basket case

10 years ago Pagan identified that we needed a big strong defender ........ 10 years on ......... nothing has been done. Nothing to do with injuries either.

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"IF YOU FAIL TO PREPARE, YOU'RE PREPARED TO FAIL" - Mark Spitz

Last year we had 5 missing from our best 22 and nearly beat west coast in perth to reach a prelim. Injuries don't explain a drop from 5th to 12th

this. and if the club thinks supporters/members are dumb enough to fall for the injury excuse then theyre going to get a rude shock come renewal time.

this too: Members spend their hard earned and only want a red hot go in return, even if they lose. These capitulations and gutless efforts we have seen against Port and North will not cut the mustard come renewal time. The board wants 50K and missed it this year. They'll lose most of the first year members for a start.

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Let slip the Blues of war (with apologies to William Shakespeare) (and Sir Francis Bacon, just in case)

This proves how members/supporters react when it comes to on field performances or changes
to the board and coaches.

2010 surprised me though !!

If the club thinks that memberships will increase in 2013, their in for a shock !!!


2001: 27,725 - 5th
2002: 26,503 - Wooden Spoon
2003: 33,252 - 15th (Appointment of Dennis Pagan)
2004: 32,445 - 11th
2005: 33,534 - Wooden Spoon
2006: 28,756 - Wooden Spoon
2007: 35,431 - 15th (Appoinment of Richard Pratt as President)
2008: 39,360 - 11th (Arrival of Chris Judd, Ratten appointed as coach)
2009: 43,294 - 7th
2010: 40,296 - 8th (The Trading of Fevola)
2011: 43,771 - 5th
2012: 45,617

Thanks Blueseum !

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BRING BACK PERFORMANCE BASE PAYMENTS !!!

That's the fear. As the arse falls out of our of season completely, our injuries and suspensions are giving the ostrichs an out.
A thorough, independent review will recognise the fish was well and truly on the nose well before injuries started to take hold.
If some directors are swallowing the line that injuries cost us the North game we're in worse trouble than we thought ...
There will be changes ... but will they rebuild, renovate or slap on some new wallpaper? That's the question.

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I just want my old club back ... (edit) maybe I have!

Outback Blue, I believe that doesn't actually give an accurate indication of how we are going. No doubt winning helps but its not the be all and end all.

You need to look at memberships overall in the AFL and how different clubs are going.

The last decade has seen a boom in membership everywhere. In comparison to our real competitors I believe our membership has been just okay.

To the average supporter people such as Sticks and Ratten aren't people that they will put their money into.

Matty Knights had the same problem at Essendon*. Look at the jump when Hird came on board. Right or wrong that is what happened. Perception in a lot of ways is reality, especially when it comes down to marketing and sales.

I have no doubt with a fresh outlook and a new coach such as Malthouse, Roos or Williams you will see a massive jump in membership and this needs to be major consideration of the board as well. Money means a lot and at the moment the Carlton brand is being badly daaged

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#NewBlues beginning 25th August 2015

This is what scares me. Excuses are not good enough for where we are at.

If we have injuries, we need to fix it.

If the injuries are causing us major problems we need to look at our list.

If our list isnt good enough weto fix our development and recruiting.

If our performances arent good enough we need fix them.

In all this people are responsible and in these areas they arent good enough.

We need to get people who are because I hate excuses.

We have had TEN years to build this and get it right and we are blowing it!

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#NewBlues beginning 25th August 2015

Has anyone thought about our lack of heart and the fact that we gave setanta away to keep bower - i loved him because he gave his all, which is more than i can say for the team as a whole this year. and where are his lttle helpers now without him.

couple of other thoughts after seeing sydney belt the eagles and take top spot - now there is a TEAM and CLUB with spirit and structure and attitude that we can only dream about.

we have talked about recruitment, player management, etc but consider this:

sydney have only THREE players on their list selected as top ten draft picks. with the highest being no.5 (mcveigh) and bolton at 8 and rohan at 6.
collingwood have only five, with thomas at 2, pendlebury at 5, reid and tarrant at 8 and brown at 10.
we have NINE, with three number ones, one number two, one number three and a five.
our recruiters have got off lightly having had the early draft picks i reckon they got lazy and starry-eyed thinking their job was done. and they continued to draft pretty players who star in under-age but just don't cut the mustard in the hurley-burley. and too easy because we were told how good the number ones were!!!

and injuries, everyone has them, although i sense that sydney don't and instead of putting it down to luck - ask why.

i have been a carlton fanatic (a spoonful of my mum's ashes rest under the turf at PP is proof) for neartly sixty years and last friday night upset me so much i found it hard to talk to my best mate BS over skype after the game. if only the players hurt as much as i do......................

and don't get me started on ratten's letter to members from the coach's box - from the coaches ar** more like it. groundhog day letter

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one you knock back is one you never have

Feel for you BB. I'm sure your buddy BS feels the same. I feel the same way. It was all bad, not just the umpiring...sad to see us run out of puff with the lack of players available for rotations...didn't have a chance.

Missing Setanta...but his body is broke anyway...like the rest of the Carlton team.

We'll come back...IF we make some serious changes soon.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Club is very insular re level & impact of our injuries compared to other clubs, with VERY senior management openly stating that;

"we wish we had same number of injuries as Pies & other clubs".

Has anyone on TC analysed the number of injured players at each club and the quality of players injured?

Quite worrying to hear talk of reliance on impact of injuries within the club in the same sentence as "we will be making tough decisions following broad end of season review".

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A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in.

As has been stated in various forms, 'injuries' just create more questions - Structures, roles, player development of replacements, depth, recruiting, trading, long term contracting of injury prone players and then the injuries themselves - medical, fitness, high performance training, player management MC selections re: injured players and reoccurrence of similar injuries etc.

Examples that dont need to be look at would be the initial injuries that happened to Carrazzo, Murphy and Simpson. Pure bad luck. Nothing else.

The rest should not - and can not be swept under the carpet even if in some peoples minds it's deemed to be a valid 'excuse' or 'reason'.

edit: just read Pysch's post stating pretty much the same thing.

I'll leave mine up as a 'THIS' to his.

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"They're [REDACTED]'

I have - and I can categorically state that we've had a deeper run of injuries than either collingwood, WC or Essendon*.

With respect to what I'd term front line/core players (top 28 or so player)- In terms of significantly injury impacted seasons (defined as missing > 1/4 games thus far due to injury) the numbers are somewhat similar to collingwood/WC and probably worse than Essendon* (i.e. Essendon* better off). Cant speak for other teams but its clear that we have also played underdone players that might otherwise have had more time to recover other years (yarran a clear example)

If you take into account the injuries to depth players though, then yes, we have definitely been the most impacted.

rowe, casboult, mitchell, davies, white, ROK, bell, buckley, bray have all missed 2+ mths of football so far this season. The first 6 of those 9 might have expected to have played seniors/pushed for a seniors this year (with bell/buckley as maybe's)

In terms of the other clubs and the equivalent level non-core/depth players

collingwood - 4-5 players have missed a similar chunk of games (depending on names).
Similarly WC and Essendon* have had 4 players each that have missed around 2+ mths of football.

Whilst I wouldn't be able to tell you what % of those players would have been pushing for spots in the 22, the players we've certainly lost a lot more 'important' depth players that might have come into the team to cover core/frontliners when compared to either the pies, WC or Essendon*

What about heart strings. How many have we pulled there.
Had a look at Murphy chatting to Swallow after the game smiling and chatting away.
An absoute joke

Ok load them all up...
Lets have a look at what you have been upto.

Dont just talk about it.

A clear analasys.

Dont incluse Laidler we inflicted that one on him

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Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.

So, we're going to have a review.

Why not start it now and save time? Or would we rather wait till the end of our season when the natives' attention turns to other things.

We have had a couple of well meaning but ineffective Presidents since 2000 and the membership has moved them on.
Time to do it again.

Harold and Bruce where are you?

Don't single out Murphy (Gibbs was doing the same with Lindsay Thomas), or Carlton. Happens AFL-wide. Shits me to tears. Supporters are sitting in their lounge rooms or in the stands in despair, players are seemingly over it immediately.

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"I had to eat"

What do you expect the AFL have created their little homogenous regional AFL competion and the recruiting ground is the Under 18 TAC Cup competition where most of these players come from as team mates, in the TAC Cup and then the National Championships.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

It just adds to the essence of the other thread, my love of football waning.

Players who played juniors together are drafted into other teams. There is no real dislike or rivalry anymore. At least not anything comparable to the 80's & 90's and earlier.

Carlton's biggest problem on the field at the moment, is they are playing for themselves. Not as a team.

Is this a coaching culture thing, or more of an indictment of the modern afl player. No hunger, no desire. They're getting paid a fortune not to really care?