You only live in the present for a dynamic second before youre into the future.. and the present is gone...and if you havent planned for the future.. youre [REDACTED]!!!

Simple as that...

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Firstly, I am very glad you are a Carlton supporter. We need all types no matter shape/size/attitude/gender/nationality/IQ. I am pleased to have you on board.

Secondly, I don't think you love Carlton, I think what you love is the banter with other supporters, going to a game and having someone to cheer for. This 'a true supporter wouldn't want to lose' is the mentality of someone who is insecure with themselves as a supporter, someone who is unsure about their understanding of football or just someone who has little clue at all. There is no logical rational for it, if you can convince yourself in your own mind you are a better supporter than someone who has followed Carlton ever since they could speak just because you go to a game and yell out 'go carlton' you have some internal issues that need resolving. And I honestly can't believe a TRUE supporter would want to finish with more than 20 points this year given where we have been, not that there is much chance of it happening anyway.

Thirdly, Bluechick1212121 its 3 hours before the game. Think of the win like a piece of cake, it's so tempting to eat it now but you know it's going to make you unhappy down the track - you could argue a stupid person just eats the cake and doesn't realise the consequences. As Fremantle kick ahead in the third quarter I want you to think of me watching the game with a big grin on my face.

As for Hansen or Gibbs, I'm more concerned with finishing the year with 16 points or less so that if we are sitting at 1-6 after seven rounds next year we will have access to two of the best kids in the country. If Gibbs is going to be a Nathan Buckley I'd take him over the best full back in the world. I'm not qualified to judge so I rarely talk about who we should be taking. We are putting together an independent panel to tell us which of our father/son's is the best player and that makes me pretty nervous in itself.

Carlton God
Freo way to go
Hitt 'em real hard da da da da

No some people around here will be unhappy if we win today.

They want us to have #1 pick in the PSD so we get another Dylan Mclaren.

Good stuff!

I can't believe I just wasted my time reading that. Seriously. That is a load of shit. Supporters barrack for their team no matter how bad they are. If you want us to lose just for PPs, then you have got to be kidding me. Go support Essendon* and don't call yourself a Carlton fan.

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Loyal & Proud

Got a text from an Essenscum mate last night asking if I want the spoon now or later. I've already received 2 of them from this guy the last few years. I really want to get revenge. I'd paint the thing red and black and put a picture of Lloyd on it.

Go Blues!

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"We used to sit around and talk about how bad the game plan was." Anthony Koutoufides

You keep supporting too. Don't worry about the w@nkers. You have to wonder when some dill says you don't really love Carlton because your ACTUALLY have the"gall" to want them to win in a game. Gee, the one second round pick we'd miss out on if we won another couple of games will really make a huge difference to our fortunes in the future, especially given 2nd round picks can be a lottery anyway. The only thing is we're unlikely to win two more games so no-one probably has anything to worry about anyway. And hopefully that will have other ramifications other than a bonus draft pick.

I want Hansen, and it's perfectly possible we won't get him without pick 1.

I'll be disappointed if we have a shot to win and cough it up, I'll be happy with a convincing win (which will probably be any win) and I'll be disappointed in the short-term if we're thumped.

If people can't seperate these things out, then you're very masochistic for being such a passionate Carlton supporter in some awful times for the club.

First priority - don't accumulate more than 16 points (or whatever that cut-off is) !!

We stand to have picks 1, 17 & 19 which is a huge advantage if this player pool is as good as suggested. If we could somehow trade 3-4 of our players and get another 2 picks inside that Top 20, then we will really be going places.

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Don't worry Game, Essendon* will be going backwards before they go forward.

Ummm your little teeny bopper girlfriend is the one saying that people who want Carlton to get a priority pick aren't 'TRUE SUPPORTERS'. How stupid for people to want to double their chances of getting a 200 game player with our second pick in the lottery - get a clue old man.

Listen here w@nk, don't ever go tell someone they don't really like Carlton because they actually WANT to support them. You may want the team to lose but don't go telling someone else who loves their club to. You lost all credibility the moment you said that, not that you had any anyway. Maybe if you search hard you might find some, but I doubt it. Talking about getting a clue!!!

Thread No.1 of an upcoming 346 tanking threads.

In the blue corner you have the pragmatists who can't see any genuine difference between 15th and 16th, who see no more glory in winning 5 games than 4 games, and who think that bringing as many Marc Murphy's into the club as possible is our best shot at giving all supporters the most glorious of feelings possible: a win on Grand Final day.

In the red corner you have the emotives, who bleed navy blue every time we lose, who hate the whole concept of needing to 'bottom out' to build a list.

The truth is that most of us are in both corners, but when push comes to shove, lean one way or the other. Debate tends to highlight the DIFFERENCES between people, rather than the commonalities. So be it.

Anyway, you can put me in the blue corner because I have trained myself to think pragmatically about the game, simply because that's the only way a club can advance given the system.

Personally, I don't think getting the 1st or 2nd pick is the issue this year: it's getting that bonus 2nd Round pick.

In a draft that, due to last year's increase in drafting age, contains far many more talented kids than we've had for a long time, an extra pick at the start of the 2nd Round is like getting a top 10 pick in a normal draft.

It's the difference between getting a Hansen PLUS two quality midfielders, vs Hansen + one.

If I could change history, I wouldn't give ourselves a couple of extra wins last year and see Marc Murphy running around for Collingwood. And for that same reason, I don't want to win two more this year.

It's simple. Emotionally unpalatable, but simple.

I tell you: football may have been played by part-timers on mudheaps back in the 70's and 80's... but it was a hell of a lot more fun being a footy supporter then, than it is now.

But, of course, the players earn heaps and the AFL own Docklands and we have games against Port Power at Telstra Dome instead of games against Fitzroy at Princes Park, so I suppose that's ok then.

The only positive out of us coming last is that increases the possibility that there may be some sort of member revolt and a cleaning out of either Pagan or the board

amen

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How could we be MUCH worse off if we had won a few more games last year and Collingwood got Murphy and we didn't? The difference would be minimal...it's a team sport and to boil it all down to one magic pick a year is a romantic fantasy.

I agree John. Plus no flooding and no talks of PPs and draft picks. I wish we could go back to those days.

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Loyal & Proud

Obviously verbs, it's not ONE magic pick a year. It's several years of cumulative development.

We get impatient because we factor in seasons 02 and 03 into our 'years of pain' wheras they don't really count because we were barred from the draft back then.

Then we went and won 10 games in 04 and let the others get the Griffin's, etc.

So we've really only had 2 effective crap years now, with probably another one next year. That's just the reality of our situation.

Although, if you take out St Kilda's one magic pick in Riewoldt and West Coast's one magic pick in Judd, and it makes a fairly big difference to those two teams.

Sometimes a top 3 draft pick CAN get you a player good enough to change your entire team. Pretty rare to score one from the later picks these days.

umm you cant agree with john, under your critera you want him to piss off and support Essendon*, he's not a true supporter.

If you actually read what I wrote, then you'd kick yourself in the head because you are stupid. I was agreeing with one thing he said, not the whole thing.

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Loyal & Proud