hahaha... and yes i believe MM will have a headkicker ... i wrote about earlier... a bastard that players wont be able to get away with much.

Different to the "give it to the champ " coach we had Surrey... yes indeed......

Even Judd and Murphwill have their ass handed to him on a plate when he doesnt chase back....

Its the leadership....... at the top and throughout.. or culture we dont have....

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

If some of our players took anything out of the game, I hope it's this - there are no excuses, when it's your turn to go, you go. The Swans had a few players playing injured FFS but they went in hard for the ball at every opportunity.

Not only Sydney though, both sides. Yesterday's game should serve our group as a perfect example of what the standard should be week in, week out.

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Premierships: 1869, 1871, 1873, 1874, 1875, 1877, 1887, 1906, 1907, 1908, 1914, 1915, 1938, 1945, 1947, 1968, 1970, 1972, 1979, 1981, 1982, 1987, 1995.

"GIBBS."

I pretty much saw it this way as well. A few things as a positive to Sydney was

(a) their relentless pursuit to break down attacks by Hawthorn (a real Carlton weakness).

(b) sacrificial acts were greater from Sydney than Hawthorn. An example here is that Goodes goal in the last quarter ... could have easily have been smothered.

(c) Every player for Sydney had a tackle whereas 3 Hawthorn players did not register a tackle. When you have played a game of 194 tackles it doesn't look too flash with a zero next to your name.

(d) when a Hawthorn player kicked a goal there was a celebration to the crowd whereas with Sydney the celebration was to their team mates.

GET BILLY BEANE !!!!!!!


I totally agree with all of the above.

I know Judd was at GF, wonder if any of our other players were ?
Most of them would have watched a game foreign to a lot of them !
One hundred and what tackles ?
An average of FIVE for each player in the team....im looking at you Bryce.
A wonderful team stifled a far more talented group through sheer hard work
will power and importantly....some shit kicking at goal.
Personally i would nearly call it a choke, but thats a disservice to Swans.

Maybe would should start a poll as to the first big name dropped to Northern.
I mean a big name, reckon Garlett doesnt count and almost a certainty.
And stuff me, i like Garlett, he could mean a lot to this team, just like number
32 for Sydney, whats his name again ? Should ask Cyril, he got a real good look
at his ass yesterday........ hahahahahaha.

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I wore number 25 on the back of my jumper 40 years ago..... yes, pre Marchesani !!

Most talented team USUALLY wins the GF... not this year....so if youre not the best team... you must be the most committeed team.
Anyway i think OBree is going to be the named assistant today....he might be the bastard that wont let the players get away with anything.. not even Judd and Murphy...
Must start at the top if you want to instill discipline.These two never got hit around the head by the previous coaches.


The Swans had a clear tactic to out tackle the HAwks and stop the kicking game...even though they had FOUR players injured... they were relentless.The Hawthorn team shit itself especially the defence....Buddy almost won the game for HAwks but he had to kick 7 straight instead of 3.4 and one on the full....Individuals wont win you a GF.... good teams do.... and the better team won this one make no mistake.

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Who's the bastard, headkicker coach at Sydney, Sinners? Looks like you're missing the big point about Swannies culture and you're still stuck in the old Pagan, drill sergeant mindset. At Sydney, the players take responsibility for how they play, according to the values they helped develop and within the roles given to them by the coaches. They don't play the way they do because they're afraid of some bastard kicking their heads in.

Try and update yourself, mate.

Sydney were the best team this year because they had the best midfield. They bat 8 and 9 deep and simply wear the opposition down. Too much was left for Sewell and Mitchell.

Thats what we must develop probably more than anything. Morton and Reid only kicked 3 goals. The rest came from the midfield and defenders.
For Carlton to get anywhere near this will mean a massive change in attitude.

Fair dinkum. What's next? Malthouse invented antibiotics and turned water into wine?

Reputations do mean something to Malthouse. In fact, Malthouse is the one coach who admits that not all players are equal and certain players get preferential treatment.
But hey, if the truth doesnt suit the agenda, go for it.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

to be fair, you can't give an undisciplined group like ours autonomy. You can only give its to a disciplined and drilled group like the swans.

Anyone who has kids would know that even the best behaved kids need pulling up every now and then.

I look at what Lyon has done with freo with the help of a strong committee and back office in only one year and I hope for the same. I'm not sold that out back office is as string but time will tell.

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The measure of a life is a measure of love and respect
So hard to earn, so easily burned
In the fullness of time
A garden to nurture and protect

#DopeThenStash

Sydney had two smothers in the last quarter that caused the turnover across half back.

Of course they need to be afraid of having their heads kicked in cos they have been pampered too much....
Who has been dropped apart from the usual Russell... T Bird... Bower?

Why is Garlett still kicking around corners... i told mates 4 years ago.... he needs to stop being a lair.
Why is Waite falling to ground???
Why is Watson playing like a 6ft 5 seagull???
WWhy dont Judd and Murph run both ways?
Why does Gibbs choose when to go and when not to go?Same as Yarran?
How many tackles did T Bird make in his career?Id say less than Sydney on GF day...

Can go on and on.... but why??... cos they have been allowed to cut corners for way too long....

And dont kid yourself... there are coaches who put the fear of God in players....Ratts wasnt one of them... he just picked on a couple of players and made them feel they didnt belong..nek minnit.. the leadership group did whatever they liked and got away with it....

Update yourself...

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Another thing that stands out to me is the importance of big blokes who can take a contested mark.

Sydney fall short in this area. Reid is more of a leading forward. Nobody else

Franklin plays like a small forward but they do have Roughhead

In pressure games the ball gets kicked under pressure and isnt delivered with pinpoint precision.

Often guys that can take a contested mark( pressure pack marks) make all the difference.


I reckon the Hawks [REDACTED] up by not playing Bailey.

Hale could have spent more time up forward and Roughhead could have been a permanent forward.

For the number of forward 50 entries the Hawkos conversion rate was shit.

We have Casboult who can take a contested mark.

We need to spend us much time as it takes to get this boy to be confident to kick goals because he can do the hard bit. Get the ball.

And that is so important in big games at the death.

..i think the lesson also needs to be faith in developing players.. ..injuries elsewhere on the field shouldn't mean that required players are moved out of position to plug holes, ergo throwing structures out the window.. ..they've marked Reid as their future KPF to build their fwd-line around.. ..he was down on form for plenty of the early year, and didn't have a flash finals series at all, especially leading up to the GF.. ..but they stuck with him, even though he's possibly their best bet for kpd moving ahead as well.. ..but they're defenders are supported by the rest of the team, adhere to consistent team coaching,, and are able to play as a cohesive unit.. ..good team work is most important.. ..we have none, so we go about shuffling players and every season look to plug holes that 'spring up' every season.. ..we suck..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Bad goal kicking can and will cost you a flag not just a game against Gold Coast.

No doubting the Sydney culture and the way they run the club.
In terms of JK and Mummy add in Barry Hall, Tony Lockett etc. Sydney have this thing called the " living away allowance'' which in disguise is extra money in the salary cap to outbid any other club for a particular player they need. They are very good at what they do but they also have a bit of assistance from the AFL.

We have an opportunity with MM as head coach to develop and nurture our next head coach. The Roos to Longmire transition was masterful because there was a continuation accompanied by change. Identify the next senior coach and allow him to grow into the role when the time comes. No the Eddie McGuire model of picking the club's favourite son and forcing him when he and the club aren't ready and you are not even sure he's the right man anyway.

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T E A M

+1 from me

Culture and values are vital imo in today's AFL football world. See this:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=32363

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also on twitter @m_j_short

Yep, we are absolutely obsessed with it. If we are all supposed to have a 'glass half full' mentality, why are we so obsessed with with little 'gaps' in our structure? Once in a blue moon when you think you are close to a premiership, fine, but year after year? You can't build a healthy list by trying to approximate every position on the ground. It's too wasteful and other sides have an answer for it. No side in the competition has absolutely everything covered. The last sides that were like that were Carlton's 1995 side and the Brisbane Lions premiership sides. Like I've said before, in terms of list management, you get the best players in, the rest will mostly take care of itself.

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Just because I'm offended, doesn't mean I'm wrong.

I think everyone at Carlton needs to do a mathematics course based on probabilities in order to help them achieve better decision making outcomes. The Swans are brilliant at;

- in going forward you must ensure that you maximise the probability of a shot on goal by kicking to advantage of your team, this means kicking in to space to a leading forward or ensuring that if you go to a pack that the kick is central enough and high enough to ensure your key forward is not outmarked (said key forward to get it down if required)

(Players who have the ball running forward already have us a better than 50/50 chance as we have control yet too often we would fluff it or kick to opposition advantage, making a 60/40 a 40/60 or even just give it up)

and

- in mass congestion get out the quick kick if needed; with such large packs you may not be able to clear it by handball, despite how good you are, so break it up with kicks. With a forward line like ours this should be effective more often than not (see point above)

and

- 'play to percentages'. An old adage but a very good one.


We have some stupid footballers who can't do maths (or can't execute properly even if they got the maths right).

We're discussing what we can learn from the Swans and I'm pretty sure they're not into the 1970s Fear-of-God, Old Testament method of coaching you favour. This is the same old song and dance routine you were giving us when you were the leading fanboy for Pagan: our players are all soft cocks and need an iron shinboner fist to sort them out. We all know how that went. You don't seem to have learnt much. In fact, this post looks just like another of your boring repetitive rehashes from that best-forgotten era.

Dropped players: Stevens, Scotland, Walker, Houlihan, Grigg, Yarran, Hadley, Watson, Thornton, Russell, Bower, Lucas, McLean, etc. What's your point?

Why is Garlett still kicking around corners... I think you're getting him mixed up with his cousin. Jeffy kicks around corners when he needs to.
Why is Waite falling to ground??? Young Vinnie used to like falling over in puddles in his earlier days but his form (when on the paddock) has been very good in recent years. You're just rehashing an old observation. Update.
Why is Watson playing like a 6ft 5 seagull??? Maybe he is a 6ft 5 seagull. And that's why he got dropped.
Why dont Judd and Murph run both ways? They do. Could they do better and get more help? Yes.
Why does Gibbs choose when to go and when not to go? Lot of people have asked this question and you've defended Gibbs. You also recommend he be played as a tagger despite all your bullshit about Ratts and taggers. You don't seem to be sure which side of your mouth you're dribbling out of.
How many tackles did T Bird make in his career? That's one of the reasons he was dropped and is being let go.

Just out of curiosity, anything you like about how we play?

Sinners: [I] Can go on and on....

Yes, we know.