Talking Carlton Index Lochie O'Brien Kerryn Harrington Lochie O'Brien Kerryn Harrington CFC Home CFC Membership CFC Shop CFC Fixture Blueseum
It is currently Tue Jun 10, 2025 4:43 am

All times are UTC + 10 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 134 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 12:12 pm 
Offline
Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25008
Location: Bondi Beach
Synbad wrote:
...
Everybody should and must know what happened to this football club
And why this happened
Those responsible and their shills must be pointer out for all future generations.. Kids growing up should know why the Carlton football club was trashed.. Why and by whom!
Those that tried to shield the truth are also responsible as those that murdered it.
Those silencers of truth should never be allowed to do their job and speak about transparency!
...


Fair enough too.

If that's the case then they should be on notice.

Keep up the good work...if you're right...and I do think you have a strong case coz the culprits since our failure are still on the Board.

_________________
Everyone looks good in Navy Blue


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 12:13 pm 
Offline
Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25008
Location: Bondi Beach
Oh yeah... back to the thread.... its not just a better game style Bolton has brought in its also a better game plan and it seems our players know what they need to, but not up to the mark.

_________________
Everyone looks good in Navy Blue


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:13 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
The game style will flux and flow depending on who's in.
Who you're playing and so on..
You need an underlying game plan but you're not always going to be allowed to play it.
Ultimately before you can have a game style that's realistic you need your cornerstones down.
What happens on the football field is definitively a crystallization on everything the club is from top to bottom.
People often don't agree with this because they can't see the correlation between what happens on the field on Saturday afternoon with what the players are doing .
And.. What happens every day in a football club on all tiers (that you cannot see)
Fundamentals and cornerstones are crucial to every organization.
You're not going to just get a great gameplan that translates into the field just because you brought in a coach.
The danger is Bolton will be assassinated inside two years because the bottom line is results

The board then will absolve itself of any wrong doing pointing to a transparent Australia wide process to find the right coach.
Humiliated with poor results we will want him sacked too!
The new coach will then be brought in and we begin again

When we were under the pump we still reverted back to the same gameplan.
Leadership went missing
No real targets up forward
Indecisiveness etc

Richmond didn't clamp down on anybody. That game was a free game by both sides.

The gameplan isn't on display as yet

The players always have known what's expected
Seldom over the last fifteen years have they followed it under pressure!

Let's see this week!

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:16 pm 
Offline
Ken Hunter
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:32 am
Posts: 10557
bondiblue wrote:
Oh yeah... back to the thread.... its not just a better game style Bolton has brought in its also a better game plan and it seems our players know what they need to, but not up to the mark.


Spot on. The players have bought in on the plan because it's the blue print of success. More importantly the plan is an updated system of a similar plan some of the players executed a few years ago, so not to foreign. The problem is execution of the plan and ability to execute. This is where Bolton will step in.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:41 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
See there is no blueprint to success with a gameplan
Gameplans rely on a couple of things
A) surprise with each year or two somebody coming up with something different
1) they get worked out
B) execution . what hawthorn did with their players won't necessarily work with ours because you can't superimpose yourself on that gameplan
C) need years of recruiting towards a gameplan
Meaning you need coach stability
In order to have stability in coaching you can't be getting smashed too often. Which by extension means you cannot fall away too much
Most of the clubs languishing around the bottom for an extended period of time have done so because they have languished for an extended period of time.

There are clubs that have gone down but still had players from success and reasonable success passing down the torch.
We don't have that critical mass because generation after generation of players we have brought into or system haven't found the torch alight

There are no standards for success
Whatever the coach says our does means jack in that kind of environment

You cannot allow anything to fall away to our standing no matter what anybody tells you

The three most hopeless clubs over the last fifteen years are a constant

Each having a meaningless spike up the ladder but then dock back down

The west coasts go down but bounce back up into contention
Geelong same
Adelaide same

You need to watch the patterns and human behavior

There are no easy fixes here

Sos
Bolton
Etc

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:52 pm 
Offline
Stephen Kernahan
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:12 pm
Posts: 15582
Location: Upper Swan.
Synbad wrote:
Let's see this week!


Why would one week make a difference?

_________________
I hope Essendon* folds.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 1:56 pm 
Offline
Ken Hunter
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:16 pm
Posts: 14591
Location: Sydney
Adam Chatfield wrote:
Synners is like the Donald Trump of this forum.

All big picture, not much on the details and a great knack of getting people's attention.

In many ways it's to be admired, others its flowering frustrating that the apparent vindication for being right seems to override the hope for the club succeeding.

I do think it's a better place with Synners around, so stay here even when you are proven incorrect/given a hard time by others!


You read his posts? I just see the Scream avatar and think "oh that's right, it's THE BOARD".

Well I guess THE BOARD let us down against Sydney but I'm optimistic that THE BOARD will come out firing against Gold Coast. Carn THE BOARD!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 2:43 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
cimm1979 wrote:
Synbad wrote:
Let's see this week!


Why would one week make a difference?

Then the week after and the week after
Its a week by week proposition
And the gameplan will fall away and appear etc
They might have structures that they're attempting to uphold but, the challenge is upholding them consistently over a long spells of a game and games?
So it's about the sequence.
If they cannot play the structures devised the question is do you blame the coach?
Chop change?
Flog them to death?
Tricky yeah?

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 2:56 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
GreatEx wrote:
Adam Chatfield wrote:
Synners is like the Donald Trump of this forum.

All big picture, not much on the details and a great knack of getting people's attention.

In many ways it's to be admired, others its flowering frustrating that the apparent vindication for being right seems to override the hope for the club succeeding.

I do think it's a better place with Synners around, so stay here even when you are proven incorrect/given a hard time by others!


You read his posts? I just see the Scream avatar and think "oh that's right, it's THE BOARD".

Well I guess THE BOARD let us down against Sydney but I'm optimistic that THE BOARD will come out firing against Gold Coast. Carn THE BOARD!

That's a perfect example of how the average supporter thinks and it's why boards can get away with BLUE MURDER!!

I'm glad I don't look at the world the way you do. Where I blame twenty drafts alone and the players hatched from each of those drafts as to why we're here today!

The truth is footballers make up a fraction of the staff employed by the club.. Even though on your mind you're finding it impossible to understand that if a football club was only made up of footballs three quarters of the people employed by a football club wouldn't have a job

Now this is the key bit.

Listening?

The board of directors chaired by president give the whole thing direction and guidance.
You can't even have a team or anybody else at the club without a board.
Everything that happens at any organization is directed by the directors.
Ever wondered why the board is made up of people called directors?
No?

Now without these people nobody at the club can exist doing whatever they're doing .. They're therefore responsible for all good on around the club


You may ask questions if you're finding the whole thing overwhelming.
And yes I know most people go to the football and watch the footballers
That's the final product of what's been put together .
Example a car.
You drive your car it's nice I'm sure ...
But it didn't just pop up there without a context!
A whole bunch of things happened before it was in the showroom
Think of the players as a car

At the manufacturing company the engineers didn't just get together as squatters in a building and design it
Source parts
Market it
Organize reserves of spare parts all by themselves

It began with the board and filtered down

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 2:59 pm 
Offline
Stephen Kernahan
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:12 pm
Posts: 15582
Location: Upper Swan.
Synbad wrote:
cimm1979 wrote:
Synbad wrote:
Let's see this week!


Why would one week make a difference?

Then the week after and the week after
Its a week by week proposition
And the gameplan will fall away and appear etc
They might have structures that they're attempting to uphold but, the challenge is upholding them consistently over a long spells of a game and games?
So it's about the sequence.
If they cannot play the structures devised the question is do you blame the coach?
Chop change?
Flog them to death?
Tricky yeah?


Not really.

I haven't seen one person on here think we'll win more than six, most have around 4 and every pundit in the land had us last or second last.

The club has talked about resets and rebuilds, the coaches have said they want to see green shoots. So far all this points to a realistic outlook from most people.

Can the board hold it's nerve? I don't know but I think, just at the moment, there is no hint of panic or rumblings about the coach.

If I had to describe it, the current commentary on our team is much more sympathetic than it has been and more in line with the positive vibes the Pies have got for 3 years.

_________________
I hope Essendon* folds.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 3:52 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
So let's get this straight!
after fifteen years and the same people in charge for the last few you don't see us winning much again..
But you think everything is going according to plan?
May I ask you what's going to plan here exactly?
This is a mind boggling mentality ofPosttraumatic stress disorder
Where shell shocked veterans in war by defensive in built mechanism attempts to block any cues that might be related to the incident(s)
Interesting indeed!
You cannot forget the past to understand any context.. You are here because of the past decisions made .
And you're also carrying those past decisions forward with you.. Plus it's the same decision makers who have made those choices those who will continue to what will crystallize on the football ground every minute, every quarter, every game, every season

I'm sorry but that is how it is

We have a very poor list and very bad culture with some very unfortunate habits.
That beast will contribute to raise its ugly head each time it's being challenged

That's human nature! In our case it's a collective nature which is a culture!


Remember when you see this over and over again.
You need to put it in its context.. It's something that evolved in our culture not by bad luck but by a history of choices

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 4:00 pm 
Offline
Stephen Kernahan
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:12 pm
Posts: 15582
Location: Upper Swan.
Synbad wrote:
So let's get this straight!
after fifteen years and the same people in charge for the last few you don't see us winning much again..
But you think everything is going according to plan?
May I ask you what's going to plan here exactly?
This is a mind boggling mentality ofPosttraumatic stress disorder
Where shell shocked veterans in war by defensive in built mechanism attempts to block any cues that might be related to the incident(s)
Interesting indeed!
You cannot forget the past to understand any context.. You are here because of the past decisions made .
And you're also carrying those past decisions forward with you.. Plus it's the same decision makers who have made those choices those who will continue to what will crystallize on the football ground every minute, every quarter, every game, every season

I'm sorry but that is how it is

We have a very poor list and very bad culture with some very unfortunate habits.
That beast will contribute to raise its ugly head each time it's being challenged

That's human nature! In our case it's a collective nature which is a culture!


Remember when you see this over and over again.
You need to put it in its context.. It's something that evolved in our culture not by bad luck but by a history of choices


Which brings me back to

What difference will a week make?

Why are you equivocating? Why wait a week?

For the same reason you didn't come on here last week after a reasonable showing against Richmond.

Make a statement, get off the fence. You don't need to wait a week to proclaim everything going forward as doomed. Do it now.

_________________
I hope Essendon* folds.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 4:42 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
A week is part of a sequence which makes up a block
I explained that already.
I don't even worry about the scoreboard
Anybody that knows me knows I'm a big picture guy and don't get my thrills from say the Richmond final a few years ago.
Was about the next week

And I don't think we have a definitive gameplan after round one

Watch through the game and see how many minutes quarters then games can string together playing to whatever structures were supposed to.

Need that answered again? Lol

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 5:38 pm 
Offline
formerly King Kenny
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2009 8:35 pm
Posts: 20076
I've worked for multi-nationals the past 7yrs, both formerly the best in the business, number 1, but perception sees them as a dying breed. In reality my current employee has awoken and starting to get with modern times and change the perception through marketing.

One CEO at my former Company, who was Chairman before leading from the front line, started down an educational path that had everyone onboard for the ride. It was going to deliver results, but some muppets decided they had no patience for the tree to bare fruit and the activists had him sacked. Culture gone, morale gone, employees gone, company a dinosaur.

Careful what you wish for, change does more damage unless you understand the root cause of all issues.

Bolton is being allowed to teach as a flow on effect from his leaders. Give it time to develop and then make a call in 3yrs.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 5:47 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
Loll careful what you wish for Carlton supporters loll

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 5:48 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
Funny

Did these people make every post a loser over many years?

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 6:00 pm 
Offline
Stephen Kernahan
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:12 pm
Posts: 15582
Location: Upper Swan.
Synbad wrote:
A week is part of a sequence which makes up a block
I explained that already.
I don't even worry about the scoreboard
Anybody that knows me knows I'm a big picture guy and don't get my thrills from say the Richmond final a few years ago.
Was about the next week

And I don't think we have a definitive gameplan after round one

Watch through the game and see how many minutes quarters then games can string together playing to whatever structures were supposed to.

Need that answered again? Lol


You're back to not making sense and then adding an lol at the end of your posts.

You drift between the game plan and the coaches and the board but youve no idea on football tactics because you don't have the interest.

Stick to whipping the board because you know you're all at sea when it come to the game these days. No interest = no insight.

It's passed you by.

As for this week and this year it's going to be rough, so you should have lots of opportunities to point out the bleeding obvious.

But just make sure you hang around if we have a few reasonable efforts and not sulk like round 1.

_________________
I hope Essendon* folds.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 6:44 pm 
Offline
Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25008
Location: Bondi Beach
Synbad wrote:
See there is no blueprint to success with a gameplan
Gameplans rely on a couple of things
A) surprise with each year or two somebody coming up with something different
1) they get worked out
B) execution . what hawthorn did with their players won't necessarily work with ours because you can't superimpose yourself on that gameplan
C) need years of recruiting towards a gameplan
Meaning you need coach stability
In order to have stability in coaching you can't be getting smashed too often. Which by extension means you cannot fall away too much
Most of the clubs languishing around the bottom for an extended period of time have done so because they have languished for an extended period of time.

There are clubs that have gone down but still had players from success and reasonable success passing down the torch.
We don't have that critical mass because generation after generation of players we have brought into or system haven't found the torch alight

There are no standards for success
Whatever the coach says our does means jack in that kind of environment

You cannot allow anything to fall away to our standing no matter what anybody tells you

The three most hopeless clubs over the last fifteen years are a constant

Each having a meaningless spike up the ladder but then dock back down

The west coasts go down but bounce back up into contention
Geelong same
Adelaide same

You need to watch the patterns and human behavior

There are no easy fixes here

Sos
Bolton
Etc


Good post.

I expect a different outcome with Bolton selection compared to previous 15 years.
I also expect the Board Members who have been there over the last 10 years makes way for the next generation.
Nowm I don't know where the new come from, but excluding newbies MLG Trigg SOS Bolton and recent additions to Board, the oldies who have been tried and failed should go in fairness to the club...unless of course there really are no new candidates.

_________________
Everyone looks good in Navy Blue


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:43 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 2:32 pm
Posts: 33043
Location: Back in reality
In a different age people would have called Synners a soothsayer

_________________
29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:25 pm 
Offline
formerly Army the Wonderkid
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 8:30 pm
Posts: 2058
Location: The Burbs
I thought it would take the third 10 goal loss for the complainers to come out; I was wrong!

_________________
Formerly: Ackland the Wonderkid / Army the Wonderkid / quivering mess / molsey / Tony Lynn Fan Club


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 134 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next

All times are UTC + 10 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 59 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group