BrizzyBlue wrote:
I have been reading this thread with great interest and believe that there is too much angst among some of you guys. There is also no reason to can each other about personal beliefs. We are all entitled to give our opinions, but we have to learn to deal with facts a little more. To that end I have done up a chart that sets out the following:
Column 1: Ratts, Hughes & Swan List from 2012. Once you look closely at this list, maybe you will see the glaring deficiencies that IMHO were there in spades from previous poor recruiting and development.
Column 2: All of the players that have been moved out (Retired, Traded, FA or De-listed) since MM, Rogers & Macca have assumed those roles. Looking closely at this list, you might find 3-4 players who would be helpful moving forward, but age, form and mental capacity is their enemy.
Column 3: This list is the players who have been Recruited to the club in 3 Silly Seasons (2012, 2013 & 2014). Once again, MM, Rogers and Macca have been responsible for most of these. Note that there are 2 players that have been moved on from the previous 2 years as well. Keep in mind that this list will be complete in a month or so. I feel sure that you will agree that there are some fairly handy kids on this list. Maybe even compare this list to Column 2.
Column 4: This list is what the 3 Musketeers have put together in 3 Silly Seasons. Of course there are another 8-9 to be added. I have been comparing the 2015 List with the 2012 list and IMHO, we are so much better off now, than we were then. At least, there is the basis of a reasonable foundation. You be the Judge!
I trust that you guys will understand the colour coding. Cheers!
That is a good way to look for it although to be fair to ratten you'd need the pagan list to truly assess ratten's performance.
I'd also disagree that we are clearly better off now than in 2012 - the only 'new' players that have performed to a high level thus far are - menzel, docherty, everett & thomas. All the others are on either promising or a short term stop gap (wood). Lets not forget that we had high expectations in 2012 of mitchell, mcarthy,mciness, watson, lucas etc.
If you went back to 2012, most would have expected at least a few of the promising youngters to have developed a bit more/be still on the list post 2014 - is that a fault of a change in game style (and hence a player's suitability on the list), mick's ability to develop those players or were they no good in the first place? If the coach is replaced/doesnt get his contract renewed, will we be saying the exact same thing about the 'green' 2015 players in 2017?
Not saying that the current setup is crap - just saying that it is a bit unfair to judge comparative performance as you have. Particularly given that analysis of 2012 has been done in hindsight and ignores the impact of injuries in 2012 -> IIRC, 40+% of the 2012 list missed 4+ weeks due to injury (with most of those missing 8+). Do you judge the 2012 list on the performance of that season in isolation? or perhaps, given the minimal list changes it is worthwhile to look at the 2011 performance as well (same coach, same recruiters, same playing style, same list).
Recruitment - I was never impressed with our recruitment philosophy under hughes. We picked way too many athletes/project/potential players over 'safer' bets - that includes selections such as walker who has clearly been a success - for where the club was at (15th, 2 years draft penalties), walker was a very high risk selection. Should never have lasted as long as he did at the club. The 2009 & 2010 drafts were huge @#$@#$ ups.
Final part of this post - list turnover. Imo, most 'new' coaches who come in with a different playing style in mind will turnover a significant portion of the list in their first couple of seasons. List turnover is probably higher than historical comparisons but there have been some exceptional circumstances that have meant some players that would otherwise have been expected to have been retained having been turned over due to either FA (a new thing) and off field issues (betts, garlett, robinson, waite - apparently mclean)
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