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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 12:47 pm 
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Vale 1953-2020
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jimmae wrote:
jimmae wrote:
Roughly when was this dropped mark? I'm struggling to recall it.

The passage of play starts with 12:52 on the clock, right after Riewoldt snaps a behind.

Docherty from the kick out, directly honours Graham on a short lead

Graham honours a long lead from Lamb into the space behind Graham, Graham has to lob the kick out in front of him and central to so he meets the required distance
The ball at this stage has moved 25 metres away from Richmond's goal

Docherty drifts up and makes a casual lead into the space left by Lamb, and in combination with the mass of players being on the near wing, opens up some space in the corridor

Graham, identifies the zonal gap and reads that Docherty can reach it by foot, and makes a searching lead from 60m out of Richmond's goal halfway between the boundary line and the centre square corner, right through to just inside the corner, opening the game up

Everitt, another kick ahead of the play, has identified the same gap and leads his opponent towards Graham before doubling back and running with his back to the ball, cutting out towards the wing before again cutting inside (his opponent Rance, hasn't committed to closing him at this stage, so a little of the running was for nought)

Graham executes the pass, which asks a tiny bit of Everitt but he makes the run but doesn't quite secure the ball.

There's no sign of panic from Everitt, the only short step he pulls is to ensure he times his run at the ball mere split seconds before the mark, but he just misjudges the flight marginally and it slips down from between his hands into his waste, and that's all the time Rance needs to close and tackle Everitt as he gathers.

It's a mistake, but he didn't piss himself, and he did everything right to make Rance look second rate except nail the grab. The close-up replay even shows he only took his eyes off the footy the split second before it had made contact with his hands, and Ellis (I think) was well in his range of vision before this.

I think at worst he's tried to spend it before he had it. In the end he was too far out to score, but he did have (I believe) Boekhorst making a run into the 50 from left HF (off-screen).

FWIW, the resulting stoppage saw Docherty spray a pass to a Walker lead, which then resulted in a throw in, so we had plenty of chances to set up depsite the error.

It's a critical mistake, but there's zero cowardess in it from where I'm sitting.

Yep. Good post. Pity many posters don't actually do this kind of thoughtful analysis before making sweeping statements about their current hobby-horse (or whipping boy).

(Not that YOU don't sometimes make sweeping statements too, but then I guess we ALL do as one-eyed, passionate supporters. I just really liked what you did here).

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 12:53 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

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koutahootarootafides wrote:
Casboult is embarrassingly useless. His job is to mark, break packs and kick effing goals. We se m to struggle developing forwards year after year.


Embarrassingly useless? Kicking was terrible but he took 7 good marks, most contested. Imagine if he wasn't embarrassing useless, he might've taken 17 marks.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:14 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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moshe25 wrote:
Yep. Good post. Pity many posters don't actually do this kind of thoughtful analysis before making sweeping statements about their current hobby-horse (or whipping boy).

(Not that YOU don't sometimes make sweeping statements too, but then I guess we ALL do as one-eyed, passionate supporters. I just really liked what you did here).

We're all guilty of it, but if you're talking about my Lamb comments, I just want small forwards who can crumb first and foremost. Like Ellard before him, Lamb's not showing enough of that at present.

If Buckley and Wright wind up performing that role adequately, then he's free to play his natural game a little further away from goal.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:23 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

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jimmae wrote:
jimmae wrote:
Roughly when was this dropped mark? I'm struggling to recall it.

The passage of play starts with 12:52 on the clock, right after Riewoldt snaps a behind.

Docherty from the kick out, directly honours Graham on a short lead

Graham honours a long lead from Lamb into the space behind Graham, Graham has to lob the kick out in front of him and central to so he meets the required distance
The ball at this stage has moved 25 metres away from Richmond's goal

Docherty drifts up and makes a casual lead into the space left by Lamb, and in combination with the mass of players being on the near wing, opens up some space in the corridor

Graham, identifies the zonal gap and reads that Docherty can reach it by foot, and makes a searching lead from 60m out of Richmond's goal halfway between the boundary line and the centre square corner, right through to just inside the corner, opening the game up

Everitt, another kick ahead of the play, has identified the same gap and leads his opponent towards Graham before doubling back and running with his back to the ball, cutting out towards the wing before again cutting inside (his opponent Rance, hasn't committed to closing him at this stage, so a little of the running was for nought)

Graham executes the pass, which asks a tiny bit of Everitt but he makes the run but doesn't quite secure the ball.

There's no sign of panic from Everitt, the only short step he pulls is to ensure he times his run at the ball mere split seconds before the mark, but he just misjudges the flight marginally and it slips down from between his hands into his waste, and that's all the time Rance needs to close and tackle Everitt as he gathers.

It's a mistake, but he didn't piss himself, and he did everything right to make Rance look second rate except nail the grab. The close-up replay even shows he only took his eyes off the footy the split second before it had made contact with his hands, and Ellis (I think) was well in his range of vision before this.

I think at worst he's tried to spend it before he had it. In the end he was too far out to score, but he did have (I believe) Boekhorst making a run into the 50 from left HF (off-screen).

FWIW, the resulting stoppage saw Docherty spray a pass to a Walker lead, which then resulted in a throw in, so we had plenty of chances to set up depsite the error.

It's a critical mistake, but there's zero cowardess in it from where I'm sitting.


Thanks for this jimmae. I thought after the game he did hear footsteps...and I'm a Everitt fan. I too watched it again and agree with your summation. Sorry Andrej. Better luck next week.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:27 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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I think a lot of us are frustrated with our key forwards and our ability to hit the scoreboard. The bottom line is that we don't have the depth at this stage to replace Casboult. I think he is our best key forward option right now even though he has his major kicking flaw, no one else has stood up to earn the right to take his spot. I do understand the frustration but replacing him with other players that will only frustrate us in a different way (at this stage) is pointless.

Our other options:

Gorringe- More of a ruckman didn't show enough during the NAB series.

Kreuzer - Needed in the ruck, too important to take away from the midfield.

KJ - Played most of his career as a defender, hardly played during the pre season due to ilness. He needs a couple of weeks hitting form in the VFL before being considered.

Mckay - Injured.

Foster - Seems to be stuck playing VFL and not really doing a lot.

Silvagni - Not a key forward and way too raw.

Curnow - Too raw to replace Cas, different type of forward, he should be considered in any case.

Liam Jones - Enough said.

Rowe - Everyone loves to bag him after one or two clangers but he is a strong and reliable presence in the back line and shouldn't be moved up forward.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:46 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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AFLCA votes

Carlton v Richmond
10 Kane Lambert (Rich)
6 Marc Murphy (Carl)
6 Alex Rance (Rich)
4 Bryce Gibbs (Carl)
3 Sam Docherty (Carl)
1 Patrick Cripps (Carl)

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:53 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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One score from ground ball gets inside 50 all game. One.

I'd focus on that before blasting the key forwards that produced 8 of our 18 marks inside 50.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 2:05 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Effes wrote:
AFLCA votes

Carlton v Richmond
10 Kane Lambert (Rich)
6 Marc Murphy (Carl)
6 Alex Rance (Rich)
4 Bryce Gibbs (Carl)
3 Sam Docherty (Carl)
1 Patrick Cripps (Carl)

Classic 4th quarter bias

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 2:14 pm 
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Vale 1953-2020
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jimmae wrote:
moshe25 wrote:
Yep. Good post. Pity many posters don't actually do this kind of thoughtful analysis before making sweeping statements about their current hobby-horse (or whipping boy).

(Not that YOU don't sometimes make sweeping statements too, but then I guess we ALL do as one-eyed, passionate supporters. I just really liked what you did here).

We're all guilty of it, but if you're talking about my Lamb comments, I just want small forwards who can crumb first and foremost. Like Ellard before him, Lamb's not showing enough of that at present.

If Buckley and Wright wind up performing that role adequately, then he's free to play his natural game a little further away from goal.

No, just making a general aside. The more central part of my post was an acknowledgement of your thoughtful post. It's not that common (that I praise your posts), so concentrate on that... :wink: :wink:

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 3:00 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Effes wrote:
AFLCA votes

Carlton v Richmond
10 Kane Lambert (Rich)
6 Marc Murphy (Carl)
6 Alex Rance (Rich)
4 Bryce Gibbs (Carl)
3 Sam Docherty (Carl)
1 Patrick Cripps (Carl)


awful voting

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 3:09 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Interesting..

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 3:44 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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Don't have a problem with Lambert getting maximum votes, he was having a reasonable game until the last quarter when he simply turned it on its ear.

And to think he was right under our noses...

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 3:50 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

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TheSwan wrote:
KJ - Played most of his career as a defender, hardly played during the preseason due to illness. He needs a couple of weeks hitting form in the VFL before being considered.


Not at junior level he didn't. He's got the versatility to play forward or back. But he's a natural forward.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 4:54 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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Stefchook wrote:
TheSwan wrote:
KJ - Played most of his career as a defender, hardly played during the preseason due to illness. He needs a couple of weeks hitting form in the VFL before being considered.


Not at junior level he didn't. He's got the versatility to play forward or back. But he's a natural forward.


too bad we cursed him the day we sponsored him :lol:


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:00 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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grrofunger wrote:
Effes wrote:
AFLCA votes

Carlton v Richmond
10 Kane Lambert (Rich)
6 Marc Murphy (Carl)
6 Alex Rance (Rich)
4 Bryce Gibbs (Carl)
3 Sam Docherty (Carl)
1 Patrick Cripps (Carl)


awful voting


Sack Bolton!

Seriously though....Murphy was clearly BOG for mine.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:49 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Cripps 1 vote :garthp:

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 10:10 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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jimmae wrote:
jimmae wrote:
Roughly when was this dropped mark? I'm struggling to recall it.

The passage of play starts with 12:52 on the clock, right after Riewoldt snaps a behind.

Docherty from the kick out, directly honours Graham on a short lead

Graham honours a long lead from Lamb into the space behind Graham, Graham has to lob the kick out in front of him and central to so he meets the required distance
The ball at this stage has moved 25 metres away from Richmond's goal

Docherty drifts up and makes a casual lead into the space left by Lamb, and in combination with the mass of players being on the near wing, opens up some space in the corridor

Graham, identifies the zonal gap and reads that Docherty can reach it by foot, and makes a searching lead from 60m out of Richmond's goal halfway between the boundary line and the centre square corner, right through to just inside the corner, opening the game up

Everitt, another kick ahead of the play, has identified the same gap and leads his opponent towards Graham before doubling back and running with his back to the ball, cutting out towards the wing before again cutting inside (his opponent Rance, hasn't committed to closing him at this stage, so a little of the running was for nought)

Graham executes the pass, which asks a tiny bit of Everitt but he makes the run but doesn't quite secure the ball.

There's no sign of panic from Everitt, the only short step he pulls is to ensure he times his run at the ball mere split seconds before the mark, but he just misjudges the flight marginally and it slips down from between his hands into his waste, and that's all the time Rance needs to close and tackle Everitt as he gathers.

It's a mistake, but he didn't piss himself, and he did everything right to make Rance look second rate except nail the grab. The close-up replay even shows he only took his eyes off the footy the split second before it had made contact with his hands, and Ellis (I think) was well in his range of vision before this.

I think at worst he's tried to spend it before he had it. In the end he was too far out to score, but he did have (I believe) Boekhorst making a run into the 50 from left HF (off-screen).

FWIW, the resulting stoppage saw Docherty spray a pass to a Walker lead, which then resulted in a throw in, so we had plenty of chances to set up depsite the error.

It's a critical mistake, but there's zero cowardess in it from where I'm sitting.


Disagree but each see there own version. He stopped and looked at the opposition player as to not receive contact and spilled the ball. Ball was in his hands and moving towards his chest until shadow of opposition player came into play. Sorry but that is how I saw it.
Excellent summary though.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 11:27 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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jimmae wrote:
but if you're talking about my Lamb comments, I just want small forwards who can crumb first and foremost.



I hope Lamb gets some crumbs too.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 2:00 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

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Jack Riewoldt acknowledged on 360 last night that we deserved to win and they were very lucky to get away with it.

Makes it even worse. We blew it.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 5:29 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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CK95 wrote:
jimmae wrote:
but if you're talking about my Lamb comments, I just want small forwards who can crumb first and foremost.



I hope Lamb gets some crumbs too.


If not, he can expect to get the chop.

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