for me

Sporn
Davies
Prenda (sad as well, guy busts his balls but aint good enough)
Chambers
Longmuir
Livingston
Teague
Batson (not retained, not good enough)

Bryan is lucky barney retired.

Prendergast
Teague
Davies
Chambers
Longmuir
Saddington
Bannister
Livingston
McGrath

all should go, not all will. i expect us to probably retain the services of:
Saddington
Bannister
McGrath

but all three will go next year.

as stated previously, Chris Bryan is extremely lucky that Bananananananaby retired.

i expect us to give senior spots to Aisake, Smith and Flint. Batson will be gone, Jackson will be retained and we will load up fresh with rookies.

If all can get fit and in form, a backline of:
Thornton
Hartlett
Bower
Flint
Lappin
O'hAilpin

looks fairly impressive.

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Back like a raging case of pubic lice

End 2006, let the cull begin.

French = Pick 1
Davies = Pick 17
Chambers = Pick 18
Longmuir = Pick 35
Livingstone = Pick 49
Prendergast= Pick 66
McGrath= PSD
Sporn = Promote Smith
Bryan ?= Promote Batson ? (unless there's a new ruck recruit)

We have the option to retain Jackson, Flint and Aisake on the rookie list one more year (inevitably there will be a LTI listed)....Maybe Aisake will replace Batson. I don't know much about Batson, except he kicks goals as a forward in the Ants ressies..

(Wildcard...what if there's a good opportunity to take a 2nd PSD? Then we look at delisting one of the uncontacted players retained till end of 2007's clean out.)

Whilst I'd like to retain Prenders and Sporn as a utility, it's culling time.

End 2007, the end of the clean out

1.Kouta (end of contract)
2.Saddington (end of contract)
3.Lappin (end of contract)
4.Teague (end of contract)

and unless they show something out of the ordinary:

1.Wiggins
2.Bannister
3.Smith
4.Batson

and maybe

DeLuca (although I think he is still developing) if he hasn't retired.

I've had the above on my discard list since the half year break, and there's no surprises. I think we all agree that it is cull time, but we don't have to complete the cull till just before the PSD. We must take as many as we can from this year's draft!! We must find 2 new ruckmen. Aisake will make it in 2008, but wont feel comfortable in the position as a ruckman till 2009.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Chambers becomes Pick 19, the scum get pick 18 as their PP.

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“It is a state of mind, a system of belief, a way of seeing the world, a deep faith that, because you are Carlton, you belong to something great.” - Mike Fitzpatrick articulating what Out of the Blue means.

Given the way Teague played yesterday I would be paying out his contract to get him off the list for next year...tries hard but the game is past him

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Cheerio to my friends KN, BC, TT, GP, DK, AE, MS, SC, TC, JL, MO & LF

Graeme Smorgan said before the Melbourne win I think, that 8 or 9 players will be delisted or the list will be turned over with 8 or 9 nine changes. So I think there'll be wholesale changes and don't think they're not looking at the coaching department.

8 or 9 sounds about right. Gives us 5 draft picks in the top 50 or so, a PSD pick, a couple of rookie elevations and perhaps even a trade.

i my opinion thats just cutting too deep, but sadly we do have a lot of deadwood on our list.

guys like sporn, banno, deluca and mcgrath will probably be retained unless they are forced out due to other deadwood still being contracted and the club not being prepared to pay them out (ie teague).
ypu cant cut a thrid of the list in one go given the tender age of our list already IMO.

unless some of the spots are filled with other mature retreads but then the cycle continues and they would only be 'stop gap' measures. which to a small degree we probably will need.

I'd delist the following:
Chambers
Longmuier
French (Retired)
Teague
Prenda
Davies
Livingston
Saddington

thats picks 1,17,19,34,50
PSD 1
Promote: Jackson, Smith

consider trading Houla, Fisher and or Waite assuming we can get something of decent value back.

Stevens i've been dissapointed with but i think we need to persist with him.

Lance has missed the trade boat and i'm happy for him to stay.

I agree with Gezman.

French (retired)
Davies
Longmuir
Chambers
Livingston
Prendergast
Teague (provided no contractual problems)
Saddington (provided no contractual problems)

I would like to see Spornie retained as he has had recent good performances for the Bullies and the Blues. Banno, McGrath, DeLuca and Bryan likewise have all shown something and should have one more year to show what they have to offer.

Like Barnaby French a few years back.. I'm hoping McClaren can take Barneys lead and take over the No.1 ruck duties.. French took a year before he settled in at the club.. He then become a very solid player for us for a few years..

It's a bit of an ask but i'm hoping McClaren can do the same..

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Corinthians 9:6- 8

I'd love to give Hartlett a chance to get on the park but I fear it might take several years. Setanta and Bower have taken his spot in our defense and look like keeping it making him redundant. His kicking is a worry and we don't need him as a forward. Sometimes players just don't make it. It also worrys me that his main claim to fame is a performance in a preseason match where he got absolutely thrashed by Warren Tredrea.

I like Russell. He has all the tools to make it at the highest level. He just needs confidence and a bit of time.

I was a Houla fan early this year, one of his strongest supporters. But it has just become harder and harder to defend his efforts of late and now I just want him gone. The amount of times I've watched him kicking it up into the air giving the opposition an easy spoil time and time again instead of just hitting a simple target Marc Murphy could hit in his sleep blindfolded... He's a hack plain and simple.

Here's a question for you my genius friend, how often do you go watch Carlton live?

I wasn't defending Houla's spot on the list just the fact that you think he should be delisted and thrown out with the trash. Even Fiora got the Tigers something in a trade and I wanted him packaged with another pick to possibly upgrade it.

Hartlett should be given time to get his body right after having two injury riddled years at the Blues. Thornton was on Tredrea as well for a good part of that game and judging him on a pre-season belting where he was matched up against a superstar for half a game is gold.

He's shown more than Livo has at the same age with his ability to kick 50 metres plus and Adam at least has genuine size for a KPP.

And Agro.

Bower was playing on O'Loughlin yesterday and I don't think he would have been Hartlett's opponent yesterday.

Do we have so much talent on our list that we can afford to trash kids after only two seasons?

Interesting to see the outcome if we get a new Coach in Mitchell. Would obviously feel some of the out of favour players would be in his plans next year. MY gut feeling would be Predengast and Sporn would be kept.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888

I'm not sure how people can say Russell and Hartlet should be delisted when we still have

Chris Bryan
Adrian Deluca
David Teague
Jason Saddington
Dylan McLaren
Callum Chambers
Troy Longmuir
Cory McGrath

on the list

And they're still both young..........

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"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch

What did I say???

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

I was thinking that aswell...

If Mitchell is coaching Carlton he might retain these players because he has coached them in the Bullants, and they do perforn well under him. He might think he can turn these players around.....

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"Dont count the games, make the games count"

The following players will get delisted:

1) Bryan
2) Chambers
3) Davies
4) French
5)Livingston
6) Longmuir
7) Prendergast
Saddington
9) Teague


Other possibilties are Bannister, McGrath and Wiggins.

Possibilities of getting traded are:
1) Houlihan (Possibly a trade with Freo for Polak)
2) Sporn
3) Waite (Good player but may be traded whilst his stock is still high, unless he can change his game and become a midfielder/wingman again)

It would be a smart move to delist Saddington and Teague even though we will have to pay their contracts next year. This way we can still pay our young list small wages and still pay the minimum of 92.5% of the salary cap. It will make things easier to have lower contracts for the rest of the team when it comes time for them to ask for bigger dollars as they get better.

Aisake I think will have to be out in the senior list if when want to keep him. I think that we can only keep players on the rookie list for 2 years. Unless we can get a marquee player with the number PSD pick, I think that we will go for a young ruckman like Meesen or Wood.


Has anyone heard how Meesen has been going lately?

Where did I say that I was judging him solely on that one game? I'm judging him on what he's done since, which is nothing. Regardless he's got an extra year to show us what he's got but I'm betting he'll find it hard to force his way into the seniors with Bower, O'hAilpin and Kennedy all jumping ahead of him in the pecking order (even if he doesn't get injuried again and we don't pick up Hansen). If he still playing with the Bullants this time next year he'll struggle to stay on the list.

Joe Jazz,

As an international rookie Aisake can be on the rookie list for 3 years. I don't know if Teague and Saddington will be delisted as I think that their contracts will keep them on the list 1 more year. Could be up to 10 changes to the list (I think most of us could guess who they are) with 2 or 3 possible rookie promotions. From all reports Flint and Jackson will be promoted but I'm not sure about Smith. as his lack of pace may count againts him.

One pick retained for the PSD and 6 draft picks with 3 inside the first 2 rounds should enable us to add some more youngsters with pace and skill to the list.

Well seasons over and we know who is coach. We don't know if Pagan has control over list management, but I believe he will decide who stays and who goes. So this is my list changes for 2007:

French - Retired
Chambers - Delisted (If he doesn't fumble the paperwork)
Longmuir - Delisted
Davies - Delisted
Prendergast - Delisted
Livingston - Delisted
Bryan - Delisted (Not a Denis type - IMO our number 1 ruckman now)
Saddington - Contract Payed Out.
Teague - Contract Payed Out

Lucky to stay:

Bannister - Some good performances during his extended run in the seniors will give him another year.

Deluca - For some reason Denis sees talent in this guy. With French retiring he will be kept as insurance IMO. Poor decision if so.

McGrath - Next year will be his last. Has given his all since arriving, but is only going to be a top up player when the kids come on.


Promote:

Jackson
Flint

So leaves us with 7 draft picks, 6 in national draft and 1 PSD. I wouldn't think Pagan will renew Batson and Smith's rookie contracts. Jnr Carlos remains under the international rookie list so we should be able to recruit 5 rookies next year including 1 over 23.

If Pagan wants a mature body for next season, he has the option now with the over 23 pick instead of wasting a primary list spot in place of a youngster.

Interesting to note we will only have 4 players over 26 if these changes take place. Remove McGrath and we seriously have a young list that Pagan has two years to take somewhere.

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Mjonc signing off at 8888