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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 2:47 am 
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Rod Ashman
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Wolfe wrote:
Quite inpressed with clokes stats
16 possesions
12 hit outs
7 marks
2 tackles

Thats not bad for a second string ruckman

have to say none of our rucks where that damaging last year ie Maclaren / French or Bryan

Ackland similar though less marks
16 possesions
13 hitouts
1 mark

I will take 32 possesions and 25 hitouts from our 2 rucks


The difference is those guys really had no future only French was good.Maclaren really needs to lift this year,while Ackland i never really followed his game but early sign is ok. Cameron Cloke, i always felt he was just lazy footballer that needed a footy shock to get his best and at his best he could be a great player like Lawrence Angwin could have been.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 3:08 am 
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Rod Ashman
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95perfection wrote:
Just home from the game tonight.

Thought I would share a few observations of those things you can't see on the TV.

Backline:

We will struggle to get flogged by anyone this year and it will also be hard for teams to beat our backline.
So long as the midfield don't let the ball stream in uncontested as we did in the first 15 minutes on the 3rd quarter.
Backline looks very settled, tall enough to compete with any team and if not for a few shocking umpiring decisions, really dominated the Kangaroos forward line.
Setanta's closing speed to get to a contest is as good as I've seen by any backman in the 35 years I have been watching AFL. His reach to spoil is equally as good.
Disposal and particularly decision making needs a lot of work still however he is gaining confidence in this area. He is going to be a massive asset to the backline for a long time.
He was really helped out in the decision making area by the likes of AW, Hoops, Waitey (makings of the most attacking, damaging CHB in the competition after only 3 weeks there) and T-Bird as they were stream past for a handball more often than not. This takes the thought process away from Setanta (and the lack of kicking skill) and makes him very effective.
Rebounding from the backline should not be underestimated in tonights win. Very pleasing turnaround from our struggling backline of the past 5 years.

Midfield:
Still working each other out a bit but Geez-Louise we win the ball so much more than the opposition. AB & JR are very unassuming in the middle because they are the in-and-under hard ball get types.
They will make the likes of Murphy, Simmo, Gibbsy, Stevo, Carrazzo and Scotto look even better than we think they are because they seem to be on the right side of the pack to clear when the hard-ballers nip one out of the scrimmage.
But .... just when we looked to have the midfield working out how to play together and position for each other, we went and changed the whole team structure at the start of the 3rd quarter. To look across the whole field at that time we did look very unbalanced. Even to the naked eye it just looked really weird - something didn't look right. When we reordered things again the game turned in a heartbeat .... almost too late.

I must say that we really didn't look like we were getting smashed in general play even when the Roos got to 37 points up.
To be honest I didn't think we were that far out of it because we were by far the best team at that stage but just hadn't converted.
I wasn't checking the scoreboard during the early part of the 3rd and said to my wife "sh1t we need a goal to get the confidence back" then looked up at the scoreboard and couldn't believe we were 6 goals down.
We certainly hadn't played like a team who were 6 goals behind.

Anyway to complete my midfield assessment, I think we have a very good ruck team in Sugar & Cloke (maybe we should rename them Rum & Coke?).
They are not the tallest ruck duo but they are both very fit and strong bodied players. They were under-sized tonight but they crashed and muscled the leaner, taller ruckmen all night really wore them down to the point that they dominated in the last 30 minutes of the match.
Great foil over the next 2-3 years for the developing Hampson, Aisake and co.


Forward Line:
Interestingly enough our best area of the last few years looked to be struggling for a big part of the game. Actually looked as though they didn't know 1. where to lead without getting in each others way; and 2. where the ball carrier was going to kick too.
If not for poor execution and finish we should have been 3-4 goal up at half time because we had killed them around the ground.

Great captains effort in the forward line by Lance in the 3rd quarter when he sacrificed himself as a step-ladder for Fev to take Mark Of The Day and kick a goal which turned the game on it's head. Lance was taken off shortly after and did not return (not injured .... just dragged).

The momentum swang right there and then and we started to run off the opposition and made them look pedestrian. Passes started hitting targets, backline and midfield were streaming from everywhere.
You probably couldn't see on TV but when we started running we obviously looked very good, however we actually had 3 or 4 options through the midfield and up forward nearly every time.
I believe that it was having so many options and the quick, clean use of the ball that allowed Fev to be 1-out a lot more and the goals simply flowed.
Fev sensational with 8 but Eddie Betts was outstanding in the 2nd half. Good chasing by him to keep pressure on the rebounding backline right throughout the game (although he couldn't actually make a tackle a stationary wheat-bag) and really did some of the 1%ers.
Fev could take a leaf out of Eddie's book here and still needs to learn not to drop his head (we don't need a Richo at Carlton).


Some general observations:

I didn't agree with everything Synbad has written about Lance Whitnall - until tonight.
Regardless of his B&F win last year he looks the player most unlikely to have an impact in our team this year. Far, far too slow and can't get off the ground to get anywhere near taking a mark in the forward line.
No spot for him up forward if Fev & Kennedy are fit.
Can't see a spot in the backline the way the current setup looks as they are too tall, fast and are playing a running, rebounding style that he can't keep up with.
May captain from the bench a lot this year and would have to be lucky to hold down a spot in the first 18 without injuries to other players.
Could not see him being captain after this year as he won't be a regular starter.

Harts will be a huge asset if he stays fit because he is versatile. He and Waite can both play half-back/half-forward and be dangerous at either end. Harts shows he has the skill, body and intensity to make it big time. Hope his body hold together and has some better luck with injuries because he is a huge plus for us when fit. Very strong mark and good judge of the flight of the ball and jumps for it at the right time.

Special mention to Cam Cloke.
Was not a fan of picking him up pre-season but given a Navy Blue jumper I was prepared to give him a go and not bag him.
He was thrown into the game during the first half and had only been on for what seemed to be about 5-minutes when he got dragged. He looked a bit disappointed to be dragged but did the team thing and absolutely sprinted about 100m to the boundary for the interchange. Did the team thing, kept his head up, did what was asked and waited his turn again without sulking or carrying on.
When given the chance again in the 3rd quarter I would say that his effort and intensity level played a big part in the comeback and should not be underestimated. He really looks like he wants to be a Blue-bagger and stick it up everyone who said he can't make it.
If he isn't BOG when we play Collingwood I will be very surprised.
Has a point to prove and is playing like it as well. I'm converted.

Mr Caz is spot on to say that midfield delivery made Fev look good. The standard of delivery lifted in the last 30 minutes to a level I have not seen for a number of years.
But the midfield also has to take credit for pressure, harassing, chasing and simply winning the ball at the contest. We must have won centre clearances for the first time since I can remember and I saw a few Gibbs to Murphy and vice-verca plays that made my mouth water.
Mr Caz also said Gibbs first 2 touches were worth the price of admission .... I paid $75 for me and my missus to get the best seats in the stadium and could have gone home after 5-minutes a happy man feeling like I got my monies worth.

........ and Murph ....... pure silk - total class - next captain.

If anyone has any specific questions about players I haven't mentioned or anything that you may not have caught on the box, let me know.


Final word ...... refer to signature block below


Now with Whitnall,it's early days but i did say it would get tough for him,because he played as defender in a team last year saving games not winning games,he was good especially the first half.

the team now have Walker and Waite who like to attack and chase their opponent with the ball a big bonus and a big difference,that puts Whitnall some where now in the forward line,but his position is best at Full forward where Fevola will always be,where he doesn't have to chase so hard if the ball doesn't sit for him. Whitnall playing at CHF it's harder,but we like Kennedy there.

The best thing for Whitnall is for him to get extremely fit to play,probably the fittest he has been in years and not worry about his personal life or you might see him on the bench replacing someone to give them a break.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 5:27 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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2002 National Draft

Selection #2 Daniel Wells Kangaroos
Selection #45 Kade Simpson Carlton



HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 6:16 am 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Two less obvious highlights from the game

Murphy's (almost) magnificent mark 8)

Santy's agro at giving away free kicks. Holy shit, I thought he was going to kill Thompson after one of the push in the backs. Is this guy desperate to win or what?

Talk about guys unlucky to be left out of the leadership group...

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 6:27 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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TruBlueBrad wrote:
Murphy's (almost) magnificent mark 8)


point a) It was a bloody mark. The officials still hate our guts.

point b) Smorgo would have loved it :-D

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 6:42 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Bunks wrote:
Hey 95Perfection - thanks so much for the thorough update from the game last night.

I was especially interested to read your comments re: Lance. I am living in the USA this year so obviously don't hear much and certainly don't get to see any highlights. I had noticed though that his name hadn't been mentioned in any of the match reports. Is he struggling that much? Where will they slot him in? You can't have the captain out of the team all year. It'll be interesting to see how he goes this year.

Take it easy. I wear my Carlton guernsey over here and get the strangest looks!


No matter how much Lance tries to improve he might play the odd good game sneaking away while others do all the hard work.
The game is increasingly played at breakneck speed.
Lance is washed up in this game and those that didnt recognise the trend of the game around the club and make the decision with him should hang their heads in shame.

Its lightning quick out there.
And its only going to get quicker.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 7:53 am 
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Craig Bradley

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Lots of good things

Houlihan played his best game. Looks stronger and with a beefed up midfield can now play wing where he can cause more damage.

Russell Will become a premium tagger this year. Will probably get Power. He is quick but tall as well. Did well on Harvey. Looks like he believes in himself.

Cloke and Ackland. Give us more run around the ground and grunt. Still think we should play Hampson in a few games. Sandilands and Cox will destroy us out of the centre when we play them.

Hartlett Yep finally got a sneak preview about this guy. Gives us grunt .Impressive.

Midfield much better.

Defence the best bit. Dont you love what Carlos brings to the team. He matches up well on all forwards although might be tested on say Lynch who is a strong unit. But it means that Thornton can play up further and use his creativity.

Betts is fantastic

Waite in defence is good

Fev was great tonight .Its ok to tell your teammates off if they [REDACTED] the kick to him on occasions. Would of made a better captain than Whitnall.



Lets not get carried away. We have played 3 teams that are predicted to finish in the bottom 8 and Brisbane as well is not tipped to do much this year.

But we have improved .We were not far away last year. There was a few games we could of won if it wasnt for poor periods. If our defence holds up this will happen less. Carlos and Waite have made a huge impact down there. Hopefully Bower can find a place down there as well.

I have a flower family dinner to go there so I cant go. Spewing but I reckon we will win. Does anyone know if Brown and Bradshaw will play. Would love to see Hartlett on Brown and Carlos on Bradshaw.


The pieces of the jigsaw are slowly falling into place. Go Blues.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 8:58 am 
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Harry Vallence

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For me, besides Fev, I thought Eddie Betts and Cloke were best on ground.

1. Fev
2. Betts
3. Cloke
4. Stevens
5. Santa/Walker

Betts work rate was unbelievable. He was everywhere and just tried his heart out. He's offense was great, but his one percenters (chase, tackling, positioning, etc) was suberb.

Cloke gave us a contest at every stoppage and won plenty of hit outs plus did extremely well around the ground. I am actually really liking this guy - and thats hard to admit after being so unhappy about drafting him. Could become one of my favs.

And special mention for Skinny. Still one of my favourite players. His use of the pill, evassive skills and decision making is first rate. He might not have had killer stats, but every stat he did have was silky. Really helped us back in the game with his poise and experience.

The two tricky ones in the team for me are Bentick and Lance. I will admit that I am not a huge fan of Bentick. I really want to be, but I just think with his deficiencies that he will struggle against the tough, quick opposition midfielders. And his in and under stuff is not good enough (yet) to warrant a position. Yes he tries his heart out and is tough as nails, but his positioning and ability to get free after getting the pill is sub-par. Last week he was very poor and his first half today was the same. Excellent in the second half, but thats when the Roos runners had stopped.

What I find interesting is that the same guys that think Bentick is in our best midfield line up, also think that Lance is history. Both Lance and Bentick are slow . Both are also hard at it - but the difference is Lance plays in a position where it's not as important to be super quick. I know its important to be quick these days in all positions, but its not as bad in key attacking posts. Midfield - pace is essential and Bentick doesn't have any. Yes he is hard at it, but his decision making and quick reflexes are not up to it right now. He was very poor in the first half while the game was frantic and the opposition were running hard. When the game slowed down in the second half and Carlton got on top Bentick came good. Yes I think he helped out, but he wasn't the main cause. He benefited alot from the Roos basically stopping. Bentick needs to learn how to get his arms free when tackled and dish the ball off... ala Scotland, Murphy, Stevens, Kouta, Lappin, etc. He too often gets caught and just ducks the head and holds the ball in.

Lance will fight back, I have faith. While oppositions worry about Fev and Kennedy, Lance will get the third best opposition defender and will use his smarts to great affect to make them pay. Positioning is more important than pace for a key forward, and Lance does that better than most. I expect him to come back strongly and be a key player for us as half forward.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 9:24 am 
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Trevor Keogh

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nytdog wrote:
The two tricky ones in the team for me are Bentick and Lance. I will admit that I am not a huge fan of Bentick. I really want to be, but I just think with his deficiencies that he will struggle against the tough, quick opposition midfielders. And his in and under stuff is not good enough (yet) to warrant a position. Yes he tries his heart out and is tough as nails, but his positioning and ability to get free after getting the pill is sub-par. Last week he was very poor and his first half today was the same. Excellent in the second half, but thats when the Roos runners had stopped.


The only place that pace doesn't matter is on the bottom of a pack. Everywhere else pace is important. I'm not as worried about Whitnall as some, he had a limited pre-season so I'm going to wait until round 4 to 6 before I'd look too hard at his contributions. But his lack of pace is just as much a deficiency as Bentick's, but in the end deficiencies are irrelevant, it's about what you achieve on the field, not how many black marks internet supporters can put against your name.

Bentick is an easy player to pick on, because his deficiencies are obvious, and his contributions are often hard to spot. But his strength and toughness around the ball is vital and we're a much better side with him in. He's never going to look slick, he's never going to have the "huge upside" that everyone loves about the kids, but he's still young and if he continues to improve then there is definitely a spot in the navy blue for him.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 9:31 am 
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Craig Bradley
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TruBlueBrad wrote:

Santy's agro at giving away free kicks. Holy shit, I thought he was going to kill Thompson after one of the push in the backs. Is this guy desperate to win or what?


Should henceforth become known as "The Santy Tanty"!


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 9:45 am 
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formerly BlueRob
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Somehow I want to squeeze Blackwell and Kennedy into that side.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 9:48 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Phewwww................

until those last three words............i was wondering BlueRob.......!


kindest regards tommi

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 9:58 am 
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Horrie Clover
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Taff wrote:
Andain wrote:
It does feel like a final quarter fightback doesn't it?


The lads have lifted - here's hoping for a big effort in the last. Haven't heard Gibbs mentioned - how much time has he spent on the ground?


Gibbs spent a lot of time running up and down the boundary line


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 10:03 am 
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Bruce Doull
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With 8 mins to go, the Fox commentators have written us off. Comments like "In the next while, Denis Pagan will be interested in the performance of the Carlton youngsters"

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 10:09 am 
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Rod Ashman
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Synbad wrote:

No matter how much Lance tries to improve .


Doesn't look like he's been trying that hard judging by his physical condition. On the bright side, he did provide something soft for Fevola to land on.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 10:10 am 
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Wayne Johnston

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95perfection wrote:
Backline looks very settled, tall enough to compete with any team


I agree we're looking good with our tall defenders. Still think we need another couple of small defenders to step up. We can really struggle with these quick and creative forwards. And it would be nice to have the luxury of using Scotland, Houlihan, etc. purely as part of our midfield rotation.

Preferably a medium defender with real speed and really skilful disposal. It would be nice if our midfielders didn't have to take the kick outs (or if they could groom Setanta or Hartlett to take them).


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 10:14 am 
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Bruce Doull
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blu944 wrote:
On the bright side, he did provide something soft for Fevola to land on.


:lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 10:20 am 
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Garry Crane
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Bunks wrote:
Hey 95Perfection - thanks so much for the thorough update from the game last night.

I was especially interested to read your comments re: Lance. I am living in the USA this year so obviously don't hear much and certainly don't get to see any highlights. I had noticed though that his name hadn't been mentioned in any of the match reports. Is he struggling that much? Where will they slot him in? You can't have the captain out of the team all year. It'll be interesting to see how he goes this year.

Take it easy. I wear my Carlton guernsey over here and get the strangest looks!


Struggling = absolutely

I tried hard to look beyond where the ball was last night to get a perspective of players running to space and running to pick up loose men when the opposition had it.

It is said he has a good football brain ???
Looked like he didn't know what was going on in attack - couldn't get near the ball.
Defending (ie. chasing, tackling when coming out of defense) - he is supposed to be fitter this pre-season than he has been for a long time, but he couldn't catch a St Kilda tram with 5 minutes head start.

Where will they slot him in?
Unfortunately because they have made him Captain he will probably start each week which will only hold up a spot for someone who deserves it.
With any luck though, I think he'll spend plenty of time on the bench unless we have an injury to a key position player or someone else is horribly out of form.

Doubt they will remove him from captain during the year because that would be openly admitting we made a mistake. Surely couldn't/shouldn't/wouldn't be skipper again next year.

I've always been a fan of Lance's in the past but I agree with Synners now - the game has passed him by as a front line player.

Cheers - 95

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 10:27 am 
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Harry Vallence

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Kaptain Kouta wrote:
With 8 mins to go, the Fox commentators have written us off. Comments like "In the next while, Denis Pagan will be interested in the performance of the Carlton youngsters"


It was in the 3rd quarter and we were 37 points down. I was thinking the same thing myself, that it would be interesting to see how the young players reacted to the situation and they came through with flying colours. I don't see how that can be misconstrued as writing the team off.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 10:31 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Noonamah Blue wrote:
Kaptain Kouta wrote:
With 8 mins to go, the Fox commentators have written us off. Comments like "In the next while, Denis Pagan will be interested in the performance of the Carlton youngsters"


It was in the 3rd quarter and we were 37 points down. I was thinking the same thing myself, that it would be interesting to see how the young players reacted to the situation and they came through with flying colours. I don't see how that can be misconstrued as writing the team off.


No, I don't think Denis wrote us off, but I could hear a tone in the Commentators' voices that we were gone, and it was now a matter of how well we fought out the match, but they didn't expect us to get back to level, let alone win.

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