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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:05 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:29 pm
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http://www.carltonfc.com.au/staticfile/ ... 3_20524687


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2014 11:36 pm 
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Trevor Keogh

Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:37 am
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The girl with the white headband must be one of triplets . :razz:


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 7:02 am 
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Craig Bradley
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emtwenty wrote:
http://www.carltonfc.com.au/staticfile/AFL%20Tenant/Carlton/Documents/Drivers-of-Success.pdf?camefrom=EMCL_458653_20524687

I'm no expert on strategc planning documents, but 10 drivers seems like a lot. Might it have been better to have 5-7 and focus on getting those right?

The thing that makes me slightly nervous that this might be lip service is the apparent pending appointment of SOS as list manager. Is he really the best person for the job (driver 4), or is it another job for the boys/favourite son? That's not a rhetorical question, I would genuinely like to know why SOS has been identified as the manager of this priority area. I understand the point about corporate knowledge from GWS, but it has to be more than that.

On the positives, it sounds like the club is listening to its fans (drivers 3,5,8).

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 1:38 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Location: Progreso, Yucatan, MEXICO
aboynamedsue wrote:
emtwenty wrote:
http://www.carltonfc.com.au/staticfile/AFL%20Tenant/Carlton/Documents/Drivers-of-Success.pdf?camefrom=EMCL_458653_20524687

I'm no expert on strategc planning documents, but 10 drivers seems like a lot. Might it have been better to have 5-7 and focus on getting those right?

The thing that makes me slightly nervous that this might be lip service is the apparent pending appointment of SOS as list manager. Is he really the best person for the job (driver 4), or is it another job for the boys/favourite son? That's not a rhetorical question, I would genuinely like to know why SOS has been identified as the manager of this priority area. I understand the point about corporate knowledge from GWS, but it has to be more than that.

On the positives, it sounds like the club is listening to its fans (drivers 3,5,8).


Sloganism.

Fancy photos.

Where are the KPIs against the drivers? Many are what we used to call 'motherhood statements'.

I like Nike. All these years and just three words.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2014 2:13 pm 
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John Nicholls
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Posts: 9354
Blue Sombrero wrote:
aboynamedsue wrote:
emtwenty wrote:
http://www.carltonfc.com.au/staticfile/AFL%20Tenant/Carlton/Documents/Drivers-of-Success.pdf?camefrom=EMCL_458653_20524687

I'm no expert on strategc planning documents, but 10 drivers seems like a lot. Might it have been better to have 5-7 and focus on getting those right?

The thing that makes me slightly nervous that this might be lip service is the apparent pending appointment of SOS as list manager. Is he really the best person for the job (driver 4), or is it another job for the boys/favourite son? That's not a rhetorical question, I would genuinely like to know why SOS has been identified as the manager of this priority area. I understand the point about corporate knowledge from GWS, but it has to be more than that.

On the positives, it sounds like the club is listening to its fans (drivers 3,5,8).


Sloganism.

Fancy photos.


Agreed. As has been said, not like we'll be privvy to KPI's and metrics. I just hope they exist.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:47 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24756
Location: Bondi Beach
So the list has been decided on for 2015.

Season 2014 ends.

The list has not been in better condition since 2000....imo

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 7:25 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 3:08 pm
Posts: 16823
Location: Melbourne
IN

For pick 7
Jaksch
Whiley
Boekhorst

For Pick 28
Viojo - Rainbow

Jones - 3rd rounder

Smith - 4th Rounder
Foster - 4th Rounder

Free
Dick
Tutt
Russell

New Rookies
Gowers
Walsh
Fields

Out

Josh Bootsma (del)
Nick Duigan (ret)
Jaryd Cachia (del)
Jeff Garlett (trd)
Kane Lucas (del)
Andrew McInnes (del)
Brock McLean (del)
Luke Reynolds (del)
Mitch Robinson (del)
Heath Scotland (ret)
Tom Temay (del)
Jarrad Waite (FA)

Those that had little, limited or zero impact in 2015 due to injury

Judd
Kreuzer
Walker
Carrazzo
Cripps
Buckley
Bell

Plus the 2 Irish boys with a season under their belt and a full pre-season to face.

That's it in a nut shell. 2015 will be fun. Plenty fighting for spots. We have bought in some players with great foot skills and some great to good pace.

The talls in Jaksch, Jones and Foster all have good speed and agility. Foot skills are rock solid and they can mark overhead.

Regards Cazzesman

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 7:30 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:08 pm
Posts: 3248
Cazzesman wrote:
IN

For pick 7
Jaksch
Whiley
Boekhorst

For Pick 28
Viojo - Rainbow

Jones - 3rd rounder

Smith - 4th Rounder
Foster - 4th Rounder

Free
Dick
Tutt
Russell

New Rookies
Gowers
Walsh
Fields

Out

Josh Bootsma (del)
Nick Duigan (ret)
Jaryd Cachia (del)
Jeff Garlett (trd)
Kane Lucas (del)
Andrew McInnes (del)
Brock McLean (del)
Luke Reynolds (del)
Mitch Robinson (del)
Heath Scotland (ret)
Tom Temay (del)
Jarrad Waite (FA)

Those that had little, limited or zero impact in 2015 due to injury

Judd
Kreuzer
Walker
Carrazzo
Cripps
Buckley
Bell

Plus the 2 Irish boys with a season under their belt and a full pre-season to face.

That's it in a nut shell. 2015 will be fun. Plenty fighting for spots. We have bought in some players with great foot skills and some great to good pace.

The talls in Jaksch, Jones and Foster all have good speed and agility. Foot skills are rock solid and they can mark overhead.

Regards Cazzesman


Impressed with the fact we appeared to have a strategy and executed against it - despite some being disappointed with a couple of choices.

I think we have done well - more depth in key areas and and we look better in the 19-24 year old stakes. Also like the characters - appear to be a better fit than the problematic types like robbo and jeffy.

Well done - go blues


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 7:42 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:05 pm
Posts: 2705
:clap: Always good to hear the positives


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 8:08 pm 
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formerly cj69

Joined: Sun May 03, 2009 9:52 am
Posts: 7893
I'm happy that MM has come in and turned over the list. It needed to happen and has.

I have no issue with picking Boekhorst but I do with picking him at 19. Could of easily had Laverde or Goddard or McKenzie who I rated much much higher. I was actually hoping for Laverde at 7 when we had that pick and couldn't believe we passed him up at 19. Jacksch, Whiley & Laverde for 7. That would be impressive. Just makes no sense and IMO is another pig headed SR move. Could have easily got him at 28 if not higher.

DVR looks okay and I like Clem Smith. IMO the steal of the draft. Foster seems a gamble but I'm hopeful. Rookies you never know but look handy.

Jones I struggle to see the value as with Tutt or Dick. People will say we didn't pay much but they fill a spot and they all have question marks over them. Instead of Jones we could of easily had a Drummond, McDonald, Cavka or Daniel. Good young kids. Could of probably got BB with Pick 47?

The positive is we have some depth and people fighting for spots. My concern is the lack of real class and elite talent. Our list looks like a group of honest workers. Northern Blues should be better to watch.

I am a fan of how St Kilda have gone about it. It will be a few years of struggle but they have some real impressive talent gathered over 2-3 seasons. Brisbane the same. It gives them a chance to challenge against the GWS and Gold Coast kids as they develop.

I want to be a Top 4 side challenging for a flag. I'm not sure this "moneyball" type recruiting is the way to go when good sides are developed by good drafting. If over the next two years we can support it with smart drafting we could be in a good position. I still find it hard to believe we don't have a List Manager. Having SR & McKay in charge defies belief in such a professional competition. The constant leaking of our picks before they happen shows me that things are not well.

No doubt we will be a lot better in 2015. I'm looking forward to Docherty, Cripps, Graham, Jacksch, Whiley, DVR, Smith, Buckley, Menzel, Sheehan stepping up and showing what they can do and another elite year from Gibbs. They are the future. Murphy & Yarran should be producing their best football. An injury free Kruezer playing as a Ruckman will help. I just hope now we have some depth we go after the elite talent. If the rumours about getting Treloar in 2016 are true that's great. That is the type we need.

My tip is we end up around 7th or 8th in 2015.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 8:12 pm 
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Rod McGregor

Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2013 5:23 pm
Posts: 158
Im certainly pumped for the new season, lets see what we got...


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 Post subject: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 8:40 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:56 pm
Posts: 934
Cazzesman wrote:
IN

For pick 7
Jaksch
Whiley
Boekhorst

For Pick 28
Viojo - Rainbow

Jones - 3rd rounder

Smith - 4th Rounder
Foster - 4th Rounder

Free
Dick
Tutt
Russell

New Rookies
Gowers
Walsh
Fields

Out

Josh Bootsma (del)
Nick Duigan (ret)
Jaryd Cachia (del)
Jeff Garlett (trd)
Kane Lucas (del)
Andrew McInnes (del)
Brock McLean (del)
Luke Reynolds (del)
Mitch Robinson (del)
Heath Scotland (ret)
Tom Temay (del)
Jarrad Waite (FA)

Those that had little, limited or zero impact in 2015 due to injury

Judd
Kreuzer
Walker
Carrazzo
Cripps
Buckley
Bell

Plus the 2 Irish boys with a season under their belt and a full pre-season to face.

That's it in a nut shell. 2015 will be fun. Plenty fighting for spots. We have bought in some players with great foot skills and some great to good pace.

The talls in Jaksch, Jones and Foster all have good speed and agility. Foot skills are rock solid and they can mark overhead.

Regards Cazzesman


Nice!


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:00 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:00 pm
Posts: 24618
Location: Kaloyasena
ThePsychologist wrote:
I'm happy that MM has come in and turned over the list. It needed to happen and has.

I have no issue with picking Boekhorst but I do with picking him at 19. Could of easily had Laverde or Goddard or McKenzie who I rated much much higher. I was actually hoping for Laverde at 7 when we had that pick and couldn't believe we passed him up at 19. Jacksch, Whiley & Laverde for 7. That would be impressive. Just makes no sense and IMO is another pig headed SR move. Could have easily got him at 28 if not higher.

DVR looks okay and I like Clem Smith. IMO the steal of the draft. Foster seems a gamble but I'm hopeful. Rookies you never know but look handy.

Jones I struggle to see the value as with Tutt or Dick. People will say we didn't pay much but they fill a spot and they all have question marks over them. Instead of Jones we could of easily had a Drummond, McDonald, Cavka or Daniel. Good young kids. Could of probably got BB with Pick 47?

The positive is we have some depth and people fighting for spots. My concern is the lack of real class and elite talent. Our list looks like a group of honest workers. Northern Blues should be better to watch.

I am a fan of how St Kilda have gone about it. It will be a few years of struggle but they have some real impressive talent gathered over 2-3 seasons. Brisbane the same. It gives them a chance to challenge against the GWS and Gold Coast kids as they develop.

I want to be a Top 4 side challenging for a flag. I'm not sure this "moneyball" type recruiting is the way to go when good sides are developed by good drafting. If over the next two years we can support it with smart drafting we could be in a good position. I still find it hard to believe we don't have a List Manager. Having SR & McKay in charge defies belief in such a professional competition. The constant leaking of our picks before they happen shows me that things are not well.

No doubt we will be a lot better in 2015. I'm looking forward to Docherty, Cripps, Graham, Jacksch, Whiley, DVR, Smith, Buckley, Menzel, Sheehan stepping up and showing what they can do and another elite year from Gibbs. They are the future. Murphy & Yarran should be producing their best football. An injury free Kruezer playing as a Ruckman will help. I just hope now we have some depth we go after the elite talent. If the rumours about getting Treloar in 2016 are true that's great. That is the type we need.

My tip is we end up around 7th or 8th in 2015.



We might have played "money ball" this year, but I have a strong hunch we'll be going for the "money shot" next year..... Maybe twice. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:03 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 11:17 am
Posts: 18510
Location: threeohfivethree
Cazzesman wrote:
Those that had little, limited or zero impact in 2015 due to injury

Judd
Kreuzer
Walker
Carrazzo
Cripps
Buckley
Bell

Regards Cazzesman


Seems a bit harsh seeing as none of them have actually played it yet but good to set high standards I guess...

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:12 pm 
Offline
Ken Hunter

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2006 6:54 pm
Posts: 14686
Location: The Vodka Train
AGRO wrote:
ThePsychologist wrote:
I'm happy that MM has come in and turned over the list. It needed to happen and has.

I have no issue with picking Boekhorst but I do with picking him at 19. Could of easily had Laverde or Goddard or McKenzie who I rated much much higher. I was actually hoping for Laverde at 7 when we had that pick and couldn't believe we passed him up at 19. Jacksch, Whiley & Laverde for 7. That would be impressive. Just makes no sense and IMO is another pig headed SR move. Could have easily got him at 28 if not higher.

DVR looks okay and I like Clem Smith. IMO the steal of the draft. Foster seems a gamble but I'm hopeful. Rookies you never know but look handy.

Jones I struggle to see the value as with Tutt or Dick. People will say we didn't pay much but they fill a spot and they all have question marks over them. Instead of Jones we could of easily had a Drummond, McDonald, Cavka or Daniel. Good young kids. Could of probably got BB with Pick 47?

The positive is we have some depth and people fighting for spots. My concern is the lack of real class and elite talent. Our list looks like a group of honest workers. Northern Blues should be better to watch.

I am a fan of how St Kilda have gone about it. It will be a few years of struggle but they have some real impressive talent gathered over 2-3 seasons. Brisbane the same. It gives them a chance to challenge against the GWS and Gold Coast kids as they develop.

I want to be a Top 4 side challenging for a flag. I'm not sure this "moneyball" type recruiting is the way to go when good sides are developed by good drafting. If over the next two years we can support it with smart drafting we could be in a good position. I still find it hard to believe we don't have a List Manager. Having SR & McKay in charge defies belief in such a professional competition. The constant leaking of our picks before they happen shows me that things are not well.

No doubt we will be a lot better in 2015. I'm looking forward to Docherty, Cripps, Graham, Jacksch, Whiley, DVR, Smith, Buckley, Menzel, Sheehan stepping up and showing what they can do and another elite year from Gibbs. They are the future. Murphy & Yarran should be producing their best football. An injury free Kruezer playing as a Ruckman will help. I just hope now we have some depth we go after the elite talent. If the rumours about getting Treloar in 2016 are true that's great. That is the type we need.

My tip is we end up around 7th or 8th in 2015.



We might have played "money ball" this year, but I have a strong hunch we'll be going for the "money shot" next year..... Maybe twice. :wink:


..double penetrate the trade period..?..

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 Post subject: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:16 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2005 10:14 am
Posts: 22357
List manager?
What exactly would they do for 52 weeks a year?

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:20 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Joined: Thu Nov 26, 2009 9:44 pm
Posts: 1021
Cazzesman wrote:
Those that had little, limited or zero impact in 2015 due to injury

Judd
Kreuzer
Walker
Carrazzo
Cripps
Buckley
Bell
Tuohy
Henderson
Thomas
Curnow


A few more that had their whole seasons ruined by injuries, past and present*
*in season


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:28 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 3:08 pm
Posts: 16823
Location: Melbourne
ThePsychologist wrote:
Could of easily had Laverde or Goddard or McKenzie who I rated much much higher.


Alot of AFL clubs didn't.

Enjoy 2015 regardless.

Regards Cazzesman

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 9:54 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 2:54 pm
Posts: 2521
The list certainly appears to have increased depth, but as psych mentioned above I think we are lacking for top level talent.

3-4 years ago I would've rated Judd and Murphy as elite, with high hopes still for Henderson, Kreuzer, Gibbs and Yarran.

Right now I'd say Gibbs is elite (possibly being a touch generous there). Murphy hasn't produced to an elite level for a couple of seasons, Judd is the wrong side of 30, Kreuzer and Henderson have been injury hit and while I still hope they become elite, the odds are now worse than before. Yarran is very good at his role, but not elite.

My point is that our top end talent is less than it was previously. Our depth is stronger, but we really need 2-3 players to step up and become stars. Menzel has that potential. Boekhorst, Cripps, Docherty and Jaksch seem the next most likely. Do they fill me with as much confidence as the Henderson, Kreuzer, Gibbs & Yarran group of 3-4 years ago.. probably not.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2014
PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:05 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 11:17 am
Posts: 18510
Location: threeohfivethree
cecil89 wrote:
The list certainly appears to have increased depth, but as psych mentioned above I think we are lacking for top level talent.

3-4 years ago I would've rated Judd and Murphy as elite, with high hopes still for Henderson, Kreuzer, Gibbs and Yarran.

Right now I'd say Gibbs is elite (possibly being a touch generous there). Murphy hasn't produced to an elite level for a couple of seasons, Judd is the wrong side of 30, Kreuzer and Henderson have been injury hit and while I still hope they become elite, the odds are now worse than before. Yarran is very good at his role, but not elite.

My point is that our top end talent is less than it was previously. Our depth is stronger, but we really need 2-3 players to step up and become stars. Menzel has that potential. Boekhorst, Cripps, Docherty and Jaksch seem the next most likely. Do they fill me with as much confidence as the Henderson, Kreuzer, Gibbs & Yarran group of 3-4 years ago.. probably not.


Which is the prototype Collingwood situation.

Always a great selection of good to very good players who could get you to a Grand Final but alas...

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