Have we stuffed up again? For so many years we were criticised for recruiting old players and not investing enough in the draft, and now we have woken up and invested in a draft driven rebuild, but is it possible we've timed it all wrong again? I just feel teams these days invest more on hard bodies and experience, FA has probably facilitated this to a degree. Richmond held their nerve and persisted with their list and now they're all experienced hard arses. Could we be as good if we still had the likes of Waite, Betts, Tuohy, Garlett, Gibbs, Grigg, Robinson, Henderson, etc? Remember it wasnt that long ago we were better than Richmond and West Coast for that matter. The Dominator said at the Hall of Fame night young players find the physicality of the game harder now than ever before. Have we done it all wrong again? Thoughts?

No.

We had a bush league list when Malthouse was sakced so we had to draft talent.

We've obviously still got some weeding to do.

Nope.

Given the gaping chasm left from our drafting between 2008 (Kreuzer) and 2015 (Weitering, Curnow, McKay, Cuningham), and the wreckage left behind by the Malthouse era, there was absolutely no choice but to maximise the draft for all we could. The only other option would've been to follow the post Salary-rort era and give everything up for experienced players that other teams were happy to give. Ultimately this gap resulted in us having to do this anyway (Kerridge, Wright, Mullett etc), but as "backup" rather than being essential to our list strategy.

The years during that period where we were strong were on the back of our better players hitting the right age, and on the back of an all-time great. But the warning signs were there, and it was clear that for a variety of reasons the club wasn't equipped to take the next step. We didn't have the depth of other top teams then, and our list management decisions were still pretty short-sighted. In short, we had no @#$%&! idea how to manage a list, and the teams that did swiftly overtook us or galloped further away.

Pining over Betts, Robinson, Waite etc is pointless now, but yes had we been able to keep them all (and disciplined in the case of Garlett and Robinson), we'd be in a much better state now, because they'd be the "senior bodies" our new kids could rely on. But everything about our player and list management was [REDACTED] during that time, but it WAS a different time with a different group in charge. It's academic now, and the past is past.

Since then we've changed President, CEO (twice), Coach and actually resourced list management for the first time ever. Whether the people we have now are THE people to take us where we want to get is still up for debate, but they're a damn sight better than what we did have. Going back to revisionist history, many of the above players would've probably stayed had we been resourced as we now are.

But again, it's in the past and what's done is done. The club [REDACTED] it, they appear to know they [REDACTED] it, and went back to the drawing board. The strategy was to bring as much young talent into the club as possible, and then top up with FA's when the window opened on the types of players we wanted. This was stated at the start of SOS' tenure, and appears to continue to be our path.

Everyone has their opinions and emotions, but this is what I signed on for when the changes were made, albeit with more pain than I'd expected. Nonetheless I'll continue to accept it unless a better solution presents itself, and I believe supporters and members should as well.

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WADA medical director Dr Alan Vernec describes Essendon* FC drug case as biggest scandal in team sport the world of sport has seen. #WC2WB

#GUILTY

No. Where are the majority of those players in 3 years time?

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dane's trolling again

Retired.
As will the Richmond players but they'll be dual premiership players.

100% we got this wrong
We have drafted in 16 National draft picks in the last 3 years
We currently have 3 maybe 4 that are going to be long term
Ýou only have to look at GWS GC Saints Demons that rebuilding with kids is a lottery.
We adapted a philosophy because Hawks did 15 years ago.
Dogs got lucky.
Studies done in the USA where there are far less players in a team show that knocking down and going to the draft very rarely leads to success
The secret now is player injuries you can see this with Adelaide and Sydney they have better list than tigers but they have been blessed.
You need a playing group that gives your self a chance and push for the 8.
If all the cards fall into place you give yourself a shot just like Doggies and tigers.
Tigers spent years trying to get in 8 and had a situation come finals time where they had a clean slate with injuries.
History shows a pick 1 isn't going to be any better than a pick 12. In carltons case pick 12, 12 and 13 are our best players.
You also need to attract players and retain players bottoming out wont do this.
You get the occasional player who leaves for a bucket load of cash but most want success.
And if you chuck a heap of money at one player it often gets the present playing group nose out of joint particularly if they have taken less to stay.
Carlton now in its current position needs to spend less on recruiting and more on development and medical.

We stuffed this up big time


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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

You must be a bloody good judge to write off 12 maybe 13 players that are still somewhere between years 1 and 2.5 into their development.
Have you ever thought of going into list management?

Martin, Cotchin, Rance, Riewodlt, Shane Edwards, Ellis, Grimes, Astbury, Daniel Rioli, Jack Higgins, Nick Vlastuin, Lambert etc etc were all drafted by Richmond doesn't this tell you something? Yep they've added some good players but the stars or the side have been drafted!

Carlton's problem is the 20 recycled players traded in apart from a few are only C and D graders (many are F graders).

Nope. We needed to do that.
We’ve now got the layer of quality youth.
Next phase us to add quality mature players to replace the duds like Rowe, Graham, Jones etc.
off field changes need to be made to development, conditioning and strategy staff.

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James Hird and Essendon* FC - #FOREVERDRUGCHEATS

From where we were at, we had NO choice other than go down the full rebuild.

Players that will forge our team and push us into finals have been drafted, we don't need 5 A graders we need a couple and good team spirit which I genuinely believe we have.

Doc, Cripps, Curnow and maybe Marchbank are A graders, we then have Dow, Fisher, Plowman, SPS and Willo that I believe will be B Graders. After that McKay, SOSOS, Ker, Lang, Kennedy, Macreadie, Weitering and O'Brien that could become B graders (too early to tell)

That is not a bad team in 30 - 50 games time, add a couple extra draft pick and a quality FA and we are on our way.

The risk in the strategy is where we are at now, that is remove too many mature bodies and the young bodies will get battered and bruised and injury toll will rise.

No.

I agree that development and medical has been a criminally ignored area of the club for a long time, and I can only hope that this season is the club's "Hiroshima moment" to finally end what has been a pretty shambolic history.

I don't agree though that it should come at the expense of list management.

_________________
WADA medical director Dr Alan Vernec describes Essendon* FC drug case as biggest scandal in team sport the world of sport has seen. #WC2WB

#GUILTY

The list management is all wrong .Bolton thinks that getting games into kids is the way to go but it is contributing to the long injury list.
We have guys in there early 20's constantly sitting on the sidelines and we have recruited players who have struggled to get on the park
We shouldn't be putting kids like Dow in the guts to win contested ball against 26 and 27 year olds and older Palmer should have been doing that
Marchbank is 22 and struggles to get on the park because each week he comes up against solid body forwards . Same goes for Weitering.
By the time most get in their mid 20 's their bodies will be battered from pillar to post.
Look at Cripps he is starting to look like a baby face oldman.
Watching Charlie getting triple teamed yesterday was scary.
Medical staff have their work cut out just getting them out there.

They have got this wrong


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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Where are they how? Grigg doing well.

How are you supposed to draft 'talent' when the AFL is constantly propping up new expansion clubs across the country? Where is this so called talent supposed to come from? Do the math - population of 25 million. Take away women and children and that leaves how many? Now how many are actually playing football that are left? This is why you have so called footballers who stand dead set in front of goal and they miss. They are NOT footballers. They are picked for size, or their ability to run, ie. athletes. Not footballers. To counter this abomination the AFL CONSTANTLY changes the rules of the game so these precious little athletes are not damaged and their carriers ruined by anything physical. So we need the game to be speed based. And anything that holds up play is penalized. And each year more and more rule changes will be implemented until this once great game will no longer be recognizable and a game of over officiation played by anything but footballers - which is already happening. Levi Casboult as a perfect example. Can't kick, cant run, picked for size in the hope with 'special training' ie. Sav Rocca, can be turned into a footballer. What a bloody shambles. He'd be long gone if not for the fact he can catch ...WOW!

If, and I mean IF there is a shred of talent in some youngsters the AFL will give expansion clubs first pick, second pick, third pick and so on to prop them up to try and manufacture success. Going to the draft? What draft? That's not a draft. Picking sub-par athletes in the hope they can be turned into footballers because they have big tanks and can run or are tall and well built. How rare are these talents? We have not had a genuine talent in front of goal since Fevola. That's how rare they are. The closest we've got to one since Josh Kennedy and we traded him off for Judd ...

Our list is bereft of talent. No ifs or buts about it. Why do you think Bolton is all about 'education' ? He is trying to 'educate' these athletes into footballers. Any decent footballer is quickly snaveled up by the AFL and shipped off interstate to prop up the AFLs latest quest to cash in some expansion club. It shits me to high heaven when some moron supporter WA, SA, Syd whatever crows about how good their team is when nearly their entire list consists of VICTORIAN players. Interstate junior football doesn't even come close to Victorian junior football. Yet traditional Victorian clubs are left picking over the crumbs of the left overs in the hope they can 'educate' these youngins into footballs elite. What a joke.

And next year, and you can take this to the bank, the AFL will introduce another set of rule changes to try and make the game faster to try and cover for the hatchet job they've done on this once great game. Quantity not quality is the name of the game.

Makes a bit of sense. We need to play players in positions that they will support their own and others development.

Good post.
I'm confident that if we keep our current crop of players, draft a couple more quality mids (Walsh and ?) and bring in another quality mid through free agency we are looking the goods for 2020 and beyond.
Just need to be more competitive and stop the haemorrhaging for the next year or so while the kids develop.

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There is no footy god

Never felt the draftees were bad, its the recycled players where we have failed.

Yeah if we kept Grigg it would be premierships galore.

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dane's trolling again

We will only improve from now on , can't get any worse