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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 2:39 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24981
Location: Bondi Beach
SurreyBlue wrote:
If we had a fit and in form Williams, Elijah, Kemp and even Martin in the team as forwards, we wouldn’t be having these conversations about trading Harry or Charlie. That is the funny part. Add the icing on top and support the class.

Also, I’d be very weary on what you wish for……….


Edited

I agree Surrey. WE are from the same school of thought.

I love our spine.
I'd like to add the speed of Jagga in the guts, and some extra run from HB and a small forward, and the abovementioned in the team too. We will have Jagga next year.

Injury hasn't been kind to us, but people just ignore that part and lay the blame entirely on the coach or the salary cap.

Many of our depth players butcher the ball, and some of our best players have not been in great form this year. That's on them..

Open training on the weekend had all our skills on display for the kids.....FMD...there was no pressure and the skills were as bad as they were in the preseason ....some of the kicking and handballing is still below VFA standard. There's no VFA anymore, and that's why they are not playing in that grade, otherwise.....

Lets hope something clicks after this weekend.
I have no doubt Wright will do what he thinks is needed.
A Bobby Hill like recruit would be a great start.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 4:28 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
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Location: Bondi Beach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAf7ocxzsf0



Is Harry really worth keeping?

His IQ is..... as bad as Charlies.

Leaders all let us down badly again

Nothing to do with Game plan

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 6:04 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Thu May 11, 2006 6:11 pm
Posts: 14975
Another FWIW rumour from BF;
We have offered Reilly O'Brien a 3 year deal. If true, it would suggest TDK is leaving.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 7:32 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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kezza wrote:
Another FWIW rumour from BF;
We have offered Reilly O'Brien a 3 year deal. If true, it would suggest TDK is leaving.


Fine with me…

He has a Bachelor of Medical Science, a Master of Neuroscience, a Master of Public Health, and an MBA.

Might finally sort out what the @#$%&! is going on in the medical room.

Probably offers more than “Does my hair look nice like this?”

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 7:45 pm 
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Robert Walls
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kezza wrote:
Another FWIW rumour from BF;
We have offered Reilly O'Brien a 3 year deal. If true, it would suggest TDK is leaving.


Overall this is a good result.

TDK not worth the money we are offering let alone what the saints are.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 7:47 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Oh great, as if we didn't have enough posh private schoolboys, now you want to add a university student!


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 8:40 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Posts: 7149
Crusader wrote:
Braithy wrote:
my point that my illogical brain was comprehending was; if the contracts that are expiring are none of the big 7 who are around a mil, all we can afford is the same kind of players coming back our way? we really need to move some big contracts to have a war chest to spend?


of the primary list, i'd only renew george and silvagni. newman, provided he still has mobility (not a given) on a really low cost deal. at 32 and coming off a ruptured patella, i can't see other clubs queuing up for him, so that might be possible.

george's deal won't be as good as his current one would it, considering he'll be 30?

If he hasn’t already, George will hit his triggers for another 12 months. Hopefully it’s the same, or some kind of pro-rata (more in this case, since the TPP has increased). Pretty sure the original number was around $400k. When we got him, he was a slow half back that wasn’t a great kick. He’s still two of those things, so the league average of $500k would pass the pub test.

Silvagni has every right to be walking in there & asking for 4+ years on $800k. That’s a bit of a wrinkle, but it’s like that time we fell arse backwards into Liam Jones, except his foot skills don’t cause ulcers.

I’d be letting McGovern go. O’Farrell is coming on at a rate of knots & we’re about to add Harry Dean behind him. His spot needs to be a medium-small defender. Someone that’s way better than him at scooping up the groundball.

I hope that Doc doesn’t become a list clogger & calls it himself. He’s not a half back any more. He’s getting squeezed out of the wings. The half forwards are awful, but he’s not getting in there either.

I agree with BV that there is a spot for Newy & I hope like hell that he’ll make it back to take it. The group needs him… I just don’t know if he can. Jesus, don’t let it play out like it did with Doc last year. Don’t let him work his arse off for a miraculous comeback if it’s going to be as pitiful as that was.

The others won’t move the needle that much, as far as TPP goes. But, Haynes has certainly proven his worth.

Kemp, Fantasia & Motlop are all in the gun as the forward half has come undone. Not that the first two are part of the problem, but they’re not part of the solution while they’re in the rehab group. Kemp is replaceable on type but, at 25-26yo, I kinda want to see if he can be more of a big medium than an undersized tall. Fantasia has already been replaced this year - three times.



good summary. agree with it all. fantasia, i like. but half a season down with a calf. another year older. the chances of him playing meaningful and consistent footy must be slipping. motlop has clean hands, and that's all the positives i can say about him. if he was at least fast, or agile maybe he'd be good. but... he's not.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 8:41 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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GreatEx wrote:
Oh great, as if we didn't have enough posh private schoolboys, now you want to add a university student!



haha.

i already hate the guy!


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2025 9:03 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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GreatEx wrote:
Oh great, as if we didn't have enough posh private schoolboys, now you want to add a university student!

This is why we lost Rambo Stallone

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 10:58 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24981
Location: Bondi Beach
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DIhyJ6WzP-u/?utm_source=ig_embed&ig_rid=48b626e4-4427-4685-a517-ac1834dfe7d5

What a fantastic mark by Mingara. Check this out on Insta.

So glad that our NGA Mingara Clark finally found his motivation and looking like a footballer who wants to be drafted yesterday.

He's the other small forward we have on our radar, along with Gresham, who is the captain of the Chargers. I didn't think his form thus far warranted selection along with Ison Gresham and Dean

Here's a write up on him from the game yesterday

Quote:
Mingara Clark (Scotch) 183cm – Midfielder

Carlton-tied prospect Clark was among Scotch’s best players on the day, with two goals to his name and plenty of touches. One of those goals saw him burst out the front of a stoppage and put it through the big sticks, while the other was a set shot tucked away on the right-side boundary. He has X-Factor and glides across the ground. The left footer plays for the Oakleigh Chargers as a medium forward and has hit the scoreboard in all four Coates League games he’s played this year.


AS for the talented NGA Ison here's his write up.

Quote:
Jack Ison (Scotch) – The 190cm Carlton Academy prospect did some brilliant things. The most exciting was a big grab over a Haileybury defender in the second term, before staring him down and slotting the goal. He also worked back to provide aerial assistance in defence.


We have already seen Ison play against men in the preseason, and has shown he is worth the wait and will be selected in the 2nd or 3rd round, as will FS Harry Dean and Gresham....hopefully later

WE may have to make 4 spots for these kids on a list which already has too many kids and not enough depth players.

Like Ive said all along we have to let kids go and those whose contract expires come season's end includes Wilson, Lemmey and Lord (Lord is going nowhere). Lord is our Taylor Adams.

Its weird having to consider keeping older experienced players on one year contracts to give us much needed depth, at the expense of some of our kids.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 11:20 am 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
Posts: 7578
Location: Bendigo
bondiblue wrote:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DIhyJ6WzP-u/?utm_source=ig_embed&ig_rid=48b626e4-4427-4685-a517-ac1834dfe7d5

What a fantastic mark by Mingara. Check this out on Insta.

So glad that our NGA Mingara Clark finally found his motivation and looking like a footballer who wants to be drafted yesterday.

He's the other small forward we have on our radar, along with Gresham, who is the captain of the Chargers. I didn't think his form thus far warranted selection along with Ison Gresham and Dean

Here's a write up on him from the game yesterday

Quote:
Mingara Clark (Scotch) 183cm – Midfielder

Carlton-tied prospect Clark was among Scotch’s best players on the day, with two goals to his name and plenty of touches. One of those goals saw him burst out the front of a stoppage and put it through the big sticks, while the other was a set shot tucked away on the right-side boundary. He has X-Factor and glides across the ground. The left footer plays for the Oakleigh Chargers as a medium forward and has hit the scoreboard in all four Coates League games he’s played this year.


AS for the talented NGA Ison here's his write up.

Quote:
Jack Ison (Scotch) – The 190cm Carlton Academy prospect did some brilliant things. The most exciting was a big grab over a Haileybury defender in the second term, before staring him down and slotting the goal. He also worked back to provide aerial assistance in defence.


We have already seen Ison play against men in the preseason, and has shown he is worth the wait and will be selected in the 2nd or 3rd round, as will FS Harry Dean and Gresham....hopefully later

WE may have to make 4 spots for these kids on a list which already has too many kids and not enough depth players.

Like Ive said all along we have to let kids go and those whose contract expires come season's end includes Wilson, Lemmey and Lord (Lord is going nowhere). Lord is our Taylor Adams.

Its weird having to consider keeping older experienced players on one year contracts to give us much needed depth, at the expense of some of our kids.

Lord has already extended his contract through 2026.

Clark has always looked like a late-developing rookie prospect to me. The exact type of prospect that the NGA system was developed to nurture. There’s something there, but it’ll be his physical traits that move him up the board.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 11:43 am 
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Craig Bradley
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Posts: 6470
A good read.
I would've like more of an analysis of the current playing list though and it's depth issues.
Rather than just trying to hang the coach out to dry.
And geez, I really hope we don't go down a rebuild path again........not sure I'm up for it and I'm not putting my kids through that. :lol:

https://www.nine.com.au/sport/afl/news-2025-carlton-blues-10-years-on-total-rebuild-mick-malthouse-stephen-silvagni-brendon-bolton-michael-voss-20250531-p5m3ro.html


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 1:49 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24981
Location: Bondi Beach
Quote:
While Zak Butters gets most attention as a pre-agent, mainly due to his pull back to Victoria, Walsh's contract will be one of the biggest headlines for next year as clubs jostle to get to the front of the queue for his signature.


https://www.afl.com.au/news/1334935/monday-cal-culations-seven-questions-for-swans-can-freo-follow-lions-flag-path

Swap Butters for Walsh and use the TDK pick and money to get Bergman over.


Quote:
Adelaide ruckman Reilly O’Brien has reached a stalemate in contract negotiations with the Crows according to *SEN’s *Tom Morris.

At this stage, Morris says the Crows have offered the unrestricted free agent a two-year deal for less money than O’Brien was hoping for.

While the deal has been on the table for the 29-year-old to sign for some weeks now, Morris says O’Brien is holding to see if the Crows can increase their offer.

If they don’t, then there’s no doubt the 133-gamer has a big decision to make this off-season.


https://www.sen.com.au/news/2025/06/02/trade-talk-dons-free-agent-halting-obrien-deal

As a UFA OBrien doesnt cost us any picks. Adelaide want Sam Draper from the junkies who is a FA come years end as a RFA.

TDK, Walsh for Butters, Bergman, and OBrien to join with Jagga Smith, Jack Ison, and another couple good value trades Wright has always liked?

I love Walsh, and I think he has plenty of upside. He's not running like he use to, or its the taggers he's copping are bloody quick and super fit.

I feel we get an upgrade on Walsh if we get Butters, whose profile suits our needs. Can see it now: the dynamics of Butters Smith and Cerra speeding up our game.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 2:20 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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i think we drafted jagga bcos we're hoping he will be the next butters.

jagga and butters probs can't play in the same midfield, tbh. again, too much replication.


cerra, walsh hewett work bcos there's balance.

jagga, cerra and hewett could be dynamic.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 2:22 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
Posts: 7578
Location: Bendigo
Sidefx wrote:
A good read.
I would've like more of an analysis of the current playing list though and it's depth issues.
Rather than just trying to hang the coach out to dry.
And geez, I really hope we don't go down a rebuild path again........not sure I'm up for it and I'm not putting my kids through that. :lol:

https://www.nine.com.au/sport/afl/news-2025-carlton-blues-10-years-on-total-rebuild-mick-malthouse-stephen-silvagni-brendon-bolton-michael-voss-20250531-p5m3ro.html

Sidey… mate, we’re already in the rebuild.

17 players aged 21 & under.

Ollie, Cowan, Lord, Carroll & White are senior regulars.
Jagga & HOF are rolled gold certainties to join them.
Two more again are the Camporeale twins.
You can @#$%&! me standing upright if Skull doesn’t make it.

Less confident about Binns, but he’s closer than anyone else.
Moir needs a rocket, but there’s definitely something there.
Way too early to be grading Charleson.

Duffy & Monahan need a miracle.
Lemmey probably needs someone/where else to crack the code.
Wilson isn’t what they thought he was.

Ison, Gresham, Dean & maybe Clark will come in from the Academy this year. Walker the next.
Wouldn’t you know it, they’re the exact types we’re looking for.

Full set of picks in 2026 & 2027 will be on the table this year.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 2:53 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24981
Location: Bondi Beach
Braithy wrote:
i think we drafted jagga bcos we're hoping he will be the next butters.

jagga and butters probs can't play in the same midfield, tbh. again, too much replication.


cerra, walsh hewett work bcos there's balance.

jagga, cerra and hewett could be dynamic.



Good call.
I thought he was more like Butters than anyone else last year too.

You still need a rotating midfield group, not like us now with 4, one developing: Cripps Hewett Cerra Walsh Lord and 3 minutes here and there with Motlop, Durds who are not quite good enough at this stage.

The question is are they good enough midfielders who can find their own ball and stay connected to chains escaping the pack?

Losing Walsh and you lose a running machine who is running the kms but not as impactful as past years for some reason.
No idea what Butters engine is like.

Butters and Jagga don't have to be playing mids together all the time. Both go OK in the forwardline too.
Butters has had a few shots at goal in the last 3 years. Seems a bit "off" his game this year.
Both players have the knack of getting out of tight spaces. That's what I really like about them as mids.

Midfield trios:

Jagga Lord B.Camporeale/ Cripps- Lord

Cerra Hewett Butters / Cripps- Lord

Ison (2026) and walker (2027) developing and strong enough to play midfield minutes against men in 2026 2027

Cripps contract ends in 2027 aged 32
Hewett contract ends in 2026 aged 30

You wouldn't trade Walsh for Butters?
I suppose you wouldnt be relieving SC if that's what you're after/worried about.

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 Post subject: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 6:23 pm 
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John James

Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2022 8:11 pm
Posts: 604
Getting rid of Walsh would be a huge mistake.

He's clearly not happy. Focus on fixing that, rather than shipping him off somewhere.

You just know he'll make us pay for it if we do.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 6:40 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Posts: 10546
BamBam7 wrote:
Getting rid of Walsh would be a huge mistake.

He's clearly not happy. Focus on fixing that, rather than shipping him off somewhere.

You just know he'll make us pay for it if we do.


Agree but it seems we are in the minority and also very few who prefer to fix issues. Too much effort it seems.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 7:34 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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BamBam7 wrote:
Getting rid of Walsh would be a huge mistake.

He's clearly not happy. Focus on fixing that, rather than shipping him off somewhere.

You just know he'll make us pay for it if we do.

100 % .

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2025
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2025 7:40 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:55 pm
Posts: 6470
Crusader wrote:
Sidefx wrote:
A good read.
I would've like more of an analysis of the current playing list though and it's depth issues.
Rather than just trying to hang the coach out to dry.
And geez, I really hope we don't go down a rebuild path again........not sure I'm up for it and I'm not putting my kids through that. :lol:

https://www.nine.com.au/sport/afl/news-2025-carlton-blues-10-years-on-total-rebuild-mick-malthouse-stephen-silvagni-brendon-bolton-michael-voss-20250531-p5m3ro.html

Sidey… mate, we’re already in the rebuild.

17 players aged 21 & under.

Ollie, Cowan, Lord, Carroll & White are senior regulars.
Jagga & HOF are rolled gold certainties to join them.
Two more again are the Camporeale twins.
You can @#$%&! me standing upright if Skull doesn’t make it.

Less confident about Binns, but he’s closer than anyone else.
Moir needs a rocket, but there’s definitely something there.
Way too early to be grading Charleson.

Duffy & Monahan need a miracle.
Lemmey probably needs someone/where else to crack the code.
Wilson isn’t what they thought he was.

Ison, Gresham, Dean & maybe Clark will come in from the Academy this year. Walker the next.
Wouldn’t you know it, they’re the exact types we’re looking for.

Full set of picks in 2026 & 2027 will be on the table this year.

I meant like our past rebuilds, they were not fun.
I can handle a Hawthorn or Brisbane rebuild though.
In the top 4 next season or the latest 2027.


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