Talking Carlton Index Lochie O'Brien Kerryn Harrington Lochie O'Brien Kerryn Harrington CFC Home CFC Membership CFC Shop CFC Fixture Blueseum
It is currently Tue May 06, 2025 11:43 pm

All times are UTC + 10 hours




Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 2764 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56 ... 139  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:07 pm 
Offline
Ken Hunter
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:32 am
Posts: 10471
keogh wrote:
Acres is a turnover merchant
Is a liability
Why recruit him


I don’t agree with much you say TK but I can’t argue with this point.
What a waste of list spot and pick trade.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:25 pm 
Offline
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6321
dannyboy wrote:
anecdotes don't make a valid point, they support weak arguments, strong arguments do not need them.


Binns - you're guessing. I'd assume he was brought into the fold in his week off (as an emergency) to be with the team watch, imagine, strive that little bit more if he wants it so it could just what his development needs - truth is I do not know and neither do you because neither of us actually knows the kid. Actually they could even have thought "play Acres not Binns, better ruin the aging player who is a turnover merchant than a kid in his first game" - bring him in when the side has jelled a bit? Really who the @#$%&! knows.


It’s 6.24 pm Eastern Standard Time
Your not in front of your class anymore
Just to go back to the anecdote thing
Your roughly the same age as me
You would have seen countless inept people get jobs over more capable people because of mateship, family ties or that they were really really good at something else
Stuff their history in the field of work your talking about
That’s how SOS got the job
It couldn’t of been about what great things he did at GWS
No idea about recruiting a decent mid unless he stood out like dogs balls like Walsh
He was mates with our former President
Ol’ Markee poohs
Of course you and I can’t assume that because neither of us really know :smile:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:50 pm 
Offline
Ken Hunter
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:16 pm
Posts: 14269
Location: Sydney
keogh wrote:
Recruiting Acres and playing him doesn’t help Binns does it
I am not advocating playing Binns every week


I would argue that bringing in an experienced big body actually does help him quite a bit. You even provided the reason why.

We've been guilty of many missteps over the past decade but not giving youngsters enough games isn't one of them, in fact I dare say we've broken a few by asking too much too soon... I'd wager the likes of SPS would have done a lot better at a club like Sydney or Geelong who give their kids a few years in the little leagues and then they take to seniors like swans to water. And then there's Walsh's back. So having someone like an Acres to play the bulk of senior games for 3 years, with Ollie and .... Jaxon (sigh) ... ready to dominate at age 21, sounds like smart planning to me.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 7:02 pm 
Offline
Craig Bradley
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:42 pm
Posts: 6896
meh ... acres is the least of our problems. he does plenty of good things within a game - which out of our any given 22, you only count on one hand who are doing good things - this last 6 weeks.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 7:19 pm 
Offline
Ken Hunter
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:12 am
Posts: 10374
Location: Coburg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_anecdote

_________________
This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!


Last edited by dannyboy on Fri Jun 16, 2023 7:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 7:22 pm 
Offline
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6321
dannyboy wrote:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiUy5mzusf_AhXCqlYBHWa9BMEQFnoECBcQAw&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.intelligentspeculation.com%2Fblog%2Fanecdotal-fallacy&usg=AOvVaw12m8mRq_5GnAE1JIXcXlpb


I don’t care
SOS should not have got the job


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 7:24 pm 
Offline
Ken Hunter
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:12 am
Posts: 10374
Location: Coburg
Ahh so then your arguments are full of fallacies and you do not care - see simple really, your not trying to discus, you are simply trying to be right.

_________________
This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 7:57 pm 
Offline
Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
Posts: 1495
We aren’t that far away. A good trade/draft period and we are in it. Added to a few coaching changes.

Williams back
Cowan Binns Hollands Lemmey another pre season

Trade McGovern TDK Fisher maybe one more
Get Gresham Jordan Flanders and then have picks 4, 10, 17, 33 & 60

Next year
B: Boyd Durdin Kemp
HB: Williams Weitering Saad
C: Acres Cripps Hollands
HF: Gresham McKay Cuningham
F: Lemmey Curnow Motlop
Foll: Pittonet Jordan Cerra
Int: Walsh Owies Docherty Flanders Binns Hewett Kennedy Martin Durdin Cincotta Cowan Mirkov O’Keefe and a heap of Picks


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 8:12 pm 
Offline
Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24665
Location: Bondi Beach
keogh wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
keogh wrote:
Last year when we were flying Cerra was our fourth best mid
Cripps Walsh Hewett were ahead of him
Since then all three have dropped off
Cerra has stepped up. He was soft at Freo
I can only think of 2 players who have got better on our list
Newman and Cerra
Good on Cerra
Cerra is a very good footballer
Well rounded solid
But he ain’t a A grader
Why
Well you can quote as much stats as you like
Stats don’t fully tell you the full impact a player has on a game
He lacks explosiveness
Did any of you guys watch last nights game
Rozee, Butters Horne-Francis have X factor whether it’s pace off the mark or power
Cerra doesn’t have that

As far as having an opinion I am entitled to have one
As for the McGovern it’s been a @#$%&! disaster
Tell me why otherwise
Martin and Williams are lazy footballers who haven’t worked hard enough when they have played

Last night was the best game I’ve seen this year
We are miles off what Port delivered
Quick ball movement
Manic pressure
Guys who can kick the ball with penetration
Hasn’t happened overnight but the potential was there
The building blocks came from the draft
And many picks not in the top 10
Guys like Finlayson are cream on the cake

If you get guys like McGovern Martin and Williams when all you’ve got is unstable slab the issue is compounded

If you don’t watch the better teams objectively without bias do yourself a favor
Grab a glass of red and watch
You might learn something


I enjoy watching the other games.
Not emotionally invested.
I try and not be bias when judging Carlton and its players.

I think you're wrong about Cerra.
He wins the ball from the defensive side of the contest.
Rozee looks explosive when he receives the ball at front of the pack.
I saw what you saw last night.

Last year when Cerra was receiving the handball forward of the pack he too looked explosive there.
I dont think you judge with an open mind at all.
Cerra is not slow.

But you still found a way to degrade Cerra by comparing him with Rozee, conditionally (no stats allowed) :lol:
Gotta laugh at that keogh. That is purely driven by bias. If you cant see that, phone a friend.


I think your barking up the wrong tree
Cerra is a solid footballer
Rozee Butters co have more impact
That’s my opinion
That’s not degrading Cerra at all


That's good.

Cerra is in the conversation with those guys.
Its a long journey.
Many a time has Cerra's name been ahead of theirs since they debuted.
Thers another 10 years of these guys, and you're calling what? This last weekend?
I dont know. I just think you're being a bit tough comparing Rozee the part time Fwd-Mid, with Full Time mid, Cerra. Come on maaaaaate

_________________
Everyone looks good in Navy Blue


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 8:14 pm 
Offline
Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17943
keogh wrote:
As the season begins to slowly unfold I feel we have got better to some degree by the inclusion of Acres


10 weeks later.

keogh wrote:
Acres is a turnover merchant
Is a liability
Why recruit him

_________________
Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 8:19 pm 
Offline
Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24665
Location: Bondi Beach
keogh wrote:
Recruiting Setterfield and McGovern at the time for 5 picks was the stupidest List Management decision ever although the Stocker trade comes close
C’mon convince me otherwise


Turns out you are right on that.

The other stuff, you're giving a round by round commentary. I dont think there's a thread for that. This is not the right one.

Go start that thread. Big gig. A lot of teams, a lot of players, a lot of games, a lot of rounds, shit happens, things change. Have you got the time for all that. If not its meaningless unless you refer the conversation as ", Imo...current forms shows....". Nothing is set in cement in this game. That's why its called a game. If you're game go for it, but not in this thread...please.

_________________
Everyone looks good in Navy Blue


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 8:29 pm 
Offline
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6321
dannyboy wrote:
Ahh so then your arguments are full of fallacies and you do not care - see simple really, your not trying to discus, you are simply trying to be right.


Ahhhhh
That’s what you think
Two decades of shit proves otherwise


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 8:34 pm 
Offline
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6321
Blue Vain wrote:
keogh wrote:
As the season begins to slowly unfold I feel we have got better to some degree by the inclusion of Acres


10 weeks later.

keogh wrote:
Acres is a turnover merchant
Is a liability
Why recruit him


Yeah got that wrong
But hey if I searched through all of your shit well …..

I did say to some degree
Which means I wasn’t totally convinced
Must have played above himself early
I assume your going Sunday
Give us a a blow by blow on how Jack goes
Oh hang on
You don’t like giving opinions out
At least some seats will be half priced
By the way
Where are we on the ladder
Just remind me
I’ve forgotten


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 8:48 pm 
Offline
Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24665
Location: Bondi Beach
keogh wrote:
GreatEx wrote:
Yeah, I watch plenty of other games too, it's hardly something to brag about. I dare say syd, Bondi and I have seen more of the Swans and Giants than just about anyone here. I reckon I can discuss the teams who play on Ch7 regularly with reasonable authority, and have little to contribute about the likes of WCE,GCS and NM who are rarely shown.

One thing you (keogh) keep telling us is that Martin is lazy, but those who go to the games tell us he works his arse off and does a lot of the things that don't make the stat sheet or are out of the TV frame. Would you at least concede that those at the ground have greater authority in this aspect of the game?

If that’s the case then is it a coaching instruction
Dumb play up the field
Or a complete load of shit. He is just overrated
Love to know from someone who is there every week


Come on mate.
Keogh. We are a community. TC Community.
We all agree to disagree then disagree on that too.

I post what I see at games when I do go. I think I've seen a lot of live games this year and last, but I trust the views of others at the same game too. I dont call their view a load of shit. I work out over time if they are bias or not.
You are not being respectful with your commentary to your community. You're AI Carlton mates.

I tolerate you because I respect you.
I dont call you a luny because I choose to see the merit in some things that you say, but will argue against the parts I think are lacking merit.

From what Ive seen, live, and I share with you, Martin runs more kms than most HFs, opens up the ground from hard running, defends, then runs back and repeats for no possessions, but you see the roll he just played in that passage. He had purple patches. Then goes quiet. But those Purple patches are GOLD! He works damn hard. A real professional on the field. Not lazy as you say, and got no idea why you would say it from TV land. I saw what I saw every time I've seen him live, and know what I miss on TV, so knowing that, I view his skills and little things I see in that rectangle called a TV, knowing its a small part of the on field goings on, and FMD he's a goer. Martin isn't a bad footballer as you say. Could've been an A Grader if he tolerated the hits he cops in AFL. But he's a great player for us IF he could stay fit. No joke. D grade output because of injury, but B grade player is all his body allowed.

Trust some of the posters a tad...a bit...or at least respect their call for more than a load of shit. Sure, you may see it differently, but try and find some human compassion, man, and think someone may have seen a different angle or quality, and thank them. Isn't why we are here?..in part?.

Nothing is absolute from whatever chair you're watching, unless a player squibs s contest right before your eyes of course then its right there for all to see: That's TV and a live experience.

_________________
Everyone looks good in Navy Blue


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 9:05 pm 
Offline
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6321
2 decades
4 finals appearances
One because Essendon* took drugs
2 knocked out the first week
2011 the only decent year
This during a period of equalization
But we sacked the coach less than a year later
I admire all of you and your optimism


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 9:13 pm 
Offline
Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17943
keogh wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
keogh wrote:
As the season begins to slowly unfold I feel we have got better to some degree by the inclusion of Acres


10 weeks later.

keogh wrote:
Acres is a turnover merchant
Is a liability
Why recruit him


Yeah got that wrong
But hey if I searched through all of your shit well …..

I did say to some degree
Which means I wasn’t totally convinced
Must have played above himself early
I assume your going Sunday
Give us a a blow by blow on how Jack goes
Oh hang on
You don’t like giving opinions out
At least some seats will be half priced
By the way
Where are we on the ladder
Just remind me
I’ve forgotten


I don't like offering opinions? :lol:
That's the first time I've been accused of that one.
And no I won't be going Sunday. I try to go to most home games but I have other football commitments this week.
And yes we're struggling at the moment but unlike you, I think we have the list to turn it around. We're doing a lot of things right.
Like you say, we're all entitled to opinions. :thumbsup:

_________________
Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 9:27 pm 
Offline
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6321
Blue Vain wrote:
keogh wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
keogh wrote:
As the season begins to slowly unfold I feel we have got better to some degree by the inclusion of Acres


10 weeks later.

keogh wrote:
Acres is a turnover merchant
Is a liability
Why recruit him


Yeah got that wrong
But hey if I searched through all of your shit well …..

I did say to some degree
Which means I wasn’t totally convinced
Must have played above himself early
I assume your going Sunday
Give us a a blow by blow on how Jack goes
Oh hang on
You don’t like giving opinions out
At least some seats will be half priced
By the way
Where are we on the ladder
Just remind me
I’ve forgotten


I don't like offering opinions? :lol:
That's the first time I've been accused of that one.
And no I won't be going Sunday. I try to go to most home games but I have other football commitments this week.
And yes we're struggling at the moment but unlike you, I think we have the list to turn it around. We're doing a lot of things right.
Like you say, we're all entitled to opinions. :thumbsup:


I agree with you in regards to opinions generally
I think we need to start again

You can check this post like you did the Acres one
No
Problem


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 10:51 pm 
Offline
formerly BlueRob
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 12:45 pm
Posts: 3072
keogh wrote:
2 decades
4 finals appearances
One because Essendon** took drugs
2 knocked out the first week
2011 the only decent year
This during a period of equalization
But we sacked the coach less than a year later
I admire all of you and your optimism



We should never have sacked Ratten (and never got rid of Fev!).

_________________
I am as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it any more!!!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:15 pm 
Offline
Craig Bradley
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:40 pm
Posts: 7163
BigBlueWave wrote:
keogh wrote:
2 decades
4 finals appearances
One because Essendon*** took drugs
2 knocked out the first week
2011 the only decent year
This during a period of equalization
But we sacked the coach less than a year later
I admire all of you and your optimism



We should never have sacked Ratten (and never got rid of Fev!).


Voss needs help ? Rates would be the perfect sidekick . If there is ever a time to bring him home its now . Heart and soul is what we lack . Ratts has that by the truckload .

_________________
All my dangerous friends


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2023 11:49 pm 
Offline
Ken Hunter
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:32 am
Posts: 10471
Mickstar wrote:
Voss needs help ? Rates would be the perfect sidekick . If there is ever a time to bring him home its now . Heart and soul is what we lack . Ratts has that by the truckload .


:thumbsup:

Would absolutely love to see this. Give him the midfield job as well.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 2764 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56 ... 139  Next

All times are UTC + 10 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: bender and 129 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group