Had posted this on TVB, it doesn't really matter... I don't post much on either site, but here goes anyways...

Tonight, after I got back from the Melbourne game, a friend called me up and told me Silvani said something shocking at the best and fairest... I think he was a bit pissed and didn't really know what he was talking about, but I figured it was what Kernahan said anyways...

After hearing the coverage of the B&F, I starting to feel that we are actually moving forward...maybe for the first time in five years, maybe in ten...

Denis' speech really got me worked up...

To people who think Denis should be gone, personally, I think you are moronic. He's what, one of two people at the whole club who have actually been associated with a premiership side!

He's the best thing thats happened for us in God knows how long, and if you can't see it, you (again, in my opinion) are blind.

He read a list of players who have worn the navy blue jumper, and maybe he only knows a few of them himself, maybe a few by reputation around Princes Park, but damn, did he read them with passion.

Like Fev said, like my mother says, the ex-players who apparently will be back on board the second Pagan is gone are the root of all evil at Carlton. If they really cared so much, they wouldn't be playing personality politics with something so important to everyone, they would help. For my part, the likes of fraser brown can go and make another million, and stick it up their arse!

Who really cares about the bloody board? Who gives a rats about a pack of tossers sitting around a table...thats not the Carlton Football Club. The Carlton Football Club is about people who love the club, like Sticks, who will DO WHATS BEST FOR THE CLUB, regardless of their personal and petty beliefs.

I think we have no confidence. Full stop.

get it back, and we will be flying. This is the wake up call we needed. No more, no less. So Carlton supporters should stop jumping around like halfwits and wait and see what happens.

I hope Pagan stays, and isn't sacked like some people hope, and imagine he will be. Have faith, because i think denis is more carlton than alot of people give him credit for.

I think the progress Denis Pagan is making with the carlton list is
unbelievable. Players like O'hAilpin, Simpson, Walker, Whitnall and even
Fevola are a testament to that.

You bring in a new coach, and they are bound to make changes...whether it be to the list, or how they want the guys to play. I don't want to see
anything change,I want to see these players develop the way denis is
showing them.

I want to see us win again, and I want to run up and down Lygon street off my rocker when we do...

I hope.

Yes, I don't want any change either - let's just keep on winning those wooden spoons.

P.S. Rhetoric doesn't win premierships.

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NOW YOU'RE JUST SOME CLUB THAT I USED TO KNOW.

and internal squabbling does?

So what did he say?

Kernahan slagged off some journalists.

Nice one, Sticks.

Let's shoot the messengers.

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NOW YOU'RE JUST SOME CLUB THAT I USED TO KNOW.

You dont want change?

Our players are being deprived of tactical education and the ability to enjoy their football and you want to happily sail along as we are?

Who cares if Pagan can get up and recite past champions?
I'll bet Barb Carlson could too but I'm not going to make her coach.
I'm glad Denis' speech got you worked up.

Pouring money into a club that accepts sub standard coaching and pays 600k for the priveledge gets me worked up.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Going to be sensational. Denis plays under a Board that wanted him gone, players that he has completely lost, ex-players who want to see the back of him to ther point of putting up their own money. Surely his position is untenable. And he's going to work through that? For the sake of stability he needed to go. This could well have the makings of an absolute disaster.

I'm guessing they'll be challenge to the Board this year. That means Pagan's gone as a new Board, which would be a near certainty, would send him packing.

This doesn't help the anti-slash and burn argument.

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29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.

worst thread in the history of this and related sites

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Love Cricket? Love me

Apparently I'm moronic and blind by having an alternative view.

no wonder I'm not feeling so well.

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This might sound extreme in the context of alleged sexual assault, drunken violence and a drug trafficking charge...

Say five 'Hail Pagan's and all will be well

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George Harris came to power after a squabble.

And Nero fiddled ...

There are many who can see things which are wrong ... funny thing is, most of the people who see things wrong with the coaching are those who are more concerned with issues other than the scoreboard on game day.

My "what's better: poos or wees?" would have to be a contender.

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Richard Pratt - A Carlton legend.

Nah - this tops it.

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“When a clown moves into a palace, he doesn't become a king. The palace turns into a circus.”
Turkish Proverb

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Richard Pratt - A Carlton legend.

No, I actually think its the same thread.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

the ex-players who apparently will be back on board the second Pagan is gone are the root of all evil at Carlton. If they really cared so much, they wouldn't be playing personality politics with something so important to everyone, they would help. For my part, the likes of fraser brown can go and make another million, and stick it up their arse!


This post actually demonstrates one of the main things wrong with our club, the former players who have been noticable by their absence, and who think that they can come in and buy out a coach! But where have they been for the past few years? Have they been mentoring the young players? Have they been seen around the club offering some hope?

I grew up in this club, and spent a lot of time listening to some of the 'greats' encouraging players, willing them to do better, and during the 70s and 80s we won. The culture was different, the passion was there and the proof was on the field.

So stop knocking someone who speaks with passion! I agree, passion won't win us games but believe me it goes a lot way to help make a club great and successful.

I think Brown and the ex-players distance from the club is actually a damning indictment on the Board and the coach .

The way I read it since JE was ousted (and the money stuff and all that came tumbling out) the players of that era seem to have become seperated from the club.

I wonder if somehow they feel blamed or unwelcome at the club when the new Board took over. Perhapos the Board did not want anything to do with them, a Pontius Pilate(?) washing of the hands? Was Brown pushed away because he would not talk toi the AFL but our Board needed to be chummy with the Commish?

Does Denis encourage the players from the past input? Not once or twice but all the time. Is the club a place you can 'drop into' and see what's happeneing, ask 'how can I help?'

Does the Board?

Have these recently retired players felt alienated and disenchanted with the club for a few years but time has healed some of their disappointment?

So here they make a move to try and show they would love to come back either through committing money (Brown)

or time (Rats, Braddles etc)

Would they all be paid? Or would having one or two of them on Board as assistants then draw many more of them back?

Was this an attempt to reunite the club but the Board handled it so poorly Brown and others are now the scapegoats? Is this a case of 'Club heal thyself' and we failed?

Was Brown approached? Or did he approach the club?

If he was approached why are people angry with him?

What if Bear said to Browny - 'shit mate the kids hate Denis and the club wants us to get rid of him but there's that money hanging over our heads.'

'So who do you want to replace him with Bear?'

"They'll play for Mitch!'

'Well you take care of Mitch we'll take care of the cash.'

Then other players heard and lent their support?

Do we know it did not happen this way? Do we know it was not from the Board to Brown and back again?

So why the attack on Brown?


Mad Dog bleeds Blue and it would be shitting him no end seeing this club stumble about. Worse he would feel for the kids if they did not like the coach and he would be aware of Rats and Braddles and others views on Denis.

He tried to do something about it. Either generated by the Board (or contacts around the club) or by his own love of the club.

I want more mad dogs please and less people who accept this state as it currently stands.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

here here

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Ich bein ein Carltonian