You're as backward thinking as Denis Pagan.
While you are at lets see if we can get back Kernahan, Bradley and Williams to bolster our leadership. Maybe even get Doully to come back and lead in defense.

You and Denis think a like...very scary

Actually I said the Pagan was the wrong appointment for the club from day 1.
Criticised collo and his administration for being too negative from day 1.
Recognised the impact of removing the middle tier and recruitment of recycled players from day 1.
Also been a strong advocate of moving the game plan away from the Fev 100 goal FF for years.

All things that took posters like yourself YEARS to recognise - yet apparently I think like pagan

You have rocks in your head if you think that we should be sending out a 22 with just 2 players above 25 and some 16-18 players that are either 23 and under or with less than 50 games experience.

\]

But in effect thats ecatly what were doing plus 2 guys that are useless... show no senior leadership and have no effect on the game...

So whats the point keeping them around?
Id rahther have kept McGrath than Lance.
McGrath was professional and was in great nick.
True his game was a bit erratic but a fantastic role model for the kids.

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

We need a coach and MC that show some boldness and that are prepared to take risks - particulary with team selection.

Lance, Kouta and Lappin (and Denis for that matter!) will not be part of our next finals team let alone our next premiership team. They are all playing out time it's sad to say. Look at their body language and commitment when we are getting flogged. Each of them has had success in the past. They have also been at the club when we have been down. Losing to them has now become a "so what" experience.

Synbad comments like those make your post look stupid-

Mcgrath was a very average footballer sure he tried hard but he was dud materail - I've watched a bit of him this year on ABC2 along with Prenda , Kenna and Clarke and a few others in the SA league - They struggle there .

The thing that the club is lacking at the moment and it maybe a product of the system they work with - is the ability to tap these better players from the past on shoulder and telling them to move on - Kouta should have moved on last year - Whitnal should bow out now and Lappin at season end. And at the same time pressure should be put on Fev - Scotland Houlihan and Thorton to step up and take on the leadership roles

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They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

You are correct to an extent - stevens does play as an attacking midfielder and frankly I have no issues with that. The problem arises when we apply different judgments to players because of some personal bias.

Why do we overlook the lack of accountability of stevens when we criticise players like campo and houlahan (arguably who are/were also attacking midfielders/forwards in the same mould)?

On houlahan and stevens and goals against. Thanks to pagan, Houlahan - a natural forward has spent more time in defence in his career than what he probably has in the midfield and upforward combined. In that respect, any comparison between stevens and houlahan for goals against would actually be biased in stevens favour. There would be more games where stevens direct opponent in the midfield has kicked 3+ goals than houlahans direct opponent when he has been in defence.

The point is - as one of our most unaccountable footballers, we do carry stevens a fair bit (and yes, he is a better player than houlahan). Its perhaps just not as obvious as stevens is more damaging going forward and perhaps due to the flashy blonde factor most supporters prefer to dwell on the positives rather than the negative aspects of his game.

On Lance - when fit he cant run. He should however be limited to playng within the forward 50 (not unreasonably to keep a couple forwards there at all times). The issue arises when the club tries to run him into the ground by having him to cover the whole ground and to push beyond his capabilities by playing him on bigger, stronger, faster opponents.

On the need to play more than one position - how many positions does Fev actually play? At a stretch I'd give you 4 - FF, CHF, midfield and FB. The last 2 are questionable at best and his performances at CHF to date havent been too impressive either. So why the different analysis?

Rather than run whitnall around the ground - we should have him as a permanant forward and split the F50 entries between him and Fev and fisher (perhaps waite but our greater need is at CHB atm) until such time that kennedy is ready to come through (2 years away). Might be all theoretical but I'd hazard a guess that under such a scenario the goal output between Fev, fisher and whitnall wouldnt be too great.

whitnall 15 goals from 12 games (less than 50% time up forward)
Fev 38 goals from 12 games (100% time upforward, a tally inflated by 1 bag of
fisher 21 goals from 10 games

I dont think it would be unreasonable to suggest that whitnall could lift his goals output by 50% if he played every match up forward. That would leave him at 22 goals from 12 games.

So over a 22 game season (assumnig all uninjured and played forward)
Fev - 76goals
Whitnall - 45 goals
fisher - 44 goals
That doesnt look too bad does it?

You might hate Pagan but you have the same thought processes as him in regards to looking at the future. Look at what Collingwood has done this year as an example. Some of their senior blokes have been unavailable due to injury and lack of form and they have been prepared to back their kids and play them. Who would have thought Harry O’Brien could go with Scott Lucas??
Surely guys like Edwards, Bower, Kennedy and Flint are better players then Alan Tovey and Goldsack but unfortunately they are not given a run due to our backward thinking coach who persists with guys like Kouta and Whitnall whose times are clearly both up.

So what happens when Whitnalls opponents runs off him (like they all do when he is playing forward) and creates another option up the field. Do we let whitnall just sit on his arse in the forward line while a Walker, or a Murphy has to not only watch their own man but they have to pick him another player because our leader cannot run to chase???

I dont hate pagan - never have. Just always maintained he was not the right man for the job and was highly critical of his game plans.

Now onto your collingwood v Essendon* example.
In that game the pies had presti, johnson, fraser, clement, didak, burns, rocca, swan, lokyer, rhys shaw, davis, obree - all of whom are seasoned players (90% sure they are all 25+) - and I've probably missed a couple players as well.

What you are advocating is that we go in with Fev, stevens, scotland and then not much else.

Just wondering whether you can spot a small difference between the lists?

By all means we should be playing our youngsters - I've always been an advocate of that. But you have to do it within reason.

That should mean cycling the players in and out of the team in 6 week blocks - 100% game time (or as much as possible) and letting them know that they how they will be assessed. If they establish themselves great, if not - then drop them back to the ressies for 6 weeks to find form (whilst another young player gets his chance to impress) and then bring them back up again. ie a min 12 games/year.

No bringing in players for 5 mins game time.

He will actually have more mobility as a result of running less (as strange as that may sound). Also people will be less reluctant to run off knowing any turnover will result in a goal (due to positioning on field), especially forwards that consistently kick goals in the game (something that whitnall can do).Thats why people dont run off Fev that much either despite knowing that approx 50% of the time Fev wont be chasing, or giving a token effort to chase.

I’ve heard it all now.
No point arguing the point any-more

dont know if anyone has said this but who will be captain?

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Who was it that said there are lies, damn lies, and statistics? Footy doesn't work that way. By your argument, if we'd left Beaumont on the forward line after the half against Collingwood, he'd kick 16 goals a game. Now let's see, that's 352 goals per year. Wow. he's even better than Hudson, Coleman, Lockett, and Ablett. No wonder Hawthorn wanted him. That doesnt look too bad does it?

Hawthorn had 3 players OVER 25 years of age on Friday night ... Crawford, Croad and Smith and for most of their season to date. I'm sure Jonathon Hay, Nathan Thompson and Peter Everitt inspired just as much emotional debate amongst the Hawks faithful.
Jonathon, Nathan and Peter who?

List management and tough decisions at its best at the Hawks, no wonder we went after Pelchin.

Well said 4th!

gotta love selective quoting of statistics. By your reasoning

Fev kicked 0 goals in round 2 - perhaps we should just delist him as he wont ever kick a goal again?

There is a thing called precedence. Look back over his career - Whitnall has a history of being a consistent goal kicker. As does Fev. Beaumont never did.

Fisher has kicked an average of 2 goals/game this year - it wouldnt be unreasonable to expect that he would be able to continue such an average. A similar arguement could be mounted for whitnall and Fev.

If I had selectively used stats (ie only looked at games where whitnall has kicked 2 or more goals) and then used that as the basis of my projections then you might have a case. In this case however, you're just being an idiot for the sake of it

According to the reports I've seen , Lance's knee is degenerative and doesn't require surgery.

I'm no expert (though I can draw on personal experience with sports-related knee injuries) but this tells me a few things about his condition: that it is here to stay, that it will progressively get worse, and that surgery will not fix the problem..... he's probably worn out his cartilage due to wear and tear, resulting in bone rubbing against bone on the affected knee.

It doesn't look like Lance's knee will improve IMO. Will be interesting to hear the specialist's report.

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When Dick became President, it was as if everyone at Carlton came out of the hailstorm and into the sunshine - Stephen Kernahan

YARRAN!!





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If someone can't train for 5 weeks, has a degenerative knee problem that doesn't require surgery - where does that leave him?

Doesn't "degenerative" imply that it will gradually get worse? So does that mean he cannot train indefinitely?? The club needs to come out and make a statement about Lance - and not DP with his rhetorical rubbish - someone who can say something of substance!!

Means they have a medical reason to drop him...er sorry rest him and gives the club an out with regards not re-signing him or offering a performance based contract only....

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen

Between the lines...

Lance can get a SPECIAL comments job at 7...

He speaks in Haiku

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They coud'nt.....could they?