"The Blues are back!!!!" screamed our skipper after a barely acceptable win against a young Gold Coast side coming off a 4 day break after playing Richmond, and after having barely gotten over Fremantle with a miracle kick.

Have loved Cripps over the years but that's when I was concerned that the internal expectations of this group appeared to be "close enough is good enough". Don't know the workings of the inner sanctum but that is such a typical attitude symptomatic of our footy club and why we find ourselves in this position.

Are we ruthless ? What are the expectations? No where near it at the moment. Just content to get close and then relax / have a laugh.

Pathetic.

I have?

Five years into a rebuild and we are 12 th with a percentage of 95.
Time for some home truths about SOs rebuild

1 Hasn’t recruited enough mids

Clearly. The only One today that SOs recruited was Setterfield .
OBrien
SPS
Kennedy
Dow
Cuningham
Lang
Stocker
Polson
All haven’t delivered the goods
Setterfield is average. He isn’t bad but he isn’t good. He cost us 2 picks and with pick 71 we have got little for . Martin wanted to come to us. In my opinion he doesn’t do enough. For what he is costing us In terms of salary cap space he should be in the middle.
My main criticism of this rebuild has been the inability to recruit mids.
You have to bat 8 and 9 deep to be a top 4 team. We are miles off that

2 Recruiting too many shit players from other AFL clubs to prop up the list
Remember O’Shea , Mullett, Kerridge
All the G WS spuds no longer there.
I advocated to look at the lower leagues to fill the void of the delistings from the Hughes and Rogers era.
If you don’t believe me look through the AFL lists. The evidence is there that there is quality if your Recruiting staff look hard enough. You don’t need a high strike rate over five years to have success in this area. Five or six solid players in their mid 20s would be good now wouldn’t it.
Some blokes mature later.

3 Terrible trades
Don’t need to go any further

4 inability to snag some quality with later picks and rookie picks
Gibbons was an afterthought after Bugg thought it wa all too much. Guess where his first club was. GWS

5 Blinkered recruiting
One example O’Dwyer. What school did he go to. The same school as the Silvagnis went too. Make of that what you will.
6 rewarding sub standard performances with over inflated contracts
Cuningham Plowman 3 years
Dow contracted to 2022
Murphy another year
A joke

What to do. The midfield depth has to be addressed.
SOs crop of 2019 must be given games. Teague must be ruthless in demanding the utmost from his mids.
You can’t wait too long for Dow and co to develop.
Austin may have to start to rebuild the list again.
No more stupid trades. Pick kids and develop them. Look to the lower leagues particularly for bigger key position players. Big guys take time.

Delist Betts Simpson too old offer nothing now.

This isn’t a SOS bashing for the sake of it. But 12 th after 5 years is proof that it has been a fail.
Culture is an issue. Some selections on game day are mystifying.

But the bottom line is list management. I like everyone else is sick of being average or worse
Austin has a tough job ahead

It's not just the coaching that appears to be a big problem.

List management/drafting by Silvagni and co has not been up to scratch on what we've seen so far.

People can point out a drafting/trading win here or there, but if you want to win flags you need to have lots of them.

Dow not impressive/can't get a game.

O'Brien has ~35 games under his belt - what's his weapon?

Weitering (#1), Walsh (#1) have come on again this year. Setterfield has done well. TDK showing a bit.

SPS? Cuningham?

It's those later picks that are key - they're not looking great.

The biggest indictment is the amount of midfield time Ed Curnow still gets (as a ballwinner). What does that say about the drafting/development of midfielders?

We aren’t maximising the talent that we have because of poor coaching

And what we have, isn’t what it should be, because of 5 years of sub standard list management/drafting

And some here, think we’re close or just need some tweaking :grin:

It's up to Teague and the club psycho to make them do it consistently.

So next port for Carlton Footy Club is List Management.

The game vs Lions is a chance to see what we have developing in reserve, if they are good enough to compete at AFL level.
Who might we see next week? Whose spot do they take?

Ramsay was reported as pushing for a spot. Macreadie was back to his intercepting best in the back half.

Next year, we have Caleb Marchbank, Charlie Curnow, Nic Newman, Jack Silvagni back from injury.
Is there a spot for them in our fist 22?

Marchbank >>> Williamson
C.Curnow >>> Casboult
Newman >>> Simpson
Silvagni >>> McGovern

If so, where do they play? Who do they push out to the reserves team?

As I said this season is even a better indicator of where you are at in terms of the other 17 teams. It is clear to me that many in this site haven’t a clue what the rest do. They just look at their own back yard.

As a club we don’t get it.
Essendon** don’t get it.
Hawthorn don’t get it
Richmond do
Geelong do
Port do
WC do
I grant you culture and development helps and the gloss has been lost on Teague. He clearly has his favourite players.

To me the fundamental football issue is Recruiting and List Management.
SOS in five years has failed. Whose idea was it to fly Shiel around in a jet after the worst year in the club’s history. That shows a club internally that is out of touch with the realities of building success.

One of SOS s final tasks was to make sure Martin fitted in nicely to the club. Then his ego says @#$%&! youse all.Yet another superstar to bring the club back where it belongs. Just like Judd. Just like McGovern
Has Martin been that player. No. Our we any better with him in the team. No
Compare us from the second half of last year to this year. Have we improved. Only slightly.
We are harder to play against but our skill level is crap. That’s because of the players he recruited.
Players internally are overrated.
Top teams wouldn’t even entertain recruiting Plowman let alone hand out a 3 year contract.
Look at someone like Stewart from Geelongs who came to Geelong via the GFL at pick 40.
He plays in the same position as Plowman and is so much better yet SOS picks him at 3 as a junior then picks him again with a crap trade.
He got the job because he is a Carlton Legend and A mate of the President.
Jobs for the boys.

The biggest issue is the club itself.
It continues to ignore the fact that it still out of touch with the realities of on field success in the 21 st century.
How you fix that?
That’s the question I don’t have an answer for.
Maybe if we continue to be at best average for another 20 years something may give.

OK, I'll bite. That smart arsed last line deserves an answer. You're off the mark IMHO, despite your know-it-all smugness.
You didn't mention player development once. SOS picked players with a skill set he or BB wanted. He was also forced to punt on players like Setterfield, Kennedy, Plowman, Marchbank in two for one deals because everybody knows you can't rely on the draft to rebuild from the ground up. All of those have shown something, even though none will ever win a Brownlow.
The kids need a bit of time as a rule.
SPS is being crucified as a defender. he isn't strong enough and his instincts are not as a defender. He is an outside player who has been turned into a robot by successive coaches and the boys club of waxing. The sooner they get broken up, the better.
LOB is a running machine with elite foot skills. We have a game plan that doesn't let any of the runners free. We won't know if he can really play until he is given licence to run and carry and then we will see if the boys wax club keep ignoring him like they ignore SPS and Cunningham, speaking of whom; he has elite pace and pretty good ball skills but as an outside player gets ignored as well and has to get his own footy. Willo is similar but despite his vast experience of twenty odd games gets pilloried here for trying to take the game on.
I am as pissed off as anybody but we have shown we can mix it for two, three and occasionally four quarters with the big boys.
It isn't skill in the team that's the big issue, it's mostly between the ears and the game plan that puts players under constant pressure with ball in hand.
Let's look at games won and lost.
The Newnes goal was cancelled by the Gray goal. We should have beaten Port and lost to Freo.
Geelong was a coaching issue. We stopped what we were doing and let Geelong get the wind in their sails and then watched. Ablett missed and we won but the fact is, had the coach put an extra man on Ragatulea to chop him out, they wouldn't have been so close.
Collingwood and GWS were replays of Geelong. The coach didn't do ANYTHING to stop the run that beat us. He doesn't make in-game changes. He might have put Levi back to stop them marking.
He might have put someone different on Daicos. No. NOTHING.
GWS the same.

I know it's fashionable to slag off at SOS and the recruiting from back then and perhaps there is reason for it. Some of the picks haven't come on as quickly we would have liked.
Don't forget SOS picked up Charlie, Harry, Walsh, Willo, Cunningham, Stocker (who isn't playing for personal reasons and nothing to do with SOS), Philp, Honey, Fisher, who all show something, Kemp, Cottrell, who might turn into a contested beast or be a hard at it run with player, traded in Doc and those above from GWS. He almost had O'Meara, Papley and Shiels and would have had Cogs except the AFL stepped in. He missed Butler but had to go harder for Papley because of the Essendon** fracas.

It's still too early to write off half a dozen kids 22 and less. It's also too early to guarantee they will make it but mostly they have shown glimpses of what they are capable of, It's up to Teague and the club psycho to make them do it consistently.

We are one win and % outside the eight after throwing away at least four games we should have won from where we were at half time or three quarter time. Four weeks ago we were in position to finish top 6. The players choked. That's a lack of experience and lack of on and off field leadership, which can turn around pretty fast if the coach has the balls.

If you can't see any positives out of that lot, perhaps you aren't looking hard enough. Perhaps I know SFA and you are right.

We'll find out soon enough.

As I said this season is even a better indicator of where you are at in terms of the other 17 teams. It is clear to me that many in this site haven’t a clue what the rest do. They just look at their own back yard.

As a club we don’t get it.
Essendon** don’t get it.
Hawthorn don’t get it
Richmond do
Geelong do
Port do
WC do
I grant you culture and development helps and the gloss has been lost on Teague. He clearly has his favourite players.

To me the fundamental football issue is Recruiting and List Management.
SOS in five years has failed. Whose idea was it to fly Shiel around in a jet after the worst year in the club’s history. That shows a club internally that is out of touch with the realities of building success.

One of SOS s final tasks was to make sure Martin fitted in nicely to the club. Then his ego says @#$%&! youse all.Yet another superstar to bring the club back where it belongs. Just like Judd. Just like McGovern
Has Martin been that player. No. Our we any better with him in the team. No
Compare us from the second half of last year to this year. Have we improved. Only slightly.
We are harder to play against but our skill level is crap. That’s because of the players he recruited.
Players internally are overrated.
Top teams wouldn’t even entertain recruiting Plowman let alone hand out a 3 year contract.
Look at someone like Stewart from Geelongs who came to Geelong via the GFL at pick 40.
He plays in the same position as Plowman and is so much better yet SOS picks him at 3 as a junior then picks him again with a crap trade.
He got the job because he is a Carlton Legend and A mate of the President.
Jobs for the boys.

The biggest issue is the club itself.
It continues to ignore the fact that it still out of touch with the realities of on field success in the 21 st century.
How you fix that?
That’s the question I don’t have an answer for.
Maybe if we continue to be at best average for another 20 years something may give.

OK, I'll bite. That smart arsed last line deserves an answer. You're off the mark IMHO, despite your know-it-all smugness.
You didn't mention player development once. SOS picked players with a skill set he or BB wanted. He was also forced to punt on players like Setterfield, Kennedy, Plowman, Marchbank in two for one deals because everybody knows you can't rely on the draft to rebuild from the ground up. All of those have shown something, even though none will ever win a Brownlow.
The kids need a bit of time as a rule.
SPS is being crucified as a defender. he isn't strong enough and his instincts are not as a defender. He is an outside player who has been turned into a robot by successive coaches and the boys club of waxing. The sooner they get broken up, the better.
LOB is a running machine with elite foot skills. We have a game plan that doesn't let any of the runners free. We won't know if he can really play until he is given licence to run and carry and then we will see if the boys wax club keep ignoring him like they ignore SPS and Cunningham, speaking of whom; he has elite pace and pretty good ball skills but as an outside player gets ignored as well and has to get his own footy. Willo is similar but despite his vast experience of twenty odd games gets pilloried here for trying to take the game on.
I am as pissed off as anybody but we have shown we can mix it for two, three and occasionally four quarters with the big boys.
It isn't skill in the team that's the big issue, it's mostly between the ears and the game plan that puts players under constant pressure with ball in hand.
Let's look at games won and lost.
The Newnes goal was cancelled by the Gray goal. We should have beaten Port and lost to Freo.
Geelong was a coaching issue. We stopped what we were doing and let Geelong get the wind in their sails and then watched. Ablett missed and we won but the fact is, had the coach put an extra man on Ragatulea to chop him out, they wouldn't have been so close.
Collingwood and GWS were replays of Geelong. The coach didn't do ANYTHING to stop the run that beat us. He doesn't make in-game changes. He might have put Levi back to stop them marking.
He might have put someone different on Daicos. No. NOTHING.
GWS the same.

I know it's fashionable to slag off at SOS and the recruiting from back then and perhaps there is reason for it. Some of the picks haven't come on as quickly we would have liked.
Don't forget SOS picked up Charlie, Harry, Walsh, Willo, Cunningham, Stocker (who isn't playing for personal reasons and nothing to do with SOS), Philp, Honey, Fisher, who all show something, Kemp, Cottrell, who might turn into a contested beast or be a hard at it run with player, traded in Doc and those above from GWS. He almost had O'Meara, Papley and Shiels and would have had Cogs except the AFL stepped in. He missed Butler but had to go harder for Papley because of the Essendon** fracas.

It's still too early to write off half a dozen kids 22 and less. It's also too early to guarantee they will make it but mostly they have shown glimpses of what they are capable of, It's up to Teague and the club psycho to make them do it consistently.

We are one win and % outside the eight after throwing away at least four games we should have won from where we were at half time or three quarter time. Four weeks ago we were in position to finish top 6. The players choked. That's a lack of experience and lack of on and off field leadership, which can turn around pretty fast if the coach has the balls.

If you can't see any positives out of that lot, perhaps you aren't looking hard enough. Perhaps I know SFA and you are right.

We'll find out soon enough.

Sorry Keogh but I disagree entirely. I think we are a much better side with Martin in it and I think we are an improved side from last year. I will also be looking for improvement next year but whether that means we play finals only time will tell.

We are 12 th with a % of 95
That tells you where we are at and this is what you guys don’t get
COMPARED TO THE OTHER TEAMS

Look beyond your own back yard

You think Martin has been a good acquisition
Other than the first game.
What has he done. Why doesn’t he consistently play in the middle. Wasn’t that the plan.
He picks and chooses.
Thing is if you watched him at GC you would get it
But he moves beautifully. Yeah but how has he added to the team.

Point is boys we are 12 th 5 years into a rebuild.
Ask yourself would you take that in 2015

We are 12 th with a % of 95
That tells you where we are at and this is what you guys don’t get
COMPARED TO THE OTHER TEAMS

Look beyond your own back yard

You think Martin has been a good acquisition
Other than the first game.
What has he done. Why doesn’t he consistently play in the middle. Wasn’t that the plan.
He picks and chooses.
Thing is if you watched him at GC you would get it
But he moves beautifully. Yeah but how has he added to the team.

Point is boys we are 12 th 5 years into a rebuild.
Ask yourself would you take that in 2015

Nothing has changed. We continually go for the big banana and miss what we can actually get. It’s the same with the Judd deal.