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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 12:49 am 
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Ken Hunter
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Posts: 10376
Location: Coburg
ah yes the patience of gnats!

last year was ground zero. We have Hartlet, Russell, Raso and Betts plus support.

We add this year four more genuine kids.And the year after.

And we then wait a further two years.

So i reckon around 2009 we'll be right.


There are no quick roads anymore.

Only one.

A freeway

No


A tollway

pay the intial toll

then its a freeway.


I hate it


Others hate it


But thats the way it is.


So shut up and be patient!

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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 2:24 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
JacksBoy wrote:
Abaddon wrote:
re-signing Pagan is the Collins administrations verson of the Legends Stand.

All that money for very little return.

Right now, a hack like Brittain could be doing the job and using up a hell of a lot less money, or which we don't have much of anyway.

Unlike Brittain, Pagan isn't mortgaging our future by trading picks for duds. Brittain has more responsibility for the present quality of our list than Pagan with his drafting of duds and foot soldiers.
Has Brittain been re-signed as an assistant coach after helping take Richmond to a spoon last year?



should i call you a tripper or someone without a clue???

What picks did he trade??? picks number # 54825204644???? cos thats what we had......


Do you even go to the footy?????
Were a crap side with crap leadership on the field... and it needs to change.
Hopefully that game put things into perspective.
Worse list in the AFL... bar none.

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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 11:27 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Posts: 4129
It was difficult to hear Pagan's pre-game speech where I was at the ground. Saw it on TV this morning and must say it was fantastic stuff. I am at a loss to explain why the players did not seem to me more switched on. The instructions are very clear and many are not following them. We just don't have the cattle. I am sick and tired of this simple equation: team wins = coach good team looses= coach bad. It is just not that simple.

PS: Good to meet you agin Danny. First time I have seen you sober... 8)


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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 11:37 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:26 pm
Posts: 4719
Location: Parliament House, Canberra
mikkey wrote:
It was difficult to hear Pagan's pre-game speech where I was at the ground. Saw it on TV this morning and must say it was fantastic stuff. I am at a loss to explain why the players did not seem to me more switched on. The instructions are very clear and many are not following them. We just don't have the cattle. I am sick and tired of this simple equation: team wins = coach good team looses= coach bad. It is just not that simple.

PS: Good to meet you agin Danny. First time I have seen you sober... 8)


Hear hear!

I'm going to assume that when Carlton had a poor 2002 when we won the spoon that you people who want Denis out now, wanted Brittain out then as well.

Be honest. I'll say that I was one who wanted Brittain out because I saw inadequacies that were not rectifiable.

Sydney Blue, perhaps the lists at these clubs are not that bad. Hawthorn had a no. 1 draft pick, regained a former no. 3 in Croad, have a few 2nd round picks that we haven't had in about 4 years. Adelaide were going nowhere under Ayres and their game plan was chip-chip. Richmond's list is better than people give it credit for and half their side is young draft picks - something which in you case you haven't noticed, WE HAVEN'T HAD IN 2003 and 2004.

Some supporters are so fickle they only see results and don't see the process.

Did you know about the players' revolt in 2003 Sydney Blue by any chance?

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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 4:35 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Posts: 28377
Location: *Currently banned*
I posted this, almost exactly a year ago, elsewhere on the net.

"I recently bought a new printer for my business. Why? Because this one is much better than my old one. My old printer did the job, but couldn't allow me to print out the glossy, high quality documents I need to give my business "the edge" over my competitors. It wasn't a cheap printer, but I am glad I've got it.

The thing was, the printer loads the paper in the complete opposite way to my previous printer...hence I went through a period of making the mistake of putting the glossy paper in the wrong side up...the results weren't pretty. Boy, did I cuss and rant and bemoan wasting expensive paper.

In fact, I would have got better results with my old printer, the one I knew how to load with my eyes shut...but I have since learnt how to load my new printer in the way it wants to be loaded and now the results far and away exceed my old printer's output."

I still feel the same way about my printer...it may need some tweaking but it is still better than many less expensive printers which are good for a while and then completely fall apart :D


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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 4:49 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Posts: 4678
Location: Melbourne
CarltonClem wrote:
mikkey wrote:
I'm going to assume that when Carlton had a poor 2002 when we won the spoon that you people who want Denis out now, wanted Brittain out then as well.


Whilst i wanted Brittan out,...............I never wanted Pagan in. We need a long term fix, not a short term one. Even before we lost those picks, i knew it was going to happen. There was just to much shit gooing on for it NOT to be true!

But i'll say it again. I don't think that Pagan is a bad coach, i just think he is not the right coach for us!


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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 4:57 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 6:28 pm
Posts: 2220
There arent many coaches available right now that will rebuild a club.

Pagan for all his faults is the man for this job. I think he will recuit solidly after 2005.

Despite the failings of out bunch of rejects, I dont think he did all that badly, given the constraints he operated under.

I have developed reservations about him too, but I think that we shouldnt take a risk on someone else just yet.

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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 6:00 pm 
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Adrian Gallagher

Joined: Sun May 01, 2005 4:12 pm
Posts: 51
Pagan is the man.He has cleaned out most of the crap players.He had to take a chance on a few recycled players.Some of them have turned out good and some not so good.But he has given them a fair chance and the ones not performing will be moved on.
Remember when Brittain was around and the amount of no hopers we had.Pagan atleast knows who has the abiltity to make it.But at this stage he has to play with who we have got.Like it or lump it.


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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 7:36 pm 
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Laurie Kerr
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Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2005 11:46 pm
Posts: 132
There no Coach to get i guess you could try someone new like Mark Harvey, Guy Mckenna or Peter Sumich. I reckon Mckenna might be a good coach for some club one day.


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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 8:16 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 6:28 pm
Posts: 2220
No point in changing at the moment. It might make you feel better in the short term to sack the coach, but it wouldnt do any good, the problems wouldnt go away by getting rid of Pagan, thinking they would is a delusion.

I think that the gap between experienced players and youth is also significant. This will mean that we will at risk of a bad year in 2006 too, more so if someone like Kouta retires at the end of this year (I think he will play on though).

Our problem is caused by the draft penalties we experienced. 5 first round picks in our side from 2002 and 2003 would have meant that we were a much better side than at present.

Im happy that Hawthorn won today and Collingwood won yesterday.

The players have a clear choice now either they show improvement or fulfil others predictions of mediocrity. Change the gameplan all you want, but I think they want to be good, but they are unable to do so - so its the cattle, not the coach...

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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 8:21 pm 
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Garry Crane

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:27 pm
Posts: 227
Guys we have played three of the best four teams three weeks in a row, before that we had a fortnite of hell playing two games interstate back to back. Whoever created the fixture, is anti-Carlton and must die. :twisted:

Basically, the Blues had a very tough five weeks.

We go interstate(Adelaide) next week again. Then play Sydney at the Phone Dome.

We should get a win here with some luck, both clubs are in the top eight and looking good.


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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 8:28 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:41 pm
Posts: 63509
Al Bundy the legend wrote:
i guess you could try someone new like Mark Harvey...


Harvey is a deadset joke. At least others like Drum, Rohde, Craig, Clarkson, etc have had the balls to go out and take control of a club, for better or worse. He's too gutless to let go of Mummy Sheeds' apron strings, and have a crack. And on top of that, everything he touches at Essendon* over the last 3 or 4 years has turned to shit.

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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 10:52 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:28 pm
Posts: 3768
King Leonidas wrote:
Guys we have played three of the best four teams three weeks in a row, before that we had a fortnite of hell playing two games interstate back to back. Whoever created the fixture, is anti-Carlton and must die. :twisted:

Basically, the Blues had a very tough five weeks.

We go interstate(Adelaide) next week again. Then play Sydney at the Phone Dome.

We should get a win here with some luck, both clubs are in the top eight and looking good.


As the ladder now stands we play teams 3 (yes Richmond are currerntly 3rd), 2 (Cats beat Kangas today by more than they beat us), 4, 5 & 6 in consecutive weeks. We then play the triple premiers. :x


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