I can't believe what I'm hearing here. Why wait for this next saviour to come to our club from next year's draft when we can get so much more out of our current playing group confidence-wise should we manage to win a few more games? What, do we want our team in 10 years time to have 10 #1 draft picks in themwith no gurantees that they'll actually be any good, or would you rather work as hard as you can possibly can to develop the guys we have now to be the best they can possibly be so that we won't need to keep relying on the draft year after year to bail us out?

The guys we have now aren't going to be at this level forever. Win a few games and see the difference in them. I don't see the rocket science in that.

So were going to make the eight or have 10 plus wins.. cos were not going to tank????

seriously how many wins do you think we will have realistically...

a couple of years ago we had 10 and then won the wooden spoon...

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Believe it my friend.
We lack so much class it is not funny. Name 3 A-grade carlton players that currently play in the AFL? We have Fevola(if he keeps his consistency up) and ???

Our list needs a cull 3 times over atleast before we gain a solid list.
We are on the right track with Gibbs, Murphy and Walker but we need A-Graders who can take a game my the scruff of the neck and shake it like a rag doll.

To have Murphy who ha splayed only 20 games or so as a our number one midfield target really has to say something about our list.
Now we are crying out for ruckmen Kreuzer would be a great start and we need a dangerous midfielder aswell.
Imagine this in 3 years
Walker
Gibbs
Murphy
Kennedy
kruezer
"Another Top 10 draft pick"

Now that would one hell of a midfield and some sort of rocket science!

I honestly don't know, but the point I'm making is that we should not be satisfied with defeat, even if it means we will get a better player at the end of the year. The confidence gained by these young guys should we win another 5-6 matches this year will be far more valuable than getting yet another skinny 18 year-old who will have the weight of the world on his shoulders and may or may not turn out to be any good.

Achilles, that's exactly the problem. We keep looking at our current group and making the assumption that they couldn't possibly get any better than they are now. We keep assuming that player-A needs to go to and be replaced by Draft Pick-B for us to be successful. What about getting the most out of player-A to begin with? Someone mentioned in another thread that clubs like Brisbane, Port and even Essendon* and the Roos have rebuilt much quicker than we have and have had far less stock to choose from draft-time. So why do you think these guys develop quicker than our guys? Better team management, leadership, and dare I say coaching. It's a nice thought that maybe in 3 years time we can assume that guys like Walker, Murphy, Kennedy and Gibbs will be elite players in the league, but have you considered the possibility that by then their confidence may be so smashed after one belting after another that they might actually be worse? Turn your attention back to guys like Scott Freeborn, Darren Hulme and Simon Fletcher. While we were flying so were they, yet when we hit hard times they disappeared. Confidence.

Overall the point I'm making is that the young guys we have should be better than they are by now, and the fact that they're not says that it's going to take something other than another 2-3 #1 draft picks to fix it. Whether this means taking a look at our training methods, our coaching, our recruiting, whatever. But loading your team up with draft picks is a band-aid approach, and is reactive rather than proactive in my eyes.

i disagree in part Donstuie. I feel that more top level draft picks wont put 'the weight of the world on their shoulders' but infact will only help the team grow in depth as a unit...

i personally think the Hawks are on the verge of creating an 80's like dynasty...Lance Franklin, Jordan Lewis, Luke Hodge, Xavier Ellis, Jared Roughead, Beau Dowler, Grant Birchall, Luke Brennan, and Max Bailey all top 20 draft picks in recent years..put them with Mitchell, Campbell Brown (all australian CHB), bateman, boyle, croad etc and they're going to be simply brilliant...


we've got the young talent also...but i think we still need the young kids to contintue to come into the team to help us climb the ladder again...although finishing 12th, 13th, or 14th could still get us a good enough pick to do so i feel...whether its pick 1 or pick 4 or 5 i think we'll get what we need...but obviously both picks 1 and 3 would mean we can stop 'building' and then start 'doing'...i think once Hampson, O'Hailpin, and Kennedy settle into key positions then we'll have an amazing structure going and we'll start doing damage.


Nic

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Cuck Follingwood

If we finish 15th with 4 wins and get the PP ahead of Richmond it will be poetic justice given how badly we were bent over last year by the AFL - missing out on the PP at the top of the draft was the most disgraceful decision ever by the AFL. There was never a more deserving club than the Blues last year to get that pick.

However, tanking in round 8 isn't acceptable. If we have 4 wins by round 18-19, I wouldnt have a problem with playing only kids and playing full on attacking footy that doesn't necessarily give us the best chance of winning.

Comparing 10 wins in 2004 and 10 wins in 2007 is comparing apples and oranges.

2004: A team full of mature aged, recycled bodies that could steel a win here and there, but each win had no baring on where we were headed or impacted on development of the majority of players.

2007: A team full of young, highly talented players. The effect winning has on a young team is invaluble - it's called development.

Let me pose a question. Realistically we are going to finish at the best 12th/14th which means pick 3-5. So really all we are discussing here is ONE draft pick.

So the real questions are:

1) do you believe we have enough talent at the club now to go all way in 3-4 years time? And if not, will ONE extra pick in the 2007 draft make all the difference?

2) Do you believe the CFC is a great club? With the ability to produce (through development, trading, shrewed decision making and support) a winning team?

I would love the extra pick - no doubt. Who wouldn't. That's just another classy player that I can love as much as I do Murph, Gibbs and Walker. But realistically that one kid won't make the difference between winning a flag or not. It's all the other decisions the club makes over the next few years that will be the difference. Think about it, we were 10 minutes off losing Fevola a few years back. We got lucky getting Stevens and Scotland. We got unlucky getting Pagan (some might say). We got unlucky with the draft penalties. And so on and so forth.

History would show that draft picks don't win a premiership - just look at the WCE, Sydney and Port premiership teams over the past few years. It's about putting together a winning team - that has a balance of stars and solid/hard working players... that has a great game plan, has excellent team work, has a power forward and an strong backline. Has good coaching ... and as much as anything, has lots of luck with injuries.

I'm starting to think this deal looks good,depends on the game with the Kangaroos how we go if we lose that,our season would be close to over you would think, 2 wins 6 loses and we would be lucky to win several games later.

The thing is would you go watch a game Carlton play and go c'mon Carlton give them a goal,no no one will go see us play,the crowd will be just supporters from the other club. I just don't know how you could watch a game not wanting to win?

I believe this draft is great for Carlton if we can get it because i think we needed 2 more good drafts to replace the ones we missed and the early draft stuff up to get a good team.

It's just would be strange where are the Carlton fans at the football,would we be drinking and laughing yeh we lost you beauty,now if we could hire some dancing girls,where are the bluebirds,lol or anything that would get the guys interested going to the game while they sneak the good grog in and food and forget about the game and get a big crowd in so we dont get bored it would be great,sorry girls maybe you can get something similiar to stop being bored or whatever you like.

Nice to see you are coming around to my way of thinking Krusty - but you just missed the point of getting 2 first round draft picks this year - don't worry a bit more reading and COMPREHENSION and it will soon all become clear to you.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

What happens next year then AGRO? Do we play to win or play to lose for more draft picks? If we are as bad as some on here are making out then we will need to tank for the next three years - if that's the case I won't be watching.

Do you want us to hit the magic button next year and start winning on the back of another couple early draft picks? OR we will need to finish near the bottom again?

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world

Our list will determine where we finish.

We are short of quality mid-fielders and ruckmen.

Krusty would have us improve it with Pick 3 and Pick 19.

I think we are better off with Pick 1 and 4.

Krusty enjoyed the winning culture of 2004 - but we have won 2 wooden spoons since.

Krusty still thinks we have a sheaf of Form Fours at our disposal.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

I shouldn’t say never, but there is no chance that the priority pick rules will be changed this year. A change to these rules would require the approval of all 16 clubs and could only take effect from next year at the earliest. Although we are talking about jabba & co.

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C'mon Blueboys!

All I want to know is... How many teams that have received priority picks, or even gotten a spoon, have won a flag? That might prove just how successful this has been... Let's take all the emotion out of it, and have a good hard look at the statistics....

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What if everything is an illusion and nothing exists? In that case, I definitely overpaid for my carpet
Woody Allen

Nitpicking but wasnt Brennan delisted?

agro stop being a smart arse and actually read some other people's stuff. Otherwise we end up in the slagging match again.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Agro, I used to enjoy what you wrote and always had a giggle, but over the past couple of days mate, you are a new person. Has some-one taken over your login details, because you are sounding very much like Dr Jekly & Mr Hyde ( I can't remember which ones which) but you get the idea. Katse Kala.

agree with the above, enough of the name calling, whether we have pick 1 & 4 or pick 3 & 19 won't make the difference between 2009 being a good or average year.

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Between our dreams and actions lies this world

It’s the AFL’s fault that teams have to throw away games to earn the prestigious priority draft pick each year because if they are fairdinkum they should drop the priority pick all together and all picks in the draft should go in a ballot with teams that finished outside the eight should go in the first ballot, the other teams that finish outside the four should go in the next ballot and the top four teams regardless who wins the premiership should go in the last ballot.

Even if the AFL wants to compensate the bottom sides then the first ballot goes to the teams that finished in the bottom four instead of the bottom eight.

This way no team will have any incentive to throw away games for their own gains.

I agree. I'd even go as far as saying scrap the draft altogether. Keep the cap but let the clubs locate and recruit. Maybe via zones. It can work. Melbourne Storm can attract and keep non-Victorian players and are doing well.

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C'mon Blueboys!

Fitzroy 1916

West Coast PP 2003 got a gumby called Judd...

Sydney and all their zone selections...

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Cer 'ch 'n alluog Blues

that wasnt a PP.

that pick came after 1 of those wasted seasons, ya know where they came 14th won 5 games. pick #3

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thats pretty bad-ass!