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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:46 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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jimmae wrote:
No idea why we're handcuffing ourselves to that strategy.


It's the Casboult factor


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:00 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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showbag wrote:
jimmae wrote:
No idea why we're handcuffing ourselves to that strategy.


It's the Casboult factor

I was hoping someone caught onto that. :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:01 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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jimmae wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Everitt is not a KP and cannot play that role.

Well, I'm convinced


Well you really don't want me to explain why he isn't either. :wink:


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:14 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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SurreyBlue wrote:
jimmae wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Everitt is not a KP and cannot play that role.

Well, I'm convinced


Well you really don't want me to explain why he isn't either. :wink:

He's tall, he draws a key defender, he provides a target in the air when used as a deep forward.

There's many complicated facets to football strategy, including how coaches can use their key forwards (take Franklin, for example), but that part's pretty straight forward.

What you're trying to say is he's not a power forward, and I would argue that there are plenty of forward structures in which such a forward isn't needed, and there's no need to frequently smash a pack at all. BB was coaching Hawthorn's forward line, which relied on hard leads and bringing the ball to ground in a contested situation more often than kicking to contests and hoping for the big grab.

I love what an in-form Levi can bring, but if we want our forwards to be clutching the ball from third deep in a 5-man pack all the time we've got rocks in our head.

Everitt is a tall target, he's shown that repeatedly with some great leads back with the flight, and from the top of the square to fly for the mark.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:42 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Jimmae - I like your passion and certainly admire you for defending our players but Everitt hates contact, refuses to go when it's his turn, does not tackle, remotely applies pressure on opposition ball carriers and has no repeat efforts. I agree what he does is lead and mark well in front and because he is 194cm, he demands a tall. He is not however and never will be a KP player. BTW - I could be wrong but I can never remember Everitt taking 1 mark running the same way as the footy, let alone remotely into traffic. He has a role out of the pocket but only if he learns to do the 1% and protect his area. BB will either sort him out or move him on. Let's see which it is.

Franklin as you say is an athletic freak but apart from that he thrives on the man on man contest and certainly asserts his presence on a forward line. The very reason he is a damn good key position toward!


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:59 pm 
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Rod Ashman

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jimmae wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
jimmae wrote:
SurreyBlue wrote:
Everitt is not a KP and cannot play that role.

Well, I'm convinced


Well you really don't want me to explain why he isn't either. :wink:

He's tall, he draws a key defender, he provides a target in the air when used as a deep forward.

There's many complicated facets to football strategy, including how coaches can use their key forwards (take Franklin, for example), but that part's pretty straight forward.

What you're trying to say is he's not a power forward, and I would argue that there are plenty of forward structures in which such a forward isn't needed, and there's no need to frequently smash a pack at all. BB was coaching Hawthorn's forward line, which relied on hard leads and bringing the ball to ground in a contested situation more often than kicking to contests and hoping for the big grab.

I love what an in-form Levi can bring, but if we want our forwards to be clutching the ball from third deep in a 5-man pack all the time we've got rocks in our head.

Everitt is a tall target, he's shown that repeatedly with some great leads back with the flight, and from the top of the square to fly for the mark.


Totally correct. Everitt is crucial to any semblance of a forward line this season


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 11:02 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Forward pressure is definitely something he can work on, I agree, but whereas the general consensus on forums seems to be that he is soft, I think it's got more to do with his lateral movement, how he makes his forward runs in combination with how much he leaves in the tank to run the other way, and the angles of approach he takes to close down opponents, which is to say he's not much of a defender.

That's something that can be fixed with training, but right now we're trying to fix every line and role on the ground. What I hope is that his talent is recognised internally, and that he is steadily built up to play the way the coaches want so long as he's at the club. What I hope isn't happening is him getting slapped with the kind of labels thrown on him around here and left languishing in the twos because he is a 'known variable', rather than offering the player a fuller explanation.

That's the kind of thinking that destroys football clubs because you shut yourself off to future opportunities without offering up an explanation that makes sense to not only the immediate parties, but to anyone who they pass the details onto. Even if you part ways with a player, if you are ultimately constructive in these situations, you foster relationships down the road that open up to signings, trades and other exchanges on the back of that previous good will.

The counter point to that is obviously you can be taken for a sucker, but that's a judgement call, and the structures, targets and mediation that you put in place prior will serve you well in justifying your actions when someone tries to manipulate that and shirk the blame for an outcome.

TL;DR version: good communication is good.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:01 am 
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Serge Silvagni

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club29 wrote:
Rhys26 wrote:
Kruezer a very lucky man to have kept his spot.
We are almost a player short with him in the side.
At the end of his career Josh Fraser will be recongnised as a better player then Kruze


They still might make a late change. Team looks too big to me as is.
No way we can keep them under 100 with that line up. Rebound city.


Agree with this the side does look too big and whilst prior to last week I'd have had Phillips out he played his best game last week (not saying much) and probably deserves another shot - personally I'd have rested Kreuzer for the week and saved him the long flights as well.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:42 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Graham doesn't add pace.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:49 am 
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Rod McGregor

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jimmae wrote:
Forward pressure is definitely something he can work on, I agree, but whereas the general consensus on forums seems to be that he is soft, I think it's got more to do with his lateral movement, how he makes his forward runs in combination with how much he leaves in the tank to run the other way, and the angles of approach he takes to close down opponents, which is to say he's not much of a defender.

That's something that can be fixed with training, but right now we're trying to fix every line and role on the ground. What I hope is that his talent is recognised internally, and that he is steadily built up to play the way the coaches want so long as he's at the club. What I hope isn't happening is him getting slapped with the kind of labels thrown on him around here and left languishing in the twos because he is a 'known variable', rather than offering the player a fuller explanation.

That's the kind of thinking that destroys football clubs because you shut yourself off to future opportunities without offering up an explanation that makes sense to not only the immediate parties, but to anyone who they pass the details onto. Even if you part ways with a player, if you are ultimately constructive in these situations, you foster relationships down the road that open up to signings, trades and other exchanges on the back of that previous good will.

The counter point to that is obviously you can be taken for a sucker, but that's a judgement call, and the structures, targets and mediation that you put in place prior will serve you well in justifying your actions when someone tries to manipulate that and shirk the blame for an outcome.

TL;DR version: good communication is good.


Can't have both Everitt and Casboult in the same forward line. Both add zero pressure. Opposition eyes would light up at the thought. They already do with Casboult alone. If you had to choose one you choose Everitt as he hits scoreboard, is more versatile, and simply a better player.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:00 am 
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Harry Vallence

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One word Liam Jones :donk:

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 11:50 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Poor Liam is on a hiding to nothing

We will push up the ground at subi leaving the forward 50 empty as usual , he will be sprinting up and back, up and back.

He wont get to lead directly at the footy like he has been in the VFL and he wont get the delivery like in the VFL.

Everyone will call him shit and say nothing has changed, despite all the work he has put in over the off season and the improvement he has shown in the VFL.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 11:51 am 
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Serge Silvagni

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Clayman wrote:
One word Liam Jones :donk:


That would be two words?


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 11:59 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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grrofunger wrote:
Poor Liam is on a hiding to nothing

We will push up the ground at subi leaving the forward 50 empty as usual , he will be sprinting up and back, up and back.

He wont get to lead directly at the footy like he has been in the VFL and he wont get the delivery like in the VFL.

Everyone will call him shit and say nothing has changed, despite all the work he has put in over the off season and the improvement he has shown in the VFL.


.......and if they give him another week it will be versus the bumholes at the G after flying back from Perth. That's often a death sentence and the fans will be looking for soft targets to blame.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 12:00 pm 
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John Nicholls

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cimm1979 wrote:
Graham doesn't add pace.


He does compared to Phillips, Kreuzer, Casboult, Jamison, White and Rowe


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 12:16 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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sinbagger wrote:
cimm1979 wrote:
Graham doesn't add pace.


He does compared to Phillips, Kreuzer, Casboult, Jamison, White and Rowe



I think everyone except Rowe has him covered.

:wink:

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 12:18 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Over 10 metres i think Graham.
Over 40 I reckon Sammy.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 12:26 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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White not named in the VFL today, did he travel over as well?

grrofunger wrote:
Poor Liam is on a hiding to nothing

We will push up the ground at subi leaving the forward 50 empty as usual , he will be sprinting up and back, up and back.

He wont get to lead directly at the footy like he has been in the VFL and he wont get the delivery like in the VFL.

Everyone will call him shit and say nothing has changed, despite all the work he has put in over the off season and the improvement he has shown in the VFL.

Then I have great news: he is steadily improving and involving himself in the build-up play and doubling back to the 50.

AGRO wrote:
sinbagger wrote:
cimm1979 wrote:
Graham doesn't add pace.


He does compared to Phillips, Kreuzer, Casboult, Jamison, White and Rowe



I think everyone except Rowe has him covered.

:wink:

Look, I enjoy a little hyperbole in jest as much as the next guy, but do you genuinely believe that?

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 12:57 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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SurreyBlue wrote:
Everitt is not a KP and cannot play that role.
Jones however is a KP and hopefully he has finally learnt what is needed to play that role. I feel it's now or never with Jones. Let's hope we see plenty of leads towards the ball carrier, plenty of marks with arms fully stretched, plenty of 2nd and 3rd efforts, multiple leads, no sitting back behind the play waiting for the big mark over the back and plenty of locking in the footy in our f50. Will be interesting!

If he takes too many chest marks we should drop him. Everybody knows you take marks in your hands. I don't give a shite if he kicks ten goals and we win by sixty points. Too may chest marks and that's it. Back to to the twos.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 1:56 pm 
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John Nicholls

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jimmae wrote:
White not named in the VFL today, did he travel over as well?

grrofunger wrote:
Poor Liam is on a hiding to nothing

We will push up the ground at subi leaving the forward 50 empty as usual , he will be sprinting up and back, up and back.

He wont get to lead directly at the footy like he has been in the VFL and he wont get the delivery like in the VFL.

Everyone will call him shit and say nothing has changed, despite all the work he has put in over the off season and the improvement he has shown in the VFL.

Then I have great news: he is steadily improving and involving himself in the build-up play and doubling back to the 50.

AGRO wrote:
sinbagger wrote:
cimm1979 wrote:
Graham doesn't add pace.


He does compared to Phillips, Kreuzer, Casboult, Jamison, White and Rowe



I think everyone except Rowe has him covered.

:wink:

Look, I enjoy a little hyperbole in jest as much as the next guy, but do you genuinely believe that?


I'm taking the little winky emoticon as a sign that Agro posted in jest....


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