i thought we are over the past and not looking back.

any negativity is not wanted, and to be honest it just shows the weak mental attitude our leaders have and demonstrates why we are in the position we in.

no matter who the coach is there should be a form of respect, to have leaders of the club soaking sets a bad example, a cancer that takes over the club.

why doesnt anyone question kouta and the multi million dollar deal he signed and delivered 2 good years.

Kouta dont be talking about performance mate, move on, you have forged a new career in the performing arts much suited to your personaility

Hollow victories, win 4 games, here's a cup!!!!!!!

I think Kouta is right to say it, it is only confirming what everyone knows or were guessing at anyway.

And I would love to see him back at the club, i believe he was a great help with the younger guys with loads of time a patience, while others like Lance swanned around pleasing himself and doing nothing to pass on his experience

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'Cause I'm J.U.D.D
I'm dynamite
J.U.D.D
And I'll win that fight
J.U.D.D
I'm a power load
J.U.D.D, Watch me explode

Agreed- The Pagan era is over and this shouldn't have been brought up. Pagan took his sacking on the chin and didn't complain about anything... but he might now.

Malouf on SEN...

- He confirmed players, led by Kouta, called meeting seeking a number of things, coaches, assistant coaches, training etc
- A bit apprehensive going in to meeting
- Players weren't supportive of Pagan's methods, Kouta's view in article is accurate
- Malouf says Pagan positively dealt with media and marketing the club
- With sanctions, maybe Denis did as good as he could
- This story, like most others were, wasn't leaked to media, and Denis wasn't told about the meeting
- Smorgo, Malouf and Sticks pointed out they were prepared to listen to players, but the board appoints the coach
- Did not want to comment on any subsequent meetings on discussions with Denis
- Meeting took place on Smorgo's boat in order to keep meeting confidential
- Denis expressed frustrations that the job he took on was not what he expected, eg draft sanctions, no support from other quarters (not sure what he meant by that last bit)
- Club was dislocated and unhappy, a lot of problems
- Meetings such as this are not uncommon at all footy clubs, necessary to listen to players, then weigh up against all other issues

Cut off for the 8:30 news...

(Malouf is now at Barwon Water, and recently he and his wife had a baby.)

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I suspect a condition of the $600K he will receive for doing sweat FA enxt year is that he not disparage the Club.

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Those of you who are taking umbrage at what Kouta wrote are possibly forgetting that he has written a book about his career and like it or not, the Pagan years were part of that.

I don't think anyone is shocked by what was written as most suspected it. No point glossing over it.

Should we have expected him to not have written a book at all after his career?

I'm sure there are parts in the book about his dad - should he gloss over that too? I don't think so.

The Pagan era is one part of his football career and no doubt a small part of his book.

FWIW, I'm curious to see his views on drugs and will buy the Hun on Saturday to see what he has to say.

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“It is a state of mind, a system of belief, a way of seeing the world, a deep faith that, because you are Carlton, you belong to something great.” - Mike Fitzpatrick articulating what Out of the Blue means.

Kouta is one of the greatest Carlton players of all time, he can say whatever he wants about that joker.

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"We used to sit around and talk about how bad the game plan was." Anthony Koutoufides

I think it's probably best to let the past be, but the Hun's headline of Kouta 'slamming' the club is predictably absurd given Kouta's fairly mild criticism. I think DP has been really good in holding his tongue, so maybe Kouta should have too. But having said that Kouta's criticisms are hardly controversial. Still, I don't think quoting private phone calls is on. I think maybe Kouta should have given a general outline, and skirted the issue, but the publisher would have been calling the shots. The fact mild mannered Kouta has gine ahead with this indicates he feels pretty strongly.

The fact is there has barely been a decent book written on footy, and certainly I can't think of a footy biog that offers anything, maybe this will be another throw away.

Re the pre season cups, while it made the season very long, it did at least bring in revenue that may have kept our head above water in the clubs darkest days.
The big problem was Collo signing up DP 2 years into a 3 year contract - two old fashioned guys who maybe weren't up to speed with new millenium footy. Although, as we've seen here, it is easy to be wise after the event.

I think a couple of Beano's comments show that Kouta provided off field leadership by helping the young guys (the oHs) while Whit's dedication didn't run to that.

Too right. Worked for Parkin didn't it?

Who was that ex player? I didn't listen to SEN. Or is this supposed to be hush hush?

Well done Kouta!

Cazzeman wrote



A very simplistic view imo, and not very much thought given to the positive effect it may have for the Club.

The truth is the truth, and it was worth airing, especially given he's writing his autobiography; that's what an autobiography is about.

It's an historical account setting the record straight. About time!

If it is wrong for him to account for history honestly (HIS STORY), we may as well burn history books and any future foray in historical reference. He's done the right thing; to tell the truth; that's Kouta through and through, and everyone knows it. He is admired and will always be admired for his humbleness, honesty and fairness.

I'd rather it be done today than next year or the year after to get it over and done with:

Call it catharsis

Call it closure

Call it in 2007, not 2008...it was going to come out in the wash one day.

The anecdotes also take some of the heat from those who left/ retired from the club at a time of need; Ratten, Hickmott, Bradley...maybe even Campo, Beaumont (the list goes on). It was a dreadful time for supporters to see our heroes depart like that, and it's good to know they left Pagan not the club. That's a positive for the club imo..

Now at least the record is set straight; at least from Kouta's perspective.

It also endorses the new coach, and tells the world we are the new Carlton, that we've moved on from the draconian Elliot (latter years), Collo, Smorgo and Pagan era.

In a round about way it states we have served the sentence imposed on the Club, for a rift between the old president, Elliot, and the new Commissioner 'Demetriou'; in hindsight, a sentence no other club will ever have to endure given the ramifications of extreme and thoughtless severity of the AFL's penalty.

Put it this way, it's HIS RIGHT to state the events as he saw it; I'd rather know the truth; we can still put it behind us; rightfully blame AFL, the board of the time and Pagan for our continued floundering at the bottom of the ladder and finally...

I can't see how this account of the past could have a detrimental effect on our clubs future; it's a reference comparing the old game vs the modern game. It's about evolution, and slams the old world's door shut, once and for all. About time!

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Libba on SEN...

- Hasn't read Kouta's article yet
- Nothing surprises him in football
- Denis was a hard coach, Libba thought he was fair, Pagan always offered for players to speak to him
- As an asst coach was often used as a sounding board by players
- Surprised by Kouta's comments (even though nothing surprises him!)
- Denis' style and gameplan is basic, assistants would suggest tweaks and in 2006 they did tinker with gameplan
- Disappointed that Kouta has spoken out like this
- If a player spoke to him about Denis he would not then go and tell Denis without their approval
- When losing games, just need to blame someone, as the saying goesm buck stops with the coach
- Club lacked leadership amongst themselves (SEN bozo's just let that comment slip through to the keeper!)
- Said the tail wagged the dog at Carlton
- Denis didn't get a lot of support from the board
- Is now speaking to a few clubs, hasn't decided what he will do in future

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For all of us on here who were saying for years that Pagan had lost the players, at last it is now in the public domain.

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************************************************************
NOW YOU'RE JUST SOME CLUB THAT I USED TO KNOW.

Thankyou very much Kouta you have confirmed what I thought was the case all a long .

Those posters defending this moron Pagan must remember he has just taken this club through its worst 5 years in its history and think of the countless times after each loss he came out in the media and bagged the players . I bet Kouta has been busting to say this for several years now and for a man like Kouta to confirm it and now Malouf backing it up it has reaaly sadden me to think of what could have been over the past 5 years.

Is it any wonder we had so many 10 goal plus floggings when the players felt like this

I have said all along that Pagan was the issue not the list , not the draft penalties , not Parkin of Brittain or even Elliott


Roll on 2008 and lets see what these kids can do ,

I just hope that guys like Walker , Waite, Gibbs and co can play football like they were drafted to do

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They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Haha, KB is giving us his take...

Probably best to laugh at him I reckon.

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Daniel Harford ?

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Even the prodigal son at Richmond knows Kouta has done the wrong thing by Carlton.

KB knows what the true meaning of 'champion' is

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Are you for real?

As Kouta said, it was important to set the record straight,. The truth needed to be told. Way too many people don't realise the damage that crazy old man did to our once great club. He ruined us in more ways than one, and absolutely deserves his public bake. I'm glad people like you aren't in control of our club.

Well the so called senior players anyway

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"I will rejoice in their anguish, delight in their failure and revel in our success"

We are Carlton, @#$%&! the rest !!!!!!

Maybe Libba should take a leaf out of Kouta's book and actually say what he thinks for once, cause from what I have heard he couldn;'t stand Pagan