Well see i think youre a condescending prick when you want to illustrate me as being not a real Calton supporter etc...

So when were talking condescending pricks its people like you who are just every bit as me....

You reckon i should sit here and take you calling me a coward by insinuation... or my beliefs as being underhanded or weak???
Cos that is what you do.. you condescending prick..

The difference is i dont really care.... cos im not a weak prick to take it to heart!!!!

See people have perceptions... yours is a fantasy... (for example leave the bit about were going to be winners quickly by not biting the bullet out of this for a minute)

But when you somehow see me as attacking you but you cant see yourself and yourselves for attacking my beliefs by insinuating wakness youre in lala land... and your perception of me attacking your ego and not the other way around is misguided Kaptain Kouta.....

Stop telling me my way is weak... therefore yours is a proud and noble one.. refelcting you and me...

Cos its just not the case...

Condescending prick!!!!!

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

See that is condescending you prick!!

Youre saying i and others are shameful!!!!!

Pot .. kettle..`black.... make a sentence using those 3 words/

But like i said you dont see it unless its right back at you....

Cos you live in in lala land!!!!



See i dont care that you use words like "shame " and are all condescending to people who want uis to really improve...

i just care that youre a hypocrite....

Some people only see what they want to see and that proves it....

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Now who's taking things to heart?

I have never once said that people who want to finish low on the ladder are lesser supporters than I am. To paraphrase, Carlton is a broad church, and there are many pews inside.

I accept that others support different paths of action than I do, but I try not to belittle them.

Go back through my posts, I don't think you'll find me calling you, or anyone who supports what you are suggesting weak or underhanded.

In a lot of ways, I think maybe you're just as deluded as I am. I guess time will tell.

Maybe I am living in a fantasy world. But it's mine, and I'm happy here...

You condescending prick

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

How am I a hypocrite, Synbad?

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

I just gave you an example of you saying my idea is shameful.. so yours must be right... which means im shameful in your eyes.. thats belittlement isnt it???

But unlike you i dont take offence in here... but squealing like a piglet when its put back at you really irks me. ....

i can go through more examples of condescending by you if i looked back...

Thats ok.. do it.. !!! but dont cry when its thrown back in your face... it smacks of .. well i shouldnt say.....

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

You're just splitting hairs. You do have a tendency to do that to back up your arguments.

Yes, I think the idea is shameful. However, unlike your assertion, I don't think the people who advocate it are shameful. that's a construct of your own making. Now, if you take that argument to it's logical conclusion, you're the one who is now "squealing like a piglet".

You think that I'm saying that my viewpoint is somehow honourable, and you'rs is spineless and weak. I never said you, or anyone who thinks like you is. Conversely, you say the view I and many many others hold is deluded, in la-la land, and worse than yours, and even imply that we are somehow lesser supporters, because of the long-term damage our "path" would do to our great club. Yes, our club. Not mine, not yours, OURS.

This whole thing is pissing me off.

You want to know why?

Because I respect you, and your opinions. I appreciate your input, and the insights you give from your privileged position inside the club. I don't want to argue with you about this, because it's obvious that we both aren't going to agree about or respective points.

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

<Mate you dont know me if you think i ever squeal like a piglet.. i go in to bat for myself...

is this what you want????

everyone knows we need picks but is this how you would do it???

Lose a superstar to get picks and come third last with 8 wins??? or seven???

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/ ... 42,00.html


why should we win 6 games and let Fev go???

Why not add to Fev????

Cos were being pious????

Eh???

Want the club thinking like that???
Kouta retires and we trade Fev but we get 2 players.......

So we havent really gone anywhere....

Isnt it better to come last ... get picks 1 and 2... and the best player through the PSD and keep Fev????

Dont you see the reality of where were at????

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

KK, i like you too... i reckon you add alot...
Footy is a passionate sport.. sometimes we lose track of stuff...

But it will kill me if we dont take this chance to go forward and in 5 years time were still in that no mans land region cos our supporters made the club feel it would be weak to bite the bullet.

Were up shit creek.... while we were wijnning premierships (cos we did whatever it took to win) other clubs were 10 years.. 20 years.. 30 years... 40 years..etc away from their last flag.

I know how hard it is to win a flag... hlaf of my relatives barrack for StKilda... and their club didnt know how to play the game under the old system...

There is a game within a game...

What happens at any particular home and away game is just the battle... the war is played later on... the stakes are much higher than beating some shitty team to win 7 games for the season...cos lets face it we wont win that many more.

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

I totally see the reality of where we're at, believe it or not. I'll say it again: If we're as crap as you insist, which would appear to be more correct than not, then we will naturally finish low on the ladder. If that's the case, then so be it. I just don't think it's the right way to go about it by playing kids who really aren't up to it. Some kids are almost ready, but some are so far away it's not funny. Would you think it's a good idea to play them?

What's more, I think it's smart to "play the game". The rules are a particular way, and yes, while we're in need, we should take advantage of it. In fact, I'm not sure of many other clubs lately who have been as consistently ordinary as us from 02 through to now. If we finish low, and we get PPs because of our own God-given footy skills and talents then I accept that. But for a team which is realistically 6-12th material to lie doggo for half a season and get good picks is just wrong. I'm sure you weren't that impressed with Melbourne's "yo-yo" seasons, which allowed them to get PPs in alternate years, even though their list should have been able to perform to much higher levels. But, to their credit, they played the game, and beat the Dealer.

At the start of the season, I thought we had the talent to be a 6-12th team. Obviously my opinion on this is changing week by week. I still class us as a 8-14th side.

I don't think we need to be "pious" as you put it, and shun early picks. Yes, we need them. We need them like Ben Affleck needs acting lessons. But please, I just want us to get thse early pick based on our own natural inadequacies and incompetencies, not rorting the system.

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

You know, when it comes down to it, some days, all I want for the rest of the season is to win our return matches against The Filth and the Bummers (and North, cos I have to get some back against my mate..)....

Let the dice fall where they will...

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

KK, we will finish low because were crap....

But the question is will wwe win 1, 2, 3 , 4 or 5 more games.?.. regardless we are crap and we finished low...
But how low and how many games we do win is very significant to where we will be in three years time.
Were not good enough to be top 8... or come close... if we did... we would be shooting ourselves in the foot. Because we really dont have a top 8 list.
Sydney are trying everything they can to make the eight. Their list is better than ours but they are crap!!!
No chance of winning a flag... not this year not next... in fact theyre going about winning a flag the wrong way....
They wont do it...

I mean one day they will... but not in this cycle.

You just cant go out to the beach walk into the water and turn the tide around .

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

I know, the last guy who tried this was a bit of a silly flower, wasn't he?

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

If i was allowed to choose id want us to lose against the Dons and the Pies.. so they get nothing in the draft... and we win one more.
that win against stKilda...

Id love that...

Then next year we can re asses where were at.

I really dont believe alot of us understand the gravity of where were at...

I do go see the kids ocassionaly in the TAC and the state championships..

Its not easy identifying late talent.
I dont envy them... please dont think its easy...

You do see some kids that should make it ...but the guts of it is gone by about pick 5 .
These kids are also the ones that are right in mind and body.
Sometimes you do get a Chrissy Egan slip to 10... but thats because he has question marks over something about himself.

You dont get attitude question marks over Riewoldt.. Kosi... Hodge Ball Judd.. Goddard Wells.. Cooney Walker... Tambling Deledio etc

Thats why they go early... its not just that theyre stand out footballers...

If it were Laurie would have probably gone at #1 before Riewoldt...

The story goes that Ayers over ruled the recruiter for him... because there were questions over Lauries character.... they pissed pick 7 or whatever it was against the wall...

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

What if we do come last or close to last and we pick all duds.No one has thought of that, i blame the people in charge in Carlton they baby the players sometimes playing them 2 or 3 years in the VFL before playing and then cutting them off the list in the 4th year, while most clubs play them maybe 1 year in the VFL at most but the majority play a few games the first season, our excuse is they are not ready for AFL but by the fourth season the players a miles behind the guys who got drafted the same as them for other clubs.

Also as much i respect Denis Pagan as a coach maybe Coaching is a young man game this days he is close to 60 and i feel maybe coaching from 35-50 is enough.Ron Barassi,Allan Jeans,John Kennedy,Tom Hafey and David Parkin are all great coaches but they knew it was time to give it away. Denis is a great coach dont get me wrong but him ,Malthouse and possible Sheedy and Matthews know their time is coming to a end.

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Bang Bang.

Shit!!!! never thought of that... we shouldnt make sure we get the best PCKS and the best uncontracted player.. we should aim at the second or third best PICK and only one PICK and this years Phil Reid... just in case we get the duds...

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Strangely enough I think that is a fair chance to happen this season. Collingwood and Hawthorn are both playing too well to not win 3 more games. Fev will win a couple off is own boot which will probably be too many for us, as will J Brown. Richmond won't win a game for the rest of the season but have already done too much

Essendon* is my only real question mark. Lloydy needs to find some form.