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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 10:29 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24663
Location: Bondi Beach
Paddycripps wrote:
I would be getting Harry's bro to play FB. Young showed the other night he is simply not a strong enough player to be a true KPD. Get Ben McKay via FA. Keep our first round pick.

Then we need speed around the ball and a quality mid size HFF.

Cuningham and Martin would fix those two problems but we simply cannot rely on these guys. They are terribly injury prone.

Use our first round pick to snare another quality running mid like Hollands last year, and then trade our second rounder for a quality HFF. We might need to add a sweetener to make the trade fair.

Of course is there anyone out there on the market and do they want to come to us?

I will put my hand up and say I don't know whether we should fight to keep TDK. My main concern with him is he isn't a good kick. I think he is overrated in so far as potential to be a forward of note. He has played 46 games and has kicked multiple goals in a game just once and that was a big tally of 2 goals. I know he is competing against the twin towers but seriously his kicking leaves a lot to be desired. I would assume if we were to let him go we would get a first rounder back. So that could be one way of getting a player we need.

So...

Ben McKay - FA
Quality, running mid - 1st Rounder
Quality HFF - TDK trade for 1st rounder


I agree with all the above, except part of the Young bit.

Young has done well as a KPD. He held the whole defence in good stead when weiters went down too.
What Young showed is that he can have avrage games, like Weitering, when its raining turnovers.

Why I would like Ben at FB is to free up Weitering to play his rightful position as the elite intercept mark.
I dont think Marchbank will survive the cut unless a miracle happens, and don't think Kemp is in same class as Marchy despite similar height.

Gov can he a HBF or HFF, swing man.

We still need another HF to replace Martin and Cuningham.

Agree with first round pick to add to Cerra and Walsh.

Ive got no idea what to do with TDK, but would love a ruckman who doesnt give away too many frees and takes makes around the ground.

I have 12 players I can rely on winning their position, and 2 of them are 10yo % 20yo developing players Motlop and Hollands, and 3 of them injured Martin William Marchbank.

We have so much developing to do to fill spots its obvious we will need a few more imports in the next 2 years to improve us...unless Voss has a game plan to suit the personnel.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 11:45 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Ben Mckay is too injury prone. Surely we've learnt our lessons there

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 Post subject: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 11:54 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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I'd love to snag Nick Watson.

He'll go top 5 so can't see how but he's that mercurial HF/FP we need.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 12:58 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2021 12:58 pm
Posts: 1919
Hopefully no relation to another KPP Watson we had...*shudders*


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 3:06 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
Posts: 7443
Location: Bendigo
bluehammer wrote:
I'd love to snag Nick Watson.

He'll go top 5 so can't see how but he's that mercurial HF/FP we need.

Watson & Moir are (so far) the best two finishers.

Duursma & Tholstrup are decent overhead targets, as is Moir. All four offer a very good contest at ground level. Good attributes amongst Caddy, Lorenz & McKercher as well…

Not a bad year to be on the hunt for a Fwd/Mid.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 4:32 pm 
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Horrie Clover

Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2021 2:17 pm
Posts: 372
so simple we need 1 hbf quick provide dash /run we have saad ? williams injured and who else is PROVEN and 2 191cm hff again quick on the lead ,need to replace slow players with quick player which then allows them enough space to make the correct decision with ball in hand. At the moment players and previous years are to slow so when they have ball panic and just boot the footy straight to opposition ,but if they had seperation different story


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 9:16 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:36 am
Posts: 8119
bluehammer wrote:
I'd love to snag Nick Watson.

He'll go top 5 so can't see how but he's that mercurial HF/FP we need.


Guys his size don't normally go top 10. Not even Pickett or Daniel. He may well make it to our pick. But do we want another forward midget?


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 9:28 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Stefchook wrote:
bluehammer wrote:
I'd love to snag Nick Watson.

He'll go top 5 so can't see how but he's that mercurial HF/FP we need.


Guys his size don't normally go top 10. Not even Pickett or Daniel. He may well make it to our pick. But do we want another forward midget?
Watch him play. He's a smart, smart footballer and can do the incredible.

I hear you on size, but I'd take the chance if he were there.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 9:46 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
Posts: 7443
Location: Bendigo
bluehammer wrote:
Stefchook wrote:
bluehammer wrote:
I'd love to snag Nick Watson.

He'll go top 5 so can't see how but he's that mercurial HF/FP we need.


Guys his size don't normally go top 10. Not even Pickett or Daniel. He may well make it to our pick. But do we want another forward midget?
Watch him play. He's a smart, smart footballer and can do the incredible.

I hear you on size, but I'd take the chance if he were there.

Daniel 171cm, pick 46
Pickett 171cm, 12
Tippa 171cm, rookie
Spargo 172cm, 29
Baker 172cm, rookie
Colyer 173cm, 26
Durdin 173cm, 37
Daniels 174cm, 27

First round, for sure.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon May 08, 2023 10:23 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Fri May 18, 2007 2:10 pm
Posts: 2811
Stefchook wrote:
bluehammer wrote:
I'd love to snag Nick Watson.

He'll go top 5 so can't see how but he's that mercurial HF/FP we need.


Guys his size don't normally go top 10. Not even Pickett or Daniel. He may well make it to our pick. But do we want another forward midget?


We’re a very fair chance to have a pick inside 10.

Are there any FS/academy kids that might chew up early picks?


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 2:02 am 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
Posts: 7443
Location: Bendigo
DesEnglish wrote:
Stefchook wrote:
bluehammer wrote:
I'd love to snag Nick Watson.

He'll go top 5 so can't see how but he's that mercurial HF/FP we need.


Guys his size don't normally go top 10. Not even Pickett or Daniel. He may well make it to our pick. But do we want another forward midget?


We’re a very fair chance to have a pick inside 10.

Are there any FS/academy kids that might chew up early picks?

The big fella, Walter, from the Suns academy has promise.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 6:32 am 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:08 pm
Posts: 3248
Perhaps we need a new thread - coaching panel 2024

Lists always need development as does ours, we are lacking in areas. However, in the scheme of the competition our list isn’t that bad.

Our issue is more between the ears and system. As we are seeing around the competition this is the main differentiator between the good, average and bad teams.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 10:04 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24663
Location: Bondi Beach
london blue wrote:
Perhaps we need a new thread - coaching panel 2024

Lists always need development as does ours, we are lacking in areas. However, in the scheme of the competition our list isn’t that bad.

Our issue is more between the ears and system. As we are seeing around the competition this is the main differentiator between the good, average and bad teams.


I'm hearing you london. You've been on this path for a long time, and now the media are looking at the coaching group for answers.

Sad if its true we need to revamp the coaching group.

As for turnovers, is it the coaches game plan/ tactics or the players.

I blame the players for the obvious clangers, but I'm hearing you, the coaches have a role too.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 1:10 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:08 pm
Posts: 3248
bondiblue wrote:
london blue wrote:
Perhaps we need a new thread - coaching panel 2024

Lists always need development as does ours, we are lacking in areas. However, in the scheme of the competition our list isn’t that bad.

Our issue is more between the ears and system. As we are seeing around the competition this is the main differentiator between the good, average and bad teams.


I'm hearing you london. You've been on this path for a long time, and now the media are looking at the coaching group for answers.

Sad if its true we need to revamp the coaching group.

As for turnovers, is it the coaches game plan/ tactics or the players.

I blame the players for the obvious clangers, but I'm hearing you, the coaches have a role too.


I can’t believe that we don’t have the equal or better list than saints, bulldogs or even pies for that matter.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 1:43 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
Posts: 1495
london blue wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
london blue wrote:
Perhaps we need a new thread - coaching panel 2024

Lists always need development as does ours, we are lacking in areas. However, in the scheme of the competition our list isn’t that bad.

Our issue is more between the ears and system. As we are seeing around the competition this is the main differentiator between the good, average and bad teams.


I'm hearing you london. You've been on this path for a long time, and now the media are looking at the coaching group for answers.

Sad if its true we need to revamp the coaching group.

As for turnovers, is it the coaches game plan/ tactics or the players.

I blame the players for the obvious clangers, but I'm hearing you, the coaches have a role too.


I can’t believe that we don’t have the equal or better list than saints, bulldogs or even pies for that matter.


Agree


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 4:49 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2010 4:49 pm
Posts: 1170
CK95 wrote:
Ben Mckay is too injury prone. Surely we've learnt our lessons there


This. No more injury prone players on large, long term contracts please.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 5:01 pm 
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John Nicholls
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Posts: 9354
Guys seriously, our list as good as the Pies?

The team made a grand final only a few years ago and their list runs very, very deep despite losing a few in their fire sale a few years back (Treloar and Stevenson), then Grundy last year... (offset by the fact they slotted in a Brownlow medallist into their midfield).

They have real leaders on every line: forward, middle and back.

Even the Bulldogs have a bunch of players who've seen finals and a flag.

Compare us to the Saints, maybe.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 5:10 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24663
Location: Bondi Beach
Stefchook wrote:
bluehammer wrote:
I'd love to snag Nick Watson.

He'll go top 5 so can't see how but he's that mercurial HF/FP we need.


Guys his size don't normally go top 10. Not even Pickett or Daniel. He may well make it to our pick. But do we want another forward midget?


Midgets is exactly how I describe our plethora of small forwards...Motlop, Durdin, Fisher...Owies is a bit bigger....none have marking as a strength. One is all we really need to make it as a small forward who kicks 2-3 goals a game and gets a bit of the ball too.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 5:16 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
Posts: 1495
robertbb wrote:
Guys seriously, our list as good as the Pies?

The team made a grand final only a few years ago and their list runs very, very deep despite losing a few in their fire sale a few years back (Treloar and Stevenson), then Grundy last year... (offset by the fact they slotted in a Brownlow medallist into their midfield).

They have real leaders on every line: forward, middle and back.

Even the Bulldogs have a bunch of players who've seen finals and a flag.

Compare us to the Saints, maybe.


I think we stand up well to the Pies list on talent and ability across the field. One thing the Pies do is play a good brand of footy and they seem to get the best out of most

Maynard Noble Mihocek Cameron Hoskin-Elliot Hill Frampton Murphy aren't exactly top line players but they do their job

Even Mitchell has come and just players his role


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2023 5:49 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2021 12:58 pm
Posts: 1919
robertbb wrote:
Guys seriously, our list as good as the Pies?

The team made a grand final only a few years ago and their list runs very, very deep despite losing a few in their fire sale a few years back (Treloar and Stevenson), then Grundy last year... (offset by the fact they slotted in a Brownlow medallist into their midfield).

They have real leaders on every line: forward, middle and back.

Even the Bulldogs have a bunch of players who've seen finals and a flag.

Compare us to the Saints, maybe.


Thank you.

People seem to forget, when we were 8-2 last year, we weren't exactly setting the world on fire:

Richmond game - Played 2 quarters
Dogs game - One amazing quarter, hanging on for life in the second half, Dogs wasteful
Hawks game - Won by 1 point after giving up a 40 point lead in the second half
Port game - Won by 3 points after giving up a 50 point lead in the second half
Sydney - See Dogs game above

Wins vs GWS, North and Adelaide were par.

The 8-2 ledger masked our true level, and seduced us all.

We've only added Acres and first year players, yet, somehow, we should go from a 12-10 side to an 18-4 side overnight?

Better than the Pies? Same team was consistently in the finals and had one bad year (COVID interrupted so can't read much into it), topped up with youth and a superstar father son player, retained the same core of senior players.

Where is this delusion coming from?

We're honestly carrying on like a bunch of toddlers who aren't getting the toys they want and chucking tantrums.


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