From reading certain posts in these forums I think it is disgusting how some "genuiine supporters" can be so critical of our players... criticising Whitnall's weight, calling him an embarassment, for goodness sake, do you stop and think that these players possibly READ these posts,... any wonder it is in the news that many AFL players end up suffering with depression.

Also, when I read posts bagging kids that are new, developing, trying to improve, how on earth is Carlton going to improve when these posts do nothing but deplete certain players emotions... lets give players support and encouragement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't get it. Your post has nothing to do with sacking Pagan.

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

Support and encouragement is great to a point, but at what point do you stop, reassess, and work out who can and can't cut it at this level?

Blatant bagging, fine, but a lot of criticism is pretty constructive about what players need to do or change to survive at this level.

This is elite sport. It's not social work. Sportspeople are by definition competitive and harbour a fierce desire to win. What some see as bagging, others see as identifying the limitations our players, coaching staff and club as a whole need to address to make that desire to win an actuality.

Those dishing out baseless bagging are generally brought to account by other posters, such that those people become a minority.

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Congratulations CK95

If the criticism is constructive, what is being constructed?

Well, yours is a constructive post.....

There is a different between constructive and construction, verbs.

CONSTRUCTIVE: helping to improve; promoting further development or advancement (opposed to destructive). ie: constructive criticism.

CONSTRUCTION: the act or art of constructing; The way in which a thing is constructed:

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

I think you'll find the definition of constructive to be:

"constructing or tending to construct or improve or promote development; "constructive criticism"; "a constructive attitude"; "a constructive philosophy"; "constructive permission"

My question is, what is the criticism actually "constructing" or "improving" or "premoting"?

My answer is absolutely nothing.

It could be that the constructive criticism is aimed to help promote the development of the playing list at Carlton, and is mostly posted out of frustration by posters for two reasons: To vent their frustrations about particular aspects of the gameplan, coaching, particular players' habits and style; and the vain hope that maybe, just maybe, someone somewhere inside the club reads posts like that, and uses little bits to help the Team and Club develop.

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

The way I see it is something like:

Player X is a shithouse player

is quite different to

Player X can become a better player by improving his kicking and disposal

One is constructing a case that says how improvement can be made. The other is blatant criticism.

You love this stuff verbs.

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Congratulations CK95

you are both right and wrong verbs

right in that it is constructing nothing in the reality of the situation - the player receives nothing, the club zilch, the coach zero etc.

However it can be constructive as in 'soundly' based rather than criticism for criticism's sake.

So to talk about Kouta's (for example) inability to man up and how we then need to pick players to man up - in reality offers nothing contructive to the reality of the club

it is constructive in terms of a debate about what are the percieved flaws of player x or team y.

so long as we remember what we say has no bearing except in our own inner (inflated) worlds we can still 'constuct' arguments withjout expecting those arguments to have any real meaning.

Bit like saying Pluto is not a planet - I am sure Pluto doesn't give @#$%&!.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Player X can become a better player by improving his kicking and disposal

That's not really criticism as such, it's stating the bleeding obvious. Every player can become better by improving their kicking and disposal.

The original poster is talking about criticism, which is has more to do with personal frustrations than anything constructive.

Constructive, destructive, rational, irrational, biased, impartial, agendas, passion, and plain old Bullshit!!! You’ll find it all here.
You can’t afford to be too fragile or thin skinned if you hang around this forum. Use it to satisfy your own needs.
I admire Lance, Stevo, Kouta & Denis. Try starting a positive thread on any of them and you need to put on some body armour. You will cop it without fail!! I think that it’s half the fun of coming here.

There are a hell of a lot good reasons to visit TC. You occasionally need a thick skin, that’s all!!

Indeed. I offer no opinion on as to why people feel the need to criticise or relieve their frustrations, as there are so many people posting on here and every one of them would have completely different reasons/circumstances/motives.

I do find it hard to work out how any of it can be constructive, and conversely how any of it could be destructive. As danny said, Pluto wouldn't even know the little Earthlings don't want to call it a planet any more. And do you think Pluto will change as a result? Or just keep spinning around the sun like it has done for years?

I have heard supporters and commentators call Lappin "Skinny".
Nice way to give him an eating disorder you b@$tards.
Maybe he can deal with it now, but when he grows up he might become a headcase like Akermanis or a Hawthorn disgard.

Lappin is body mass gravitationally challenged - not skinny

..........and so is Fisher !! PUT ON SOME @#$%&! WEIGHT, BOY.

Is that constructive??

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end of message

This thread is hilarious.

Thanks for the diversion...

now...

Is Pagan sacked yet?

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Formerly: Ackland the Wonderkid / Army the Wonderkid / quivering mess / molsey / Tony Lynn Fan Club

I'm Wild about this dude called Blueyonder.

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This might sound extreme in the context of alleged sexual assault, drunken violence and a drug trafficking charge...

That's postconstructuralism, Verbs. Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

Wild Blueyonder,

My sincerest apologies for making my username blueyonder, I didn't realise there was also another person called "Wild Blueyonder", I am sure readers would realise that we are not the same person because you have the word "Wild" in front of your name.