Now Doc, if you read my first post it was nice and short, discuss please. Do I think we'll sack him, of course not. Is he coaching well, of course not. Was it the right decision to have him as coach, IMO from what I have seen this year NO. He can redeem himself by not being so stubborn, he can redeem himself by looking at selection and making the best decisions for the team, not himself. He can redeem himself by making the players play for each other. He can redeem himself by changing a game plan that is past it's used by date and very taxing.

Now I'm not saying we have a top 4 list, far from it and I agree our recruiting has been pretty abysmal and that's not Mick's fault but we should have been playing finals this year and we won't. What was good for the Goose (Ratten) is now good for the Gander (Malthouse). I find it ironic that footy commentators are now saying Ratten overachieved. Time will tell and I hope I am wrong and get a huge mother flower of an egg on my face because I love my club and want us to succeed!!!

One last thing, did you tip us to win on the weekend, or against the Saints? I didn't, based purely on team selection. Watching the players on the weekend they had better options than the boundary line but choose, not instinctively, to go there which caused turnovers. To me that's fear the coach will drop you or hammer you, a fear they should not have.

I saw players ignored going through the middle too...but for the 20th week I saw the two biggest culprits this side has refuse to chase an opponent. Until Murphy and Judd realise their shit stinks - this team can't improve. Is that the coach's fault? Maybe...maybe not.

The leaders....

MM would be impressed with Juddy huffing a nd puffing holding hiands on knees after a 60 meter sprint at the start of quarter one...

Anyway on indigenous radio last week...1AW said the main difference between Ratts n MM on and off field was MM allowed family into the rooms after the games.. i didnt hear it all.. but that was the general gist

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

I've calmed down after the weekend's lose and am looking forward to taking it to the Tiger's this week.

Mickie Malthouse is here to stay so our improvement will have to come under him, that's the bottom line.
Whatever he decides to take us up the ladder we'll all have to support.

Either way I don't think any of us will be getting a free Mars Bar on Grand FInal Day.

_________________
Blue is the colour, Blue is our colourful conversation, football is the game, talking carlton is our aim, we're all together, we're all together, winning is our aim, arguing is a pain, let's debate for gain. .. .!

Forget Malthouse or the players. This putrid, stinking Board has to go. The focus has to be on them.
I`d even prefer Kennett as President.

Kennett or bring back Jack Elliott - everything is forgiven If not one of these two there are always other Liberal Party hacks - why not Michael Kroger!

_________________
Blue is the colour, Blue is our colourful conversation, football is the game, talking carlton is our aim, we're all together, we're all together, winning is our aim, arguing is a pain, let's debate for gain. .. .!

Mate 2 years ago is along time in football

My god in 95 we were invincible and by 97 still with every big name player we missed finals

You promised me we wouldn't lose to sh1t teams once Malthouse was signed.

Would like to see these two make a running tackle one day !!!

I saw Juddy make one against St Kilda.

_________________
"our electorate seeks less to be informed and more to be validated." Sad times.

We could have had Rich. Just been elevated to the top 20 rated players in the league.

IIR I was lambasted for thinking that four years ago. I wonder if the same people are now bitching about yarran.

BTW, I love Yarran when he is on fire. I do think MMs plan to play the boundary and never use the corridor has killed Yarran's natural instincts to run with the ball.

_________________
Let slip the Blues of war (with apologies to William Shakespeare) (and Sir Francis Bacon, just in case)

Too true, 2 years ago Malthouse coached a team into a Grand Final. Since then he's been sacked and come to stink our club up.
Isnt it funny how it only seems to be a long time when it relates to our achievements?
In fact, weren't you the one telling me about Malthouse getting the Pies into a GF 12 years ago? 2 years is a long time but 12 isn't?

_________________
Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Murphy has improved in this area, Judd hasnt.

Thats not the coaches fault but the remedy is. You construct an accountable midfield by making the players involved accountable for a player. If they're not, you expose them for it.
Thats one of the downfalls of having an autocratic coach. The players dont see it as their responsibility to address it with their team mates because they have no responsibility. At Geelong or Sydney, it wouldnt be accepted by the players.
Our method of an accountable midfield is to compensate for Murphy/Judds inadequacies by complementing the remaining midfield positions with taggers. That's not fixing the problem, its hiding it by trying to balance it out. How moronic is that?

Does Graham understand what's required? Does Bell? How would we know? Instead we're continuing to accept the situation rather than address it.
If MM had any sense, he'd play Murphy off a back flank to teach him accountability for an opponent. Play Judd as the defensive winger (Scotlands role of previous years) Give them an understanding of trying to assist the defence.
Instead we're happy to compensate for their deficiencies. IMHO, its a bit hard to whinge about their deficiencies when you're actively covering for them.

Not only that, it's impeding the development of others by not giving them opportunities. Poor coaching.

_________________
Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Yeah, I shrugged it off like a 24 hour virus.
I think plenty of champagne might be a nice way to get through it.
I give us a tiny chance to be competitive.

_________________
That’s not a political statement — it’s a harsh reality, and we must act,” she said. “He is a clear and present danger to the things that keep us strong and free. I support impeachment.”

Well, we're sakcing coaches and appointing them without so much as a thorough "process". As much as that term is nauseating sometimes, it has merit.

We've got a board that seems to be lacking innovation at best, and totally rudderless and stuck in the 80s at worst.

The supporters, you and me, are by and large probably stuck in the past a little as well, inasmuch as we expect success because that's what we grew up with. Now that we're not getting it we're quick to react and get frustrated.

While it was certainly the right thing to do to oust Elliott it's hard to make a bona fide argument, on the football operations side, that we're all that much better off than if he had stayed. That's a pretty scary thought given how out of touch with the modern game Jack was.

I'm not astute enough to be able to pin down precise reasons as to why that's been the case, all I see is a team that's not strong enough mentally or physically to match it with the best teams for long enough. Our form still fluctuates far too much with the experience we have on our list.

Murphy and Gibbs have shown flashes of brilliance but not for long enough. We were told Murphy was a born leader when he was recruited and now we're finding out that he doesn't appear to have the balls to pick the club up and drag it along with him in a determined and ruthless chase for success.

We expected Malthouse to change a lot of our mental deficiencies, at least I did, and we're still crumbling at even the most achievable of difficult tests (eg. Bulldogs on the weekend). Is that because he was hamstrung in regards to list changes last year or is there more to it?

Malthouse has taken every club he has coached into the top 4 (and beyond), across varying eras of the way the game is played. He may now be out of touch, but I doubt it. He may not have been the perfect appointment for us, but I think we've got a lot of other issues to get right before we start any serious talk of sakcing the coach.

_________________
Click here to follow TalkingCarlton on twitter
TalkingCarlton Posting Rules

I'd say that 95% of us expected to make the finals this year, now approximately the same percentage are saying our list isn't good enough. I'm of the belief that he isn't getting anywhere near the best out of our list and particular players have certainly gone backwards under him eg. Robbo, Yarran, Murphy, Simpson, Laidler, Duigan, Jamison, Walker (out of position),

_________________
Between our dreams and actions lies this world

..heh, yeah i remember the talks, i preferred Rich as well.. ..supposedly no upside was the counter arguement..

..i dispute the notion that MM is anti-run and carry.. ..but you run and carry with a clear line of space, with fwds up-field in position.. ..you don't just run and carry, stop, circle, look around, bounce, panic, chip a ball short, then smile and jog away..

..MM teams always had plenty of run and carry off HB.. ..but it's smart running, and Yarran for all his talent is not footy smart.. ..good instinct, but down back it's a hindrance.. ..cos his first instinct is to take the ball and run.. ..and then half the time there isn't anything 'on' upfield and it comes undone.. ..he's a faster more skilled version of Bower running off HB.. ..but there's still the sprint off deep defense, and by the time he reaches the middle he's slowed and is looking around, switching tack, cos he's just run into opposition..

_________________
..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Wonder what the scrutiny would be like if the scum weren't getting all the attention.

_________________
"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch

Make of it what you will ... purely my opinion of where players are at under MM.

1 Andrew Walker - some improvement (but debateable since he is has been a useful forward in the past.
2 Troy Menzel - inconclusive (lack of opportunity)
3 Marc Murphy - regressed (injuries but also a loss of confidence)
4 Bryce Gibbs - unchanged
5 Chris Judd - regressed (age probably)
6 Kade Simpson - improved (debateable)
7 Dylan Buckley - ??? (lack of opportunity)
8 Matthew Kreuzer - improved
9 Kane Lucas - improved
10 Matthew Watson - improved
11 Robert Warnock - regressed (lack of opportunity)
12 Mitch Robinson - regressed (lost confidence)
13 Chris Yarran - regressed (lost confidence)
14 Brock McLean - unchanged
15 Jeremy Laidler - regressed (lost confidence)
17 Sam Rowe - ??? possibly improved (debatebale)
18 Tom Temay - ??? (no opportunity)
19 Eddie Betts - regressed (injuries and lost confidence)
21 Josh Bootsma - improved
22 Shaun Hampson - unchanged (injuries)
23 Lachie Henderson - improved (but was excellent last year down back)
24 Patrick McCarthy - ??? (lack of opportunity or form did not warrant selection)
25 Luke Mitchell - ??? (lack of opportunity or form did not warrant selection)
26 Andrew McInnes - improved
27 Dennis Armfield - unchanged
29 Heath Scotland - regressed
30 Jarrad Waite - unchanged
31 Marcus Davies - unchanged
32 Nick Graham - ??? (lack of opportunity)
34 Nick Duigan - regressed
38 Jeff Garlett - improved
40 Michael Jamison - unchanged
41 Levi Casboult - regressed
42 Zach Tuohy - improved
43 Simon White - improved
44 Andrew Carrazzo - regressed (injuries have not helped ... but also i reckon loss of confidence)
45 Aaron Joseph - regressed
46 David Ellard - unchanged (injuries)

16 Andrew Collins - unchanged (injuries)
20 Rhys O'Keeffe - unchanged
28 Tom Bell - regressed (lack of opportunity and lost confidence)
35 Ed Curnow - improved
37 Jaryd Cachia - improved
39 Frazer Dale - unchanged

_________________
I am as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it any more!!!

You have to wonder why so many players seem to be down on confidence.
The club coming out and saying there will be big list changes at the end of the year wouldnt help. Maybe many are scared to make mistakes and not playing their natural games.