I'm glad braithy reminded us that we were in 2nd place this time last year, the season after making a preliminary final, having just annihilated Geelong while wearing orange socks.

I don't think many at that stage were saying Voss isn't the guy, his style of footy doesn't win games? Maybe keogh, but y'know, it's keogh, man.

And then they changed the HTB rule midway through a season, after a three-time premiership coach singled out an incident involving our star forward and having a big sook.

I don't mean to just make excuses and pretend that everything that's happened since can be ignored. But that was hugely unfair. @#$%&! AFL putting their finger on the scales to the benefit of Collingwood and Hawthorn, and to our detriment. Maybe not by design, but I am not going to dismiss this as a factor.

Anyway, the main reason I bring this up was to show that Voss *can* build a strong Carlton side. What has happened since? Well, I've already put my cards on the table and speculated that we have schisms in the playing group. Is it a failing of Voss that he hasn't rooted it out or overcome it? Maybe. Could another coach have done so? Maybe. Or made it worse.

That's why I , GreatEx, side with SideFx in saying let's look for and excise the tumours, if they exist, or find an onfield leader that can better unite the troops. Maybe we need a new coach too, but only if Wright has fully investigated the root cause of the fragility of the group and determined that there's a head coach candidate out there who's willing to sign on and will do a better job of fixing it than Voss. Because it's clear that Voss is not going to turn it around with this list.

Walsh and Cripps simply didn't adjust and were pinged over and over plus the lack of winning clearance by dragging in the opposition midfield then then free your arms and get a handball out really hurt us.

And we just played a bit shit from quarter time in the Giants game for 8 weeks.

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I'm shocked to be sitting here

The spray that Voss supposedly gave to Binns would have been nothing compared to the spray he copped from me in the lounge room.



Sent from my SM-F956B using Tapatalk

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

we can finally agree, old mate.

Like I said we will have to agree to disagree.

only if you're absolutely sure i can't convince you that voss is inadequate and you should think like me.

That's cool too you don't need to be convinced.
I'll just say, that when players are saying they need to step up, people within the club are saying our depth is not there, people outside the club are pointing at holes in our list. They can't all be wrong, but that is up to you on how you interpret that.
Sorry but I have explained too many times the issues with the list, how it affects our game plan, what we can and can not do because of our limitations to give you a more appropriate response.
But I will say, on the weekend when I see open players forward of the ball and said player looks at them and then kick backwards and the broadcast pans to Voss spewing about it, I know that a lot more is player driven then most would like to believe.
If you can't get your basics right under any game plan with little to no pressure, there is something going on between the ears of the players.
Maybe Wright has put them all on notice and the club has had a shake up, hence TDK wanting to speak to him.
Who knows.

That's a hard no Braithy, but I applaud your tenacity.

It wasn't hindsight at the time though, but enough of that, I was just making a point that our list needs were not addressed.
I was in the trade Harry camp.

I agree we are in a bind, if we didn't trade away our 1st pick we would probably be playing all the kids to see who and who doesn't make the cut at the end of the year.

As for preserving, I'm not sure.
We are in a jam now, are we able to attract the right senior talent?
Honestly, who would want to come to the Carlton basket case 2.0.
Like last time we will only attract rejects or injured players if this is the case.
A new coach won't help in fact I can see it being worse, players want stability and that is something we have proven we can't offer.
IMO we are better off to make incremental changes.
Change some of the players this year, add more senior depth 3-4.
Change the coach next year if we don't make improvements with a better healthier list.
I'd rather a well thought out plan than a knee jerk reaction to appease the supporter base and anyone else at the club.
Surely Cook has imposed that level of professionalism and modern day football management on the club in his time.
Time will only tell if Wright blows it all up for better or worse.

You can take a snapshot at anytime during the past 4 years and it's a Voss can/can't coach outcome

Year 1... finals bound, nothing surer... then kaka, we join the limited club of missing finals in the last round after being in the top 8 all year

Year 2... first half of the season, kaka... then the injuries come and we change things up a little, and go on a 10 zip run... get a little lucky in finals and end up in a prelim

Year 3... start the season like millionaires, second on the table... then kaka again

Year 4... start the season, kaka... if history is anything to go by, we may not lose another game in the run home :hopeandprayers:

If you plot the Voss years you'd come up with a near perfect sine wave... a laughing stock

Injuries are an excuse to an extent. I'd expect them to hinder us against the better teams. Not struggle and/or lose against the bottom 6. Like Voss said in the presser... the difference between our best and worst is to big. Players must bear some of the responsibility but structures, confusion, motivation and form all going down the kaka, and that's on the coaches... all of them.

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“I would rather have questions that can't be answered than answers that can't be questioned.” ― Richard Feynman

I agree with this logic.