See this is what frustrates me, people only look for what you want to see.
I agree the competition has changed to a different game plan, I have pointed this out already.
Bondi, myself and countless others have all pointed out the preseason game plan, plan B as you have allured to.
But this playing group is unable to execute it and if they do it is only in bursts.
They tried it again after the break and they still can't do it.
Our midfield is too slow and gets punished too easily on the turnover because of it.
And there is a reason we have about 8 small forwards on our list.
Missing targets and missing goals makes that game plan unsustainable.
Who did we trade/draft in of any decent quality to accommodate our weakness in this area to adapt to this new style of game?
Jagga Smith and that is it.
I just don't understand how you can't see that we changed nothing with the list last year, we've had similar amounts of injuries and yet we are expected (only by supporters by the way) to be in the top 8.

Most first year players are not depth, if they can't step up into the seniors and have an immediate impact they are developing players not depth.
No team can afford too many of these and win games regularly and no game plan can 'accommodate' to this either.
TBH why would you unless you are putting the cue in the rack.
And if the depth was there in the seniors I'm pretty sure players like Doc and Acres would not be getting games.
i.e. If Elijah and Cottrell were on the park, Fantasia/Fog and Doc would not be getting games.
Hollands has been moved down back because forward of centre he is a liability and we are missing a running HBF.
So our wings are Acres and Doc with cameos from Lord, Walsh and Binns.
Lord is the only one out of the wings and Hollands that can actually hit a target with a penetrating kick into F50.
I don't know what else to say on this other than go back and watch a few of our games with this in mind.

Depth at the top of the ladder.
https://www.afl.com.au/news/1349992/the-three-young-guns-charlie-west-oscar-steene-harry-demattia-hunting-debuts-for-high-flying-collingwood-magpies

If our midfield is so one paced and slow as you say, which I don’t disagree btw, when was the last time Motlop, Ollie, Lord, Williams, Durdin, anyone with a bit of run had a go through the middle? I’ll tell you - not this year. We keep going with Hewett, Cripps, Cerra and Walsh. Try something, anything but our coaches don’t!

Ollie - too easily brushed aside, not agile or quick enough to make an impact and is needed down back.
Lord - has had 36 (11%) CBAs this year. But is needed more on the wing.
Williams - has had 22 (8%) CBAs this year. But is needed in the forward line.
Durdin - has had 2 CBAs (1%) this year. Also needed in the forward line.
Motlop - has had 51 CBAs (14%) this year. Also needed in the forward line but has taken more of a rotating mid role.

Aside from Lord we are putting forwards in the middle to see how they go.
When we should've been drafting quick goal kicking mids to play in the middle and are flexible to play forward or back, not the other way around.
This way we have speed, foot skills and the ability to have players surge forward out of the middle and kick goals.

Cerra has kicked 3 goals.
Cripps has kicked 10 goals.
Hewett has kicked 5 goals.
Walsh has kicked 5 goals.

Our midfield is not damaging enough and they are too predictable, they will rarely kick goals and so our forwards are covered too easily.
Voss is trying, but we are robbing Peter to pay Paul with limited success.
We just don't have the list.

More on our list.
Start at 4:30
https://www.afl.com.au/video/1350048/top-eight-squeeze-whos-likely-to-miss-blues-glaring-list-issue?videoId=1350048&modal=true&type=video&publishFrom=1750662000001

https://www.afl.com.au/video/1349960/access-trade-calls-blues-must-consider-who-is-the-second-most-important-magpie-after-daicos?videoId=1349960&modal=true&type=video&publishFrom=1750636624001

Exactly what I’ve been saying for a while. Our youth is the worst in the league. We have so little coming through that you can point to say there’s the future when you compare to other clubs. We’ve banked everything on this list, topping up with players like Saad and Cerra for top 10 picks, and sadly it has failed spectacularly. We would have to be the furthest off a flag in the league.


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Keep up the fight sidex. And who cares about the ignorant.

I can't believe people think we have depth.

We have 17 kids under 21. The most in the AFL. FMD. Wake up and look at the list.

I said it before the season started, we will be tested if we have injuries because our depth players are not good enough or not developed.

We can't win a game with more than 8 injured. We beat the Cats with 5 out injured. We lost to NM with 9 out injured.

We still have injury prone players, and yes that includes Charlie, Walsh and Docherty to a degree, and Gov doesn't take hits to avoid injury, and when he does, he goes to hospital, only to reappear for his match payments the next game, Williams, Acres is never fully fit, Fantasia, Cottrell, Durdin...who thinks we got rid of our injury prone players in contract? We only got rid of 3 injury prone players because we didnt renew their contract.

And, have a look at who comes in from this so called depth to cover the injured:

White, Evans, Motlop, O'Keefe, Carroll, Fogarty, Binns, Lord, Young, 31yo Fantasia, a lame Pittonet.... We tried to trade Young. Thank god we didnt. You dont see Cats Pies or Swans play skinny undeveloped players until they are ready unless you are a Gulden, Daicos or Selwood. Its stupid to gift kids games, for a taste...maybe for a taste if they are playing in a strong winning culture. Otherwise they get injured and lose confidence. Sometimes we have half a dozen of them out there. What are we doing?
Developing kids?
Expecting kids to win us games?
Playing to be a Top 4 team?
Palying for the Flag?

Its a kindergarten!

...and look who we have had to keep in the team regardless of bad form this year

Curnow, Gov, Motlop, Acres...

WE started the year with 13 out injured for round 1, and had to play Harry McKay who was obviously not right, and we found out he wasn't. Then in round 2 when we lost McKay, we played a lame Curnow, who hasn't come good.

Read all the papers. Read the social media forums. Its the List that is the problem for any coaches .

Austin said after the Trade period we had the 2nd best list in the AFL. Ofcourse he would. Its his job that's on the line. What a goose, patting himself on the back...and the club believed him, so do some posters. Well its been proven wrong!!!!!!!!

And some expect Vossy to pull a rabbit out of his arse, by moving the deck chairs. I'm not saying he's not the blame. I'm saying there has been a glaring deficiency with list depth and it appeared from round 1 with 13 out injured.

Get fairdinkum. Fix the game plan. Fix the list. Get some FA's and dont bother with topping up with more kids. Add the 4 we are earmarked and it brings our kids to 21 of the list of 44. Can anyone not see that as a problem?

We have 16 players coming out of contract at the end of this year? That's dangerous, but I wonder why?

If you can't change the people, change the people.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

So are we saying a team like Collingwood has better youth than us? No they dont. They hardly have any good youth. Their oldies are still bringing it. They have drive and want to win.

Our Captain, cant even speak to TDK and tell him to stay. 'Oh no' - he stays out of it. I mean what, what a goody two shoes type of leader ?

The captain is telling us to stick 'fat' when he is one of the biggest culprites of our current demise.

Talk talk. From our captain, our leaders and our coach. What do they actually do. Watch looney tunes in their review !!!!

Our problem is the attitude of players. The Coaching directive, Voss is stubborn and doesnt make the game plan fit our players. We dont look like we are happy and dont have fun.

We dont have anyone with any shit in them to drag anyone along . Our leaders are weak.

We have a better set of players than Collingwood. But they have all of the above.

And trading McKay, Curnow or Walsh is just stupid talk. This years draft is weak.

We need to change our recruiters and football manager for a start.

And we need to change this recruit nice little mummy boys attitude. I want big time perfomers who wanna win.

This club has become a kindergarten, you only have to look at the change rooms now.

Curnow, TDK, Cripps and the like - all care about their business's and surfing.

Curnow is being a show pony and primadonna. Someone talk to these guys. As an example Curnow playing on or kicking on an angle when he marks the ball every time. Tell him to bloody go back and kick a proper drop punt for goodness sakes. He does it again and again . So either no one is talking to him, or he is ignoring instruction. Walsh dump kicking every time. Cripps trying to do to much and ignoring team mates.

Where is the leadership ??????

We are saying Collingwood has better depth, next man up.
They have so much senior depth that the kids can't get into the team.
Is that going to have long term ramifications?
That depends on how well they use the draft while having senior players falling over themselves to join them.
Just ask Geelong.
Rating our players better than theirs is a bit fanciful, the results speak for themselves.

IMO Voss has adapted a game plan for our players, that there is the issue.
The game has moved on.
Our list needs to move on also.

I agree on the rest though.

collingwood have a system. players go down, players come in knowing what their role is in that system. system beats individual.

carlton for years has had the individual - hero ball. and when one hero starts getting to the end of his journey, we tank for a high pick to make room for the next.


kouta on his way out, we tank for gibbs. kouta eventually went, the kruezer cup was born, cripps is on his way out, we sell the farm for jagga. on it goes. cripps will eventually leave and if history is the indicator, in 2027 we'll have the number 1 pick. generation after generation it feels like this will continue.


the board love the individual... they make millions in jersey sales and everything else is a marketing wet dream. but the individual doesn't win footy games in september. but hey, we're making money and lots of it, so who cares.

So you mean Collingwood have roles, like the same role Binns got blasted for?

We do love the individual, but lack of team success gives you that.

no mate. collingwood have a system. the coaches drew it up, the players believe in it and the players execute it. the system isn't based on individual (like give it to crippa to shrug off 3 in a tackle & bomb it to a contest where harry or charlie have a 3% chance of marking it)


our players don't believe in the system. hell, we know at least one of our coaches don't believe in the system - hamill blasting voss after round 1.


we are a hot mess.

We saw what Braithy is talking about in their wins vs Freo away and North at marvel.

Both times they were extremely depleted and won with ease. System.

I @#$%&! hate them but envy them.

Quote from the Herald sun



Put this in here to give a few some perspective with salaries. $150,000 pa. Let that sink in.

In the Herald Sun early this year they made a list of the top 50 paid players, and stated that Charlie and Harry are on 900 plus bonuses from Brownlow, BnF, AA, Coleman. Suffice to say they are on $900K over the last 2 years, notwithstanding any front loading.

No way our salary cap is bursting. Its around 95% and banking the rest.

Like I've said we have money put we don't have picks to trade for great players, or Austin hasn't tried because he over rated the list we have and thinks first year player Jagga will hit the ground running this year 2025(bad luck), Dean comes in 2026 (will be 19yo) and in 2027 Walker comes in to strut his stuff at only 19yo. He's dreaming.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Absolutely they have a system. Plus they have players with skills to carry it out.

Do you believe the Pies have better foot skills than Carlton? I do. Its so obvious to the eye.

Our players (generally speaking) couldnt play any system with Charlie and Harry standing still with a hand up, expecting a high ball.

That's where we are failing miserable. F50 entry, to no leading targets (maybe by design) and set shots (skills). We would have 5-6 extra wins if we kicked straight. Players are not good enough. They treat the opportunity to goal as a casual affair

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Who would you trust more kicking a set shot at goal 40 out, in front, on a 45 degree angle, and on the boundary?

Membrey or Charlie/ Harry?

Milocek or Charlie/ Harry?

Elliot or Motlop/ Fogarty/ Durdin?

Scultz or Motlop/ Fogarty/ Durdin?

Hill or Motlop/ Fogarty/ Durdin?

and if any of our smalls are missing, try White and Evans.

There's your list problems right there.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

So we don't have a system?
So last year when we were 2nd on the ladder was just blind luck?
We have a system, you know the antiquated one you refer to, the one that got us wins and dominated clearances.
We have tried a new system to evolve with the game and competition, you know the one where we play on, run in waves and successfully trained and trialled pre-season.
Yet the players are still unable to hit targets in F50 or convert goals when required.
Just look at the first quarter last week and the week before how many shots on goals were missed etc. when we were in total control.
Heck we could've won last week in the last if we had had better shot accuracy.
But that's right, it's too complex, the players don't believe in it..........blah blah blah.
If they can't change to a winning game plan and execute basic skills then they are the issue.
I'm dumbfounded how much weight is put on the players being hard done by, they're elite athletes FFS.

Saying players don't believe in the system, coaches are at each other.........blah blah blah.
It's all just speculation, come back to me with facts on this and I 'might' believe you.

Also Bondi makes good points on our forwards.
I know who I'd rather at our club.
Like I said before, Owies may not have been the best small but it has been proven he was the hardest working one and was reliable.
And he loved the club.

The most valid point is the last one.

I got howled down for saying that trading Owies and Keneddy might have damaged the culture more than onfield. Kennedy was referred to as the ‘bringer of joy’, players don’t look like they have a lot of joy right now.

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/the ... 5m9cl.html

It is also unclear what 188-centimetre forward Ashton Moir will become. Some recruiters across the league would not have drafted Moir at all but the Blues used a top-30 pick on him.

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