Malthouse contract discussion: EXTENSION DENIED!

bluegirl72 · **Joined:** Sat May 23, 2009 8:30 pm **Posts:** 23921

frank dardew wrote:

Got to hand it to Subjudice since his talk to Mick about his demeanour and responses at press conferences Mick has changed immeasurably :grin:

I know, he's super impressive isn't he! :wink:

bluegirl72 · **Joined:** Sat May 23, 2009 8:30 pm **Posts:** 23921

padre wrote:

gerry atric wrote:

moshe wrote:

Why is this stupid thread still even open???

Yes all negative discussion of the coach should be banned. We are 14th and we might finish as high as 12th how could any real supporter question million dollar Mick and his future at the club.

Come on, we nearly pinched the game against freo , at home. Give them some credit. Also give mick some credit for not being happy after the match. Doesnt that tell us something about him? Ratts would have been jumping up and down spouting drivel .
Mick was clearly pissed at yet another close loss against top quality opposition. Thats how he wants the players to think about losing. He wants them to be filthy about it, not just shrugg their shoulders and say "honourable loss"
He is changing his tac. Early in the year he would have been far more encouraging about such a loss, now he is not. Perhaps he felt at the start of the year, the group needed confidence, and now he recognises that they need resolve more than confidence... That is what i feel he is trying hard to instil at the moment.
We have gone from going missing as a team for whole matches last year, to whole quarters earlier this year, to now going missing for short but crucial periods at the moment. Mick will want to very much build on that, and then use that as a launching point for next year. If we played as well as we have recently, at the start of the year we would have beaten richmond , melbourne and brisbane.
The last thing mick will want is for our efforts to fall off over the next 4 rounds, he will want us to build going into next season.
Gold coast . win
Cats close loss
Port close loss
Essendon** . Win

Sent from my iPad

I don't see any need for still having swipes at Ratts.
Nor for defending MM's behaviour.
However, yes, the tactics last nite were praiseworthy.
Could have come from Laidley or another coach though, how would we know.
Therefore,
Cudos to the coaching staff.

redback · **Joined:** Wed Sep 21, 2011 3:17 pm **Posts:** 2646

padre wrote:

gerry atric wrote:

moshe wrote:

Why is this stupid thread still even open???

Yes all negative discussion of the coach should be banned. We are 14th and we might finish as high as 12th how could any real supporter question million dollar Mick and his future at the club.

Come on, we nearly pinched the game against freo , at home. Give them some credit. Also give mick some credit for not being happy after the match. Doesnt that tell us something about him? Ratts would have been jumping up and down spouting drivel .
Mick was clearly pissed at yet another close loss against top quality opposition. Thats how he wants the players to think about losing. He wants them to be filthy about it, not just shrugg their shoulders and say "honourable loss"
He is changing his tac. Early in the year he would have been far more encouraging about such a loss, now he is not. Perhaps he felt at the start of the year, the group needed confidence, and now he recognises that they need resolve more than confidence... That is what i feel he is trying hard to instil at the moment.
We have gone from going missing as a team for whole matches last year, to whole quarters earlier this year, to now going missing for short but crucial periods at the moment. Mick will want to very much build on that, and then use that as a launching point for next year. If we played as well as we have recently, at the start of the year we would have beaten richmond , melbourne and brisbane.
The last thing mick will want is for our efforts to fall off over the next 4 rounds, he will want us to build going into next season.
Gold coast . win
Cats close loss
Port close loss
Essendon** . Win

Sent from my iPad

game plan has changed
structures have changed
attitude has changed
focus has changed

wonder why?
Micky is doing wonders with this pathetic list
they are even starting to look after their captain :sly:

gerry atric · **Joined:** Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:35 am **Posts:** 2125

padre wrote:

Come on, we nearly pinched the game against freo , at home. Give them some credit. Also give mick some credit for not being happy after the match. Doesnt that tell us something about him? Ratts would have been jumping up and down spouting drivel .
Mick was clearly pissed at yet another close loss against top quality opposition. Thats how he wants the players to think about losing. He wants them to be filthy about it, not just shrugg their shoulders and say "honourable loss"
He is changing his tac. Early in the year he would have been far more encouraging about such a loss, now he is not. Perhaps he felt at the start of the year, the group needed confidence, and now he recognises that they need resolve more than confidence... That is what i feel he is trying hard to instil at the moment.
We have gone from going missing as a team for whole matches last year, to whole quarters earlier this year, to now going missing for short but crucial periods at the moment. Mick will want to very much build on that, and then use that as a launching point for next year. If we played as well as we have recently, at the start of the year we would have beaten richmond , melbourne and brisbane.
The last thing mick will want is for our efforts to fall off over the next 4 rounds, he will want us to build going into next season.
Gold coast . win
Cats close loss
Port close loss
Essendon** . Win

Credit where due. I thought he had the players playing very fiercely last night, hammering Crowley at every opportunity and he showed a bit of a road map for beating Freeo. We should have won but for Juddy's ankle and a few awful mistakes in the last and having McLean as sub. A quick sub would have helped, but Garlett is the most likely and I am happy for him to be in the 2s till he improves his defence and contested work.

robertbb · **Joined:** Tue Jun 24, 2014 1:06 pm **Posts:** 9354

padre wrote:

give mick some credit for not being happy after the match. Doesnt that tell us something about him? Ratts would have been jumping up and down spouting drivel .
Mick was clearly pissed at yet another close loss against top quality opposition. Thats how he wants the players to think about losing. He wants them to be filthy about it, not just shrugg their shoulders and say "honourable loss"
He is changing his tac. Early in the year he would have been far more encouraging about such a loss, now he is not. Perhaps he felt at the start of the year, the group needed confidence, and now he recognises that they need resolve more than confidence... That is what i feel he is trying hard to instil at the moment.

Truth.

redback wrote:

game plan has changed
structures have changed
attitude has changed
focus has changed

wonder why?
Micky is doing wonders with this pathetic list

Further truth. :thumbsup:

Punter22 · **Posted:** Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:49 pm

If you can't look at the last two games in particular and see a well prepared team trusting a plan and following it to the best of their ability....

Clearly the players are listening to the coach and carrying out instructions.

If you have an agenda against Mick, fair enough he's not everyone's cup of tea. However;

You'd have to be totally blinded by hate to not see the improvement in how the team is going about it. I think last night was the most organised and compact structure we've displayed in years. Previously the team would have simply gone plan A against Freo, run into the Lyon wall and would have been smashed on the break, with no plan B. we would ahve been opened up like a packet of sardines. Instead of that we got a highly thoughtful strategy to switch the play and deny freo the opportunity to gather their numbers and hit us on the break. It was a great plan from the coaches and largely well carried out by the players. Skill errors let us down which will happen with a 22 of our quality on the park.

Im looking at the last two weeks and seeing a coaching group getting through to the players and the players trusting what the coaches are saying. There appears to be far less thinking from the players and far more instinct and trust in each other and their game day strategy.

Turn over some more dead wood this off season and the arrow might be pointing up.

Wojee · **Joined:** Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:17 am **Posts:** 35135

Punter22 wrote:

If you can't look at the last two games in particular and see a well prepared team trusting a plan and following it to the best of their ability....

Clearly the players are listening to the coach and carrying out instructions.

If you have an agenda against Mick, fair enough he's not everyone's cup of tea. However;

You'd have to be totally blinded by hate to not see the improvement in how the team is going about it. I think last night was the most organised and compact structure we've displayed in years. Previously the team would have simply gone plan A against Freo, run into the Lyon wall and would have been smashed on the break, with no plan B. we would ahve been opened up like a packet of sardines. Instead of that we got a highly thoughtful strategy to switch the play and deny freo the opportunity to gather their numbers and hit us on the break. It was a great plan from the coaches and largely well carried out by the players. Skill errors let us down which will happen with a 22 of our quality on the park.

Im looking at the last two weeks and seeing a coaching group getting through to the players and the players trusting what the coaches are saying. There appears to be far less thinking from the players and far more instinct and trust in each other and their game day strategy.

Turn over some more dead wood this off season and the arrow might be pointing up.

Agree with this.
A few good trades and continued improvement in effort and the close losses will become wins next season.

redback · **Joined:** Wed Sep 21, 2011 3:17 pm **Posts:** 2646

Punter22 wrote:

If you can't look at the last two games in particular and see a well prepared team trusting a plan and following it to the best of their ability....

Clearly the players are listening to the coach and carrying out instructions.

If you have an agenda against Mick, fair enough he's not everyone's cup of tea. However;

You'd have to be totally blinded by hate to not see the improvement in how the team is going about it. I think last night was the most organised and compact structure we've displayed in years. Previously the team would have simply gone plan A against Freo, run into the Lyon wall and would have been smashed on the break, with no plan B. we would ahve been opened up like a packet of sardines. Instead of that we got a highly thoughtful strategy to switch the play and deny freo the opportunity to gather their numbers and hit us on the break. It was a great plan from the coaches and largely well carried out by the players. Skill errors let us down which will happen with a 22 of our quality on the park.

Im looking at the last two weeks and seeing a coaching group getting through to the players and the players trusting what the coaches are saying. There appears to be far less thinking from the players and far more instinct and trust in each other and their game day strategy.

Turn over some more dead wood this off season and the arrow might be pointing up.

I suggest you reread your post and edit it

Nearly every point you have made is the responsibility of the coach yet you blame the players
It has taken two wasted years for micky to come up with something that resembles a game plan (or effectively remove his disasterous one )
Plan A and B,C ect not up to the players unless they are going against mighty mick, knowing mickys reputation I can’t imagine that has happened. By the way we were switching the ball more than most two years ago before micky started coaching his boundary line stagnant game plan.
Skill error happens to all teams in every game and under any circumstances, when the pressure is on and the game is tight mistakes happen more frequently. Hawthorn plays a very short kicking game hence the low turnover we don’t and it shows up. Kicking to a three on one hasn’t helped our efficiency rate with our game plan either unless you haven’t noticed.
The last point is the most disturbing. If a player plays with instinct he plays the way he plays naturally and not in a stagnant machine like manner in which they have been coached for two years.

dane · **Joined:** Tue Mar 08, 2005 10:14 am **Posts:** 22357

:blindhatred:

Punter22 · **Posted:** Fri Aug 01, 2014 4:07 pm

redback, don't take my word for it. Listen to or ask a commentator/decent watcher on our defensive running patters over the last few weeks.

There are good things happening with this group, and all should be credited for their role in it.

The list is not at a level of quality to genuinely contend, that's clear. But for the first time in a long time they look organised, committed and playing as a unit rather than a group of talented individuals.

another e.g.f rom last night - the composure and patience they had in switching the ball around, particularly in the back half. It takes a high level of trust to stick with that as consistently as we saw.

Anyway not sure why I'm othering wth this. Grab a pitchfork and placard, eh. Down with Evil Mick!

jim · **Joined:** Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:21 pm **Posts:** 8206

Ratts did a great job and deserves more accolades for the job he did. So I refuse to distinguish between them.

I saw the last couple of weeks for the first time that we are starting to mould into the Malthouse way. He's adjusted the way we've played to suit our strengths and we we've responded accordingly. We have substance, less fragility, good run, and usually go where the best option is whether it down the corridor or around the boundary. We're setting our forwards up now instead of bombing. Defensively we finally look like a side after all these years. Players are developing, including average one becoming contributors, as he managed to do at the Pies.

It's taken us more than a year and a half, and some compromise from the coach but finally, after all this time, we're a slowly looking like a Malthouse side re: Collingwood and the Eagles. Suppose Rome wasn't built in a day and we have years of bad, habits, poor culture and attitude to get over. Still work to do though and it's still "early days".

We still have things to work on. Better kicking at goal, better composure when it matter, as alot of close losses aren't bad luck, as MM says, and those bloody red time goals. It was 5 last night. In a low scoring game that, together with poor goalkicking, kills and cost us the game last night. There's those schoolboy errors too that still need to be eliminated but they're getting less.

I'm more encouraged than i have been for years, despite our 6 wins, as we're looking like something. There's still work to do and we can easily still slip back.

Right now kudos to both Ratten, who took us from the brink of absolute sh1t to near PF, and MM for finally getting his playing to play with commitment and substance and being strong enough to change and coach more to our strengths.

SurreyBlue · **Joined:** Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:32 am **Posts:** 10593

Great post Jim. I agree fully.

gerry atric · **Joined:** Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:35 am **Posts:** 2125

The last two weeks have been much better after an average season in 13 and a v.ordinary one this year. We will know more this time next year. Whether MM is still up to it and up for it, whether we want to entrust him with a 4 -5 year-rebuild. Anyway hopefully no knee jerk reappointments. No need to extend or end the contract until it is near expiration. The last five weeks are about hope. MM's apptmt hasn't delivered better membership, if we end the season with a whimper it will fall again next year so we need to sustain form, and not go back to our flaky selves of v. Brissy and gws.

padre · **Joined:** Mon Jan 05, 2009 7:56 pm **Posts:** 934

Ratten did a lyon. He timed it beautifully ( ok he had no say in the timing). But the group he inherited were about to take the next step. The fact that he did better than pagan, is partly ratten being more than pagan in terms of modern football thinking and the fact that he had some great new recruits who were starting to come through. He was no genius , and his post match interviews were showing how one dimensionally he thought.

Rexy · **Joined:** Fri Aug 15, 2008 6:46 am **Posts:** 28227

gerry atric wrote:

The last two weeks have been much better after an average season in 13 and a v.ordinary one this year. We will know more this time next year. Whether MM is still up to it and up for it, whether we want to entrust him with a 4 -5 year-rebuild. Anyway hopefully no knee jerk reappointments. No need to extend or end the contract until it is near expiration. The last five weeks are about hope. MM's apptmt hasn't delivered better membership, if we end the season with a whimper it will fall again next year so we need to sustain form, and not go back to our flaky selves of v. Brissy and gws.

I wouldn't have an issue if the board offer him a re-negotiated contract for 2015/16/17 in a redefined role at say $700k a year and boost funding on talent id, development and tactical analysis.

Mick has his positives, but his negatives brings his price tag down.

I think Wileys role/title should be rejigged to include the majority of media requirements which he is very good at.

aboynamedsue · **Joined:** Tue Dec 11, 2007 9:09 pm **Posts:** 6047

You look at the way we played on Thursday night and you add Menzel, Everitt, Walker, Robbo, Buckley & Kreuzer to the side. There is light at the end of the tunnel. Not getting carried away at all, but if Judd & Simmo can keep performing at the elite level for another year and we have another good off-season at the trade table, there's reason to feel optimistic about us in 2015.

Personally, I'm feeling better about what I'm seeing than I did at anytime under Ratten.

Put me down as cautiously optimistic :wink:

Cazzesman · **Posted:** Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:42 am

aboynamedsue wrote:

You look at the way we played on Thursday night and you add Menzel, Everitt, Walker, Robbo, Buckley & Kreuzer to the side. There is light at the end of the tunnel. Not getting carried away at all, but if Judd & Simmo can keep performing at the elite level for another year and we have another good off-season at the trade table, there's reason to feel optimistic about us in 2015.

Personally, I'm feeling better about what I'm seeing than I did at anytime under Ratten.

Put me down as cautiously optimistic :wink:

I'd put you down as a miracle on TC. :lol:

Regards Cazzesman

camel · **Posted:** Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:54 am

It's probably blind faith as much as anything, but I am really looking forward to 2015 and expect we'll be a surprise bolter up the ladder.

Okay, it's fine to have that feeling now when our season is shot, let's hope I still have it after round 4-5 next year, haha.

Dominator_7 · **Posted:** Sat Aug 02, 2014 12:57 pm

The upcoming off season is the most important in recent history. Get it right, and we can realistically make the finals next year.
Get it wrong, and we could be battling the Saints for the spoon for the next few years.

ThePsychologist · **Joined:** Sun May 03, 2009 9:52 am **Posts:** 7893

jim wrote:

Ratts did a great job and deserves more accolades for the job he did. So I refuse to distinguish between them.

I saw the last couple of weeks for the first time that we are starting to mould into the Malthouse way. He's adjusted the way we've played to suit our strengths and we we've responded accordingly. We have substance, less fragility, good run, and usually go where the best option is whether it down the corridor or around the boundary. We're setting our forwards up now instead of bombing. Defensively we finally look like a side after all these years. Players are developing, including average one becoming contributors, as he managed to do at the Pies.

It's taken us more than a year and a half, and some compromise from the coach but finally, after all this time, we're a slowly looking like a Malthouse side re: Collingwood and the Eagles. Suppose Rome wasn't built in a day and we have years of bad, habits, poor culture and attitude to get over. Still work to do though and it's still "early days".

We still have things to work on. Better kicking at goal, better composure when it matter, as alot of close losses aren't bad luck, as MM says, and those bloody red time goals. It was 5 last night. In a low scoring game that, together with poor goalkicking, kills and cost us the game last night. There's those schoolboy errors too that still need to be eliminated but they're getting less.

I'm more encouraged than i have been for years, despite our 6 wins, as we're looking like something. There's still work to do and we can easily still slip back.

Right now kudos to both Ratten, who took us from the brink of absolute sh1t to near PF, and MM for finally getting his playing to play with commitment and substance and being strong enough to change and coach more to our strengths.

Some fair points Jim but I felt that Ratten was always learning on the job and that is always dangerous with a young group.

In the end he was in charge of a football department that had great draft picks & Judd and due to poor recruiting and development under performed.

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