that's where our forwards lead. The ball is then either delivered to the leading player on the boundary line where they have a difficult shot at goal or kicked to the hotspot where all the defenders have been able to zone off their man. It happens every time. I don't understand it.
Our forwards are just never in the right spot.
Then we don't utilise our mismatches properly. Hampson had 10cm on Raph Clarke but we don't isolate him and kick it in the air. What's the point in having such a mismatch if you don't use it?
Our forward line is actually worse than our backline now. Hopefully they'll work something out soon.

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Don't blame it on the sunshine, don't blame it on the moonlight, don't blame it on the good times, blame it on the WIGGINS!

Foward structure is a bit frustrating for me atm, so forgive my indulgence. I may be right or I may be wrong, but it's hopw I see it.

Unfortunately. I watched the game on TV, so you can understand how much is missed from that one dimensional perspective.

Firstly, I thought the backline held up well. We have height and athleticism there. There's no doubt in my mind that Waite was the standout player and athlete on the field, but the others, in particular Bower backed themselves as I know Setanta and Thornton can if told to do so.

The midfield were somewhat unaccountable, or couldn't run with the Saints midfielders as the game wore on. Is that something to do with fitness? If so, fix it. Put players in there who are accountable and match fit. It's the midfield that determines how much supply our backs get but also our forwards ...usually...but

It seems to me that the Saints started most of their forward thrusts from their backline. They were in flooded mode at times and ran out in numbers, or when it was 3 to 1 they still ran it out in numbers.

So where were the forwards? They were flooding the corridor and the midfield whilst the midfielders tried to flood the backline (except when Saints moved the ball quickly from the midifield having beaten our midfielders to the hard ball, hence avoided a Blues flood). The forwards were bloody supporting the 'underdone' midfielders or it's Ratts' instructions (???). I think they're related.

So who does one kick to if the forwards are flooding in the midfield and there's no one forward except Fev (albeit 2 kicks away from the play) when we go forward? Right no one but Fev at FF (80 metres away).

So for those at the game I ask was there a structure or was it as it seemed to me on TV, open forwardline with only Fev when the ball wasn't in our hands (ie when the Saints weren't in flood mode)?

It's on the scoreboard we could have retained some pressure throughout the match. We had the same number of forward entries only to see Casper out there. So what do we do in no man's land? Waste oportunity, that's what!!

The only thing I could think of is to have positioned potentially dangerous forwards that could do 2 jobs. Win the ball in the forwardline and score goals (scoreboard pressure) which in turn creates a sense of urgency for the opposition to man up their own man rather than having 3 against Fev (spreads the load of defenders) to open up space.

There should be 6 forwards with HFF linking in the middle or with the middle. There must be at least 3 or 4 options to kick to that are true dangerous forwards. (See all other teams' forward options/structure).

So who have we got? It's obvious to me...it's Waite with Fish and Fev. There's a FF (Fev), a very athletic freak HFF and good mark (Waite) and a good marking FP (Fisher) to give us a 2 prong marking attack in front and another one at HF line. Put a taller option like Hartlett, Cloke or Kreuzer at CHF to straighten us up and then we start to look dangerous.

So who is our crumber and other HF? Betts was competitive last night (so he's in my good books atm), but I would say atm it has to be a Judd and Stevens till they get themselves fit enough for a permanent midfield role, with a Houlihan (187cm) as a defensive HF. Betts (if in the team) can come in for bursts whilst on...busting a gut as a crumber (or even Scotland).



We have options forward, dangerous ones if we chose the right men with the right stuff to hold those positions... and have them present their instead of being part of the flood.

Getting fit midfielders in the middle is important. Add Bentick and Pfieffer to the guts, with good fit players with good disposal such as Murphs Gibbs Simmo. Someone has to tell the classy Gibbs to put his head over the ball, and even Scotalnd in the middle (if Scotland has lost his accuracy by foot get him out of there, hence why Carrots in the BP).

Further help can come in short spells from Judd/ Stevens as support (till they're fit enough for the job). Hadley??? I don't know what to make of him. ATM I've got him in the same boat as Russell, Bannister, Wiggins....hard bodies but don't get the nut enough.

It's Simple. We need fit guys who will move the ball quickly like we were doing during the preseason when Judd wasn't playing. What happened to that game plan?

What about the problem of moving Waite and leaving a hole down back. @#$%&! it. The defense will look after itself with Jamo, Setanta, Bower and Thornton. I have a lot of faith in Bower.

The point is we can't win games if we don't hurt the opposition on the scoreboard. Give us a chance to win on the scoreboard FFS.

HF: Waite Hartlett/ Cloke Judd/ Stevens
F: Houlihan Fevola Fisher

200cm Rucks can be a 3 way rotation from bench to forward with Hampson, Kreuzer and Aisake if Waite takes CHF and Fisher takes HFF.

Over the duration of the 100 minutes, we got killed in the ruck last night. King and Gardiner were allowed to look good by tapping the ball in the right spots for their midfielders to take away at will. It killed us. That's why we may need 3 ruckmen rotating...to ensure ours are fresh throughout the game...putting big man pressure on for 100 minutes.

Lets get dangerous.
Lets live dangerously.
Lets back fit men not half baked personnel. (That doesn't do anyone any favours).
Lets move the ball quicker to an attack that is there to attack.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Count the opposition players in our forward line.
This strategy is used to negate the use of spare defenders. It creates space for our forwards to run in to and takes away the opportunity for spare men to zone off and block space effectively.

Its all part of the learning curve. Good teams can do it effectively and ours will too. All this stuff takes time.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

I like this call anfield. Cloke will give us a target to kick to and give us a contest, then Hammer can do bulk of the ruck work with help from Kruezer or Ackland

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Blue boy thru and thru

Too Slow. They will put a Kane Cornes/ Scarlett type on him every week and he will be exposed. Waite is your answer.

Rather than focussing on the big guys, I rthink we should consider rotating some of our midfielders through the forward line rather then benching them..worked well for the Kangas yesterday and the crows. Would add some skill and hopefully forward line pressure which we severely lack