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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 9:10 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Sat Jul 30, 2011 10:17 pm
Posts: 2027
This the Ratten era revisited

Reliance on our best players and individual brilliance to win games

Our bottom 6 - 8 players are simply not good enough

Should have conducted a mini rebuild when Voss started

Now we are in the wilderness as our best players are essentially at their peak now and we are still struggling to make finals


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 9:12 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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I thought Cowan & Kennedy were our only decent players.

Newman had his moments but should have taken the game on more. Acres got a few touches but turned it over.

Absolute shit of a day. Listened to Blues Radio & thought hughesy summed up everything purely from a supporter's point of view, which is what that broadcast should be all about, but Sellers kept telling him to shut up, FFS

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 9:19 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 8:22 am
Posts: 2736
So bloody frustrating b/c if we’d won, we’d be 6th and a game off 2nd.
And that’s after all the opportunities in the last month with several contenders dropping games - all we had to do was win a few of the totally winnable games.
We are head cases!


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 9:40 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:21 pm
Posts: 8183
Who would have thought 6 weeks ago, sitting 2nd, then kicking 8.4 in the first qtr against GWS That we would be in this position.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 9:49 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:48 pm
Posts: 4407
Location: Perth
jim wrote:
Who would have thought 6 weeks ago, sitting 2nd, then kicking 8.4 in the first qtr against GWS That we would be in this position.


As I’ve posted previously, last year it was qtr time against GC at the G. This year it was qtr time against GWS away. Only the opposite :yikes: :mad:

WTF has happened?

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 9:57 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Location: threeohfivethree
I think it’s called fragility.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 10:07 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 11:51 am
Posts: 4544
Location: lygon street
keogh wrote:
Our game style over the last 3 years is based on tough contested stoppage footy
Get the ball to the talls up forward
One it’s predictable We are bottom half for marks inside 50
Two it’s not sustainable
You think about it
Since round 1 2023 Carlton have played 47 games of footy
About Half have been excellent
25% Average
25% Shit
Today was shit even with the injuries
If you based success on that brand of footy your dead in the water in the long run
Carlton have been crap since the GWS game
Today after quarter time the dam broke
And it was so predictable
We get scored against so easily once the ball is in space
Our ball movement was putrid
And there are 17 other teams
If half of them like the Hawks progress your in trouble

So what’s next
The season is done
This list is simply not good enough
To be fair to Voss he has tried to change the game style
It simply hasn’t work because the list isn’t good enough
Good opposition will expose you
We are too slow and have poor skills compared to the other 17 teams soon to 18 with a multitude of draft concessions

I have banged on for years on this site about List Management
Watching Mannagh and Humphries playing for the Cats yesterday who they drafted for a bag of chips it infuriates me that we pay and play players like McGovern and Williams
Mc Govern was utterly disgraceful today towards Kemp even though he played absolute shit

Sure injuries have played major part
But blame injuries for performances like that wallpapers the cracks

With Tasmania coming in the club needs to start again ASAP
They never have stripped it right back and until they strip it back we won’t be in a Grand Final


I think we did strip it right back... we just made dud picks. From 2016 onwards, our top 30 picks have all been busts, save for Walsh and TDK, with the jury still out on Kemp, Motlop and Olli.

The SOS picks are particularly dreadful

SPS, Fisher, Dow, LOB, Stocker, Philp. They should be the core of the team now. Not one of them still on the list. We blew the rebuild through poor top end draft picks.

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 10:16 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:40 pm
Posts: 7148
GWS wrote:
I think it’s called fragility.


Not just that . You can add brittleness . Fragile and brittle .

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 10:26 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 9:02 pm
Posts: 13148
Location: Melbourne
CFC Twitter posted its "up to all of us" to respond.

The @#$%&!?

Record crowds and membership this year.

With 2 games to go the season is royally [REDACTED] after spending weeks in second, but apparently us flower fans who've spent our hard earned time, money and energy all season need to "respond"?

@#$%&! OFF.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 10:41 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Posts: 35647
Location: Half back flank
The_Cranium wrote:

SPS, Fisher, Dow, LOB, Stocker, Philp. They should be the core of the team now. Not one of them still on the list. We blew the rebuild through poor top end draft picks.


That's depressing reading.

It's pretty amazing we made a prelim with this list TBH



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2024 11:15 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:32 am
Posts: 10461
WOW wrote:
This the Ratten era revisited

Reliance on our best players and individual brilliance to win games

Our bottom 6 - 8 players are simply not good enough

Should have conducted a mini rebuild when Voss started

Now we are in the wilderness as our best players are essentially at their peak now and we are still struggling to make finals


Excuses. Every line is full of talent. We are just mentally weak and refuse do put in the hard yards.
There is plenty of talk and hot air but no real essence behind it.
Add the incompetent coaching, favouritism and there are your issues.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 12:01 am 
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Rod McGregor

Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2023 9:58 pm
Posts: 153
CK95 wrote:
The_Cranium wrote:

SPS, Fisher, Dow, LOB, Stocker, Philp. They should be the core of the team now. Not one of them still on the list. We blew the rebuild through poor top end draft picks.


That's depressing reading.

It's pretty amazing we made a prelim with this list TBH



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The problem has continued with Austin out of his drafting only Ollie Hollands and Cowan looking likely to make it


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 12:12 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:06 pm
Posts: 35647
Location: Half back flank
I absolutely cannot fault his endeavor but I'm just not sure about Ollie.

I love the kid & his history with the club but there's just some flaws in his game

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 12:53 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:24 am
Posts: 40291
Location: seaside
How yas doin’….

i can’t sleep…how about these last six
weeks hey…don’t know what to say…!

noticed the Blue Abroad fan cams after
game went for 4 hours tonight…that’s a lot of
unhappy…confused…bewildered…dumbfounded
Carlton supporters…!

some needed to yell…others got on and barely
spoke because they were still stunned…!

just before halftime i turned the volume off…
couldn’t stand listening to them laugh at us…
they were laughing…!

then about ten minutes into the 3rd I’d seen
enough…off it went…can’t remember the
last time that happened…many years ago
at least…!

just wanted to have a whinge…that’s all…
like us all…who knows what to think…!


kindest regards tommi






Still can’t sleep…!

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 6:07 am 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:42 pm
Posts: 2764
Location: dudley!!!
keogh wrote:
Our game style over the last 3 years is based on tough contested stoppage footy
Get the ball to the talls up forward
One it’s predictable We are bottom half for marks inside 50
Two it’s not sustainable
You think about it
Since round 1 2023 Carlton have played 47 games of footy
About Half have been excellent
25% Average
25% Shit
Today was shit even with the injuries
If you based success on that brand of footy your dead in the water in the long run
Carlton have been crap since the GWS game
Today after quarter time the dam broke
And it was so predictable
We get scored against so easily once the ball is in space
Our ball movement was putrid
And there are 17 other teams
If half of them like the Hawks progress your in trouble

So what’s next
The season is done
This list is simply not good enough
To be fair to Voss he has tried to change the game style
It simply hasn’t work because the list isn’t good enough
Good opposition will expose you
We are too slow and have poor skills compared to the other 17 teams soon to 18 with a multitude of draft concessions

I have banged on for years on this site about List Management
Watching Mannagh and Humphries playing for the Cats yesterday who they drafted for a bag of chips it infuriates me that we pay and play players like McGovern and Williams
Mc Govern was utterly disgraceful today towards Kemp even though he played absolute shit

Sure injuries have played major part
But blame injuries for performances like that wallpapers the cracks

With Tasmania coming in the club needs to start again ASAP
They never have stripped it right back and until they strip it back we won’t be in a Grand Final


McGovern is an interesting one. Bakes kemp this match, yet all players get around him last match when he kicked oof. The week before questions voss to the press about why he wasn't out forward.

For some reason that I can't put my finger on, it doesn't sit right with me

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 6:44 am 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6312
I think what Mitchell and Hawthorn have shown is that if you strip it right back you can be successful in terms of recruiting

Then recruit other players from other clubs with smart trades

List Management is the most important piece of the puzzle
We have been exposed because our bottom tier players are simply not good enough
There is not much in the twos
Binns surely plays next week
Lemmey might be ok big guys take time
Wilson needs another year of reserves footy
Hudson O’Keefe may turn out ok
Not much else

I watched yesterday to see which players gave everything and which players were suspect
Kennedy and Cowan tried really hard
Owies is in that bottom tier but I like his attitude
Cripps and Walsh obviously and maybe a few others

Williams looks unfit to me. Doing his ACL wouldn’t help but has been such a disappointment overall
A couple of games of quality up forward
McGovern nothing more to say but we give him 2 more years with a possible 3 rd year extension for half a season of good footy out of five
He simply avoids contact
McKay on a massive contract simply has no mongrel
Motlop has some x factor but isn’t a smart footballer

And we give spuds like Pittonet and Young long term deals to pay these overpriced players and fit into the cap

It’s Captain obvious that we really need to clear out the list and rebuild again and do it in the next 3 years before Tasmania come in
Hawthorn have made great strides in four years
It can be done
Even with a good run with injuries we are off flag contention with the way the game is played

The new rules don’t favor us which is a critical overlooked factor too


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 7:40 am 
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Ken Hunter
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Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 9:02 pm
Posts: 13148
Location: Melbourne
The_Cranium wrote:

The SOS picks are particularly dreadful

SPS, Fisher, Dow, LOB, Stocker, Philp. They should be the core of the team now. Not one of them still on the list. We blew the rebuild through poor top end draft picks.


Far out. There are some ordinary names there.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 7:54 am 
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Craig Bradley
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Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:42 pm
Posts: 6886
Sydney Blue wrote:
AGRO wrote:
Appalling mismanagement of injured and perennially injured players has derailed this season.


:roll:
I would put a million on it that the players who are always injured are vegans or don't eat enough meat
They don't bulk up and most are as skinny now as when they arrived

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but there's this wonderful stuff you can buy. supplement protein. eating kilos of meat was the way from the 90's and prior.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 8:02 am 
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Craig Bradley
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Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:42 pm
Posts: 6886
missnaut wrote:
The_Cranium wrote:

The SOS picks are particularly dreadful

SPS, Fisher, Dow, LOB, Stocker, Philp. They should be the core of the team now. Not one of them still on the list. We blew the rebuild through poor top end draft picks.


Far out. There are some ordinary names there.



whatever our draft strategy is, and whoever our scouts are ... all of it needs a hard reset. it isn't working.


i wonder what the hit rate is for other clubs to draft useable players, 100 game players and 200 games plus players? whatever it is, i reckon we're less than half of the afl wide average.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2024 8:26 am 
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Ken Hunter
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:16 pm
Posts: 14263
Location: Sydney
I hear you tommi, bafflement is the order of the day. Of course keogh will come out saying the list is crap and always was, but we won 22 of 28 games over 13 months, including finals, including by far the toughest first 15-game fixture of any club this year, despite having one of the longer injury lists during most of that time.

It wasn't a flash in the pan. But something has gone fundamentally wrong and it's hard to put on a finger on it without distorting or ignoring the evidence to fit a preconceived world view. I don't accept that it's all down to a crap list or veganism. Explain the 22 of 28 in that context.


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