SEN: 3 Assistants to be kept

7dominator · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:31 pm

camelboy wrote:

7dominator wrote:

phoenix johnson wrote:

It's been reported in the media that Nathan Burke has quit as an assistant coach at St.Kilda. Was reported in the Herald Sun that there was some speculation that he had a falling out with Grant Thomas. Nothing more than speculation at the moment, though.

Now, if we have brains whatsoever, Burke should be the man we are adding to the coaching staff.

Why??????

Why should we be chasing Burke, or why did he quit?

The positives I can see for recruting Burke are he played the game with distincition and appeared to have the respect of his peers. In many ways his playing career is the perfect role model for our kids, and indeed many of our senior players.

Having said that I am not sure what ideas and techniques he could bring the club, but on the surface I reckon we could do a lot worse than sign up Burke.

Sorry Liam,why pick Burke?

As for the rest of this,i have been to a long lunch.In my clouded state i love the debate,might i suggest that the Moderators back off.I am sure the participants are big enough and ugly enough to look after themselves!

To my mind this is what diferentiates us from other sites...

budzy · **Joined:** Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:17 am **Posts:** 8128

phoenix johnson wrote:

budzy wrote:

Does Burke know what it takes to win a flag?

Why should that be a prerequisite?

Libba never won a Grand Final let alone ever got to one.

We should be bringing in guys who have the character we require, the knowledge and skills to pass on etc etc

Basically I want someone who brings something new to the table.

It should be a prerequisite for obvious reasons

Libba should've got the arse by now

I agree we should bring in guys with the character, knowledge and skills that need to be passed on to our kids.

phoenix johnson · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:40 pm

Daryn Creswell never won a premiership and he did wonders for Bartel when he was at Geelong. IIRC Bartel paid tribute to Creswell for saving his career and making him a much better and much more consistent player.

budzy · **Joined:** Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:17 am **Posts:** 8128

phoenix johnson wrote:

Daryn Creswell never won a premiership and he did wonders for Bartel when he was at Geelong. IIRC Bartel paid tribute to Creswell for saving his career and making him a much better and much more consistent player.

good on him

phoenix johnson · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:44 pm

budzy wrote:

phoenix johnson wrote:

Daryn Creswell never won a premiership and he did wonders for Bartel when he was at Geelong. IIRC Bartel paid tribute to Creswell for saving his career and making him a much better and much more consistent player.

good on him

No.
I believe it's "checkmate".

:wink:

budzy · **Joined:** Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:17 am **Posts:** 8128

phoenix johnson wrote:

budzy wrote:

phoenix johnson wrote:

Daryn Creswell never won a premiership and he did wonders for Bartel when he was at Geelong. IIRC Bartel paid tribute to Creswell for saving his career and making him a much better and much more consistent player.

good on him

No.
I believe it's "checkmate".

:wink:

7dominator · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:50 pm

BlueMark wrote:

Very happy to have Nathan on board if we could get him.

Again i ask,why Burke???

Did the Saints during his time offer something special for Footy?

Does having played for a record number of Coaches automatically qualify for Coaching honours?

Maybe,just maybe,might we have someone who bled for the "Old Dark Navy" and has been out long enough to form a subjective view?

camel · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:57 pm

Why do we need one of our own? I mean I like the romance about it, but we shouldn't preclude someone just because they a) didn't play for us or b) didn't win a flag, as good as those reasons might be.

Shouldn't the first reason for recruiting anyone to this club, be it a player, a coach, an administrator be "can they help us become a sucessful football club again?".

After that question has been answered with a resounding YES, then sure, use playing history or whatever to split two otherwise idetntical applicants, but not before.

camel · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:58 pm

budzy wrote:

phoenix johnson wrote:

budzy wrote:

phoenix johnson wrote:

Daryn Creswell never won a premiership and he did wonders for Bartel when he was at Geelong. IIRC Bartel paid tribute to Creswell for saving his career and making him a much better and much more consistent player.

good on him

No.
I believe it's "checkmate".

:wink:

Oh budzy, your response should have been...

"Well that's great, now there's two of them that haven't won a premiership."

phoenix johnson · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:00 pm

camelboy wrote:

Why do we need one of our own? I mean I like the romance about it, but we shouldn't preclude someone just because they a) didn't play for us or b) didn't win a flag, as good as those reasons might be.

Shouldn't the first reason for recruiting anyone to this club, be it a player, a coach, an administrator be "can they help us become a sucessful football club again?".

After that question has been answered with a resounding YES, then sure, use playing history or whatever to split two otherwise idetntical applicants, but not before.

And do we really want to become like Hawthorn where every position at the club is filled by an ex player?

GWS · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:02 pm

How about when we need an assistant coach instead of just running after any recently retired player we stick an ad in the paper and see who applies?

When they do they can give us a two hour presentation (minimum) about where they see us, what our strengths are (shouldn't take too long), what our weaknesses are (could go on forever), a list of the advantages they could bring to the club and a list of the threats we face if we keep going down our current path.

It's called a SWAT analysis and it's pretty basic stuff.

This business of saying "gee I like him and he could play let's make him an assistant coach" makes us look both irrelevant (which we are) and stupid (which hopefully not all of us are).

If we want a professional football club we need a rigorous selection criteria. A SWAT analysis is a start for all applicants but I'd expect the winner to be able to do a whole lot more than that.

budzy · **Joined:** Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:17 am **Posts:** 8128

camelboy wrote:

budzy wrote:

phoenix johnson wrote:

budzy wrote:

phoenix johnson wrote:

Daryn Creswell never won a premiership and he did wonders for Bartel when he was at Geelong. IIRC Bartel paid tribute to Creswell for saving his career and making him a much better and much more consistent player.

good on him

No.
I believe it's "checkmate".

:wink:

Oh budzy, your response should have been...

"Well that's great, now there's two of them that haven't won a premiership."

Nah I reckon pj would've expected that and had perfect reply ready to go :wink:

phoenix johnson · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:07 pm

GWS wrote:

How about when we need an assistant coach instead of just running after any recently retired player we stick an ad in the paper and see who applies?

When they do they can give us a two hour presentation (minimum) about where they see us, what our strengths are (shouldn't take too long), what our weaknesses are (could go on forever), a list of the advantages they could bring to the club and a list of the threats we face if we keep going down our current path.

It's called a SWAT analysis and it's pretty basic stuff.

This business of saying "gee I like him and he could play let's make him an assistant coach" makes us look both irrelevant (which we are) and stupid (which hopefully not all of us are).

If we want a professional football club we need a rigorous selection criteria. A SWAT analysis is a start for all applicants but I'd expect the winner to be able to do a whole lot more than that.

Well they'd obviously do that when they apply for the job, but we're talking about potential applicants. Everyone knows that they won't just get signed on their football experience/achievements. They'll have to put in a pretty good presentation to Denis and co if they want the job that bad.

7dominator · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:10 pm

The notion of taking one of our own to me, ignoring the romaticism of things ,is all about restoring some pride and tradition in the Club ,particularly when it is clear that there are few(with all due respect) who have a full understanding of the tradition of the place.

Having said that,i am always about having the best qualified people.My local man is in response to the suggestion of Nathan Burke!

I ask again,why are people advocating the former Saint?

camel · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:30 pm

7dominator wrote:

The notion of taking one of our own to me, ignoring the romaticism of things ,is all about restoring some pride and tradition in the Club ,particularly when it is clear that there are few(with all due respect) who have a full understanding of the tradition of the place.

Can you expand on that a bit, especially "restoring some pride and tradition in the Club". Are you suggesting that by having a Ratten, for example, that he would automatically restore said values?

Does a bloke have to have bled for the club to instil bring pride and tradition into the players? Obviously it would not hurt, but I would think more important for doing this would be having players that are willing to be inspired by such deeds.

We all expect that the respect for our club greats should be a given for our current players because we, as supporters, regard our greats so highly. But for everyone of us that rates SOS as the pinnacle of playing with honour and respect for his club there'll be plenty of opposition supporters (ie, something many of our current players used to be) who think he was a scragging cheat that was over rated in his team of the century selection.

Haha, it's a never ending circle of putting the right pieces in place isn't it.

camel · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:31 pm

7dominator wrote:

I ask again,why are people advocating the former Saint?

I've noted some positives that I can see Burke would bring, care to rebut those points?

cashi · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:59 pm

mjonc wrote:

I might crap on about the Club being more positive in every aspect, but if they wanted another bloody assistant and another bloody ruck coach then why did they not chase after bloody Rehn who would of done both roles and saved us money also. Bloody hell!! :evil:

I can't agree more!
I was discussing this with shhhhhhh last night

7dominator · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:15 pm

camelboy wrote:

7dominator wrote:

I ask again,why are people advocating the former Saint?

I've noted some positives that I can see Burke would bring, care to rebut those points?

Sorry Camel...You made a few generalisations about criteria for coaching assistants, however i might have missed it but what did you say that Burke specifically brings to Carlton?

camel · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:25 pm

7dominator wrote:

camelboy wrote:

7dominator wrote:

I ask again,why are people advocating the former Saint?

I've noted some positives that I can see Burke would bring, care to rebut those points?

Sorry Camel...You made a few generalisations about criteria for coaching assistants, however i might have missed it but what did you say that Burke specifically brings to Carlton?

Nothing too groundbreaking, but something nonetheless. :mrgreen:

"The positives I can see for recruting Burke are he played the game with distincition and appeared to have the respect of his peers. In many ways his playing career is the perfect role model for our kids, and indeed many of our senior players.

Having said that I am not sure what ideas and techniques he could bring the club, but on the surface I reckon we could do a lot worse than sign up Burke."

camel · **Posted:** Thu Sep 29, 2005 7:44 pm

Oh well, it's a moot point anyway, according to this article Burke wants a life outside of football.

SEN: 3 Assistants to be kept

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