When posting in a similar topic after the win against the Dogs I lamented the fact that we still let 20 goals in ourselves, to which I was told that you can't have it both ways. If you score a lot you give away a lot, it's just the natural order of things. However you only need to look at Geelong to see that this isn't necessarily the case. They're the only team to kick more points than us yet have given away the fewest also (or pretty close to it anyway). So this tells me that it IS possible to have a strong attack and defense at the same time.

So my question is, how can we tune our own backline to reach this level while the forwards continue to do their job? Could we still manage to build an elite backline while scoring 20 goals every week?

..it's tricky.. ..yer see fer ages we've had a good crop of forward, and now we're gettin' a good crop of midfielders too.. ..but defenders we've been light on for ages now too.. ..look at who often plays in our backline.. ..out of them i'd say thornton and saddo are yer main defenders.. ..players like carrazzo, scotland, walker, gibbs, houla's are more midfielders/wingmen/hhf's.. ..and waite, who's more yer chf that we'll try as a chb.. ..they're doin' a good job, but they're not exactly played in their best position either.. ..i reckon we need to focus on our strengths.. ..so long as we kick more goals than we let thru we're doin' well.. ..can only work with what we've got..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

No side has ever been that good where they can score 20 goals week in/week out without the opposition scoring highly. It's a consequence of shoot-out footy where players take risks and run ahead of the ball. Because of that, as a consequence, you're "unaccountable" when the opposition have the ball going the other way hence their high scoring as well. Very exciting plan but easily susceptible to a side expert at shutting down the opposition. That'll be the next test when the opposition beigin to take us more "seriously". Hawks will be one test in that regard as will the kings of shutdown footy, the Swans in a few weeks. Hope it doesn't end up like the St.Kilda game a few weeks ago.

There is one thing I think we could do immediately that would help the situation.

At the moment, we are playing a long, direct game of footy, which I love. However, IMHO, the final entry into the 50, and the structure inside 50, still aren't right. What tends to happen is that on most occasions, we are bombing to contests inside 50. If we take a mark, great. Occasionally we get the crumb, and our scoring efficiency when this happens has actualy been very good.

However, too often the ball comes to ground, and is run out by the defense. As we have been attacking, the opposition has loose players, and it often ends up in a scoring opportunity for them.

If we change the balance of players inside 50, to include an extra small or two, then when the ball hits the deck inside 50, we will have a better chance of getting our hands on it. With Waite, Whitnall, Fevola and Fisher up there, it's not overly quick. Nor are Wiggins and Lappin for that matter. Makes it failry easy for the opposition to run it out without pressure. Murphy has helped when he has been in there. Betts too, although he simply needs to do more (when playing) than being involved in 10 pieces of play a game). Gibbs would be one to consider rotating through there at times, great reader of the ball, and fantstic tackler.

Remember the days of Jonno and Buzz? We used to say we had the best defense in the league, and the second best (our forward line).

Also, we need to get more system going forward. Having more leading options to try and hit. It's ok to bomb every now and then, but all the time hurts us on the rebound. If half our bombs went instead to leading targets, then I reckon we'd be cutting out at least 2 or 3 rebounds a quarter, which could translate to cutting out 1 goal a quarter against. That's a massive difference already.

So, in answer to the question, in order to first help out the defense, look to our forward line.

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Mens sana in corpore sano.

Bring back the laurel wreath logo!!!

I still like playing Santy down at FB and believe he can do the job on most of the KPP's.....Waite giving us an edge down forward means we need another key defender/CHB...I dont see Thornton in that role and believe he is better suited to handpicked opponents on a week by week basis.

Mark Austin needs to step up next year and play some senior footy IMO....has been hampered by injuries and made a slow start but appears the Michael Sexton type of player who may take slow but steady progress and need some patience.....I also would like to see Flint get some senior time this season as well.
Flint is a bit different as he is more the dour defensive stopper and I think there is a spot on the list for that type of player even though some posters want to delist him..
You need variety/options and depth down back and I belive we have the players but they dont have the experience as yet....another three years wait and I think there wont be many teams kicking big scores against us...

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen

Actually that Geelong stat might see me with egg on my face. I still won't believe the handbags can win a GF until they've actually won one. Even with a 30 point 3/4 time lead I reckon the other team would still win by a couple of goals ...

However, I think history dictates that the team with the stingiest defence has a pretty good record of winning the flag. More so than the team with the best attack in any case.

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It all starts in the midfield, the more run in our legs so we can get back and help, better delivery into our forward 50 to stop the ball coming out quickly on the rebound, bigger bodies to be more able to shut down opp midfield...if it is 6 on 6 every time they go forward we or any other team will be in trouble!!!

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Blue blood is running through these veins!!! Go Blueys!!!

Nearly right...

Lance to the bench, Setanta & Waitey as KPDs, JK & Harts as KPFs.

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There's so much I could say...

The less the opposition has the ball the less they score.

Interesting Libba spoke about limiting the Bulldogs to 300 possessions. This also coincided with us playing more uncontested footy. I think these days you can't just look at the backline in isolation, the posts on forward line pressure are on the money but again this is part of the total picture.

Having all players accountable and working for each other is the best form of defence, something Sydney have in spades. They also say attack is the best form of defence, which is what we're adopting at the moment. Let's continue with what we are doing - we all do enjoy it don't we?

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17 4 10

stop giving away silly free kick in our defensive 50 eg/ scotland v dogs

apply more defensive pressure in our FWD 50 eg/ fevola's chase on davey last year

and make sure the midfielders are applying extreme pressure on the opposition.

its about working as a team, what happens up the ground effects what happens down back, vice versa. it shows how important it is to have a stong midfield and have depth.

BUMP in the wake of our horrific performance tonight. I again pose the question to you all.

give Hartlett a go ahead of Saddington in the last half of the year.

Anderson looks promising as a close checking defender / tagger.

don't play Whitnall there!

God, play Hartlett, Flint, anyone who can play. I thought we were improving, but Saddo (we know you try mate, we really do) ain't the answer. If we're smart, we'll lose 'em all and get KREUZER and sack Pago.

The alternative to thinking Pago can't coach, is that we're shite.....hmmm, reckon we should sack the Fossil.

Saddington, Houlihan and Whintall out of there.

Setanta, Anderson and Bannister in.

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NOW YOU'RE JUST SOME CLUB THAT I USED TO KNOW.

Too slow.... you cant play players that cant run and are not enthusiastic.
I like Saddo the bloke... but Saddo the fullback??
Lance the CHB??????

These two must move on and allow Paul Bower and Co to come in and get games under their belt.


Plus with the pace of football these days... you CANNOT use Kouta and Lance and Saddington along with Bentick and Blackers .. who you CAN use...

The quicker Pagan forgets about those blokes and begins blooding kids that will be part of our future the quicker we will get a REAL team together.
Right now Pagan only wants to win as many games as he can to shore up himself... long term were getting robbed of games under kids belts and a priority pick!!!

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i dont see a quick fix unfortunately.

like synbad has said, the first thing i would do would be to get whitnall and saddington the hell outta there. Last night their lack of pace was glaringly obvious.

bring in Hartlett to play down back and also bring in flint. from what i have heard flint is a decent size and can also run and carry.

i would also look at getting houlihan out of the backline and swinging him forward, dropping either bentick, blackwell, kouta or lappo and playing houlihan up forward with fev, fish, waitey, eddie, and jk.

bring Benjamin in to cover houlihan's spot on the back flank and also bring joey in to the back line as well....this is how i picture it looking:

Anderson O'Hailpin Hartlett

Benjamin/Flint Thornton Scotland

that gives us a good mix of size and speed. In a pinch, Flint could be played down there as well so we can swing santy into the ruck or onto the ball with his brother taking the ruck. then the team would look like this:

Anderson Hartlett Flint

Benjamin Thornton Scotland

Simpson Murphy Gibbs

Houlihan Kennedy Waite

Fisher Fevola Betts

R: A. O'hAilpin S. O'hAilpin Stevens

Int: Hampson Austin Blackwell Carrazzo



thoughts?

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Back like a raging case of pubic lice

How do we fix our backline?

Simple, by making everyone else up the ground accountable

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SMFC 1959 : ONE LIFE, ONE LOVE, ONE CLUB

They won't bring all these people in at the one time, we all know that.

The backline will look better when Santy is back there, which means Aisake in, Santy to FB and Saddo out. Ackland to No 2 ruckman. The Saddo and Ackland "solution".

Assuming hammy is OK, Joey Anderson must come in as he is ACCOUNTABLE. Really liked his Dogs game pre injury. Gave our side a different dynamic. He either goes back or is a run with player. Whatever, he can stop supply into our back half or be a competent defender if used permanently. Blackwell not quite there at the minute, so Joey in for him. This pushes either Russell or Houla to the bench - hopefully Houla!!

Keen as anyone to see Flint in, but he and Hartlett need to show a bit tomorrow for Ants to be in consideration. Need plenty more from Benji before he gets a gig, but the tools are there, no doubt.

As bad as they were last night, without injuries, I can't see more than 2 changes for next game. Hartlett or Flint for Lance is on the cards in the next few weeks. His knee is giving the MC the "out" clause they need.

A midfield that wins more than 25% of the clearances would be a handy start.

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"One of my favorite philosophical tenets is that people will agree with you only if they already agree with you. You do not change people's minds." - Frank Zappa

Siegfried for coach Gee if us posters can come up with this sort of stuff why does the coaching staff find it so hard to come up with these sort of game planS

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1. Walker,
2. Menzel,
3. Murphy,
4. Gibbs,
5. Judd.