Is that SOS and Braddles on the books or in the brown bags??

Hammill was a key player for us in 2000. More important than Bradley. Problem was we were paying too much to others inc O'Reilly. We could have signed him up early in the season but because he wasn't a favourite of Elliot, he wasn't looked after.

None of us know the true story but the evidence around Elliot's behaviour at the time makes me think he wasn't a cleanskin in this matter. Imagine if Hamill had taken $400k to stay with us. Where would that have put us for 2002 and 2003 for the cap?

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T E A M

Not on my watch he isn't.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

The day we lost Hamill was for me the beginning of our fall from power. I had never up to that point seen a player leave Carlton that was a wanted player. Furthermore a wanted Carlton player would never ever go to a club like St Kilda.

It was very unfortunate as Hamill was a home grown talent and the years prior to him leaving saw us do some deplorable trades where we gave up good draft picks for hacks who were yesterdays player (McGuane, Davenport etc). I don't blame Hamill or even Elliot entirely. I think his management didn't steer him in the right direction.

I would have loved to see his reaction when he first walked into St.Kilda for the first time. One trophy ... very little champions on photo displays ... and a club run by personnel of little public standing. He left Carlton with 16 premierships on display ... photos of former all time football greats on display ... and a club run by personnel, some of whom are captains of industry.

He left for a worse place and we got worse.

Having said all that I do not accept him as a Carlton person. You cannot be a Carlton person when you have turned your back on our club when you were wanted by the club.

You'd want to be a little flexible with that, otherwise you might have to include Jezza.

Russell and Thornton asked for trades also.

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T E A M

I'm not too fussed about Hamil leaving or otherwise. It was so long ago.

Not sure how different he is to the players going to GC or GWS.

Hamill continually denied that money had anything to do with him leaving. The players heading to GC/GWS have by and large acknowledged that the money being offered just couldn't be refused.

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"One of my favorite philosophical tenets is that people will agree with you only if they already agree with you. You do not change people's minds." - Frank Zappa

The money talked about now is very much the only thing that is discussed in articles about players leaving today. It wasn't as public or common to discuss/report all those years ago.

PIGS ARRRRRRRRRRRSE!

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Premierships: 1869, 1871, 1873, 1874, 1875, 1877, 1887, 1906, 1907, 1908, 1914, 1915, 1938, 1945, 1947, 1968, 1970, 1972, 1979, 1981, 1982, 1987, 1995.

"GIBBS."

Was a huge fan of Hamill. I understand the final straw in him leaving was because of Elliott's behaviour and threats towards him.

If Carlton's culture had been healthy I assume he would have stayed. The payment rorts and I'm guessing Kouta's massive contract (signed earlier that season I believe) were symptoms but the club was corroding, masked by some fine coaching by Britten and a few superstars.

Gee how time flies, Aaron sporting an unfortunate combover there.

I had a feeling somebody would raise this about. Jezza's situation was very different as it involved political turmoil. It was a very bad time at Carlton. When members ousted George Harris they knew it also meant Jezza is the same bundle. The club tried to talk Jezza around but the latter was living in times where your word was you word. He felt he owed it to Harris who gave him the captain - coaching position.

Hamill was more out of greed and being misguided as to where he really stood in the pecking order. He believed all the back slappers.

I remember Thornton wanting to go to the Hawks, but can you fill me in on Russell wanting to leave? I remember Port were rumored to be interested but offering a third round pick or something similarly lowball, this was well before he'd established himself as a senior player.

I don't think that there is any doubt that money played a significant role in his decision to leave. The Swans were the early front runners.

If memory serves, we offered $350k and Swans topped us with $550k which (for the time) was ridiculous. Agreement was reached on a trade for (a reluctant) Leo Barry. Saints came in last minute and offered more still (rumoured $650k). Hamill cut and run.

After the trade, his father was interviewed on the news and said he was stupid as Carlton had been very good to him...

Heard a whisper also that Hamill may have been told (or was aware) about his body problems with the knees and hips. He was aware that his time in footy might be shortened and was advised by Allison to look after himself financially.

Much of that I pieced together over time. Make of it what you will and maybe parts are inaccurate, but I believe that it is largely correct.

Either way, he was a terrific footballer for us for a short time. I don't hate him...

If those numbers are correct Fraser it's no wonder he left.

I think Lethal made a statement in about '04 that Judd was worth 500k, which was a headline because it was considered a large number.

I also think the pay for a top level coach was around 400k, recent numbers suggest it's 600k for a no name and a brick for a top liner.

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I hope Essendon* folds.

Never be a Carlton man in my books either.

I once got a bit of background about this sorry saga by somebody very close to him. Based on that I would say people are too harsh on him and he was one more causality of Elliot's ego. I am not surprised that he sees himself as a Carlton man,.

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TC suffers from the social media illness - the death of respect and constructive discourse by keyboard.

What a joke, if he considered himself a blues man he wouldn't have left. Couldn't see us welcoming him back to the club. It's his fault he is in limbo with no club to call home. Funny how irrelevant some become when they finish their footy careers. IIRC correctly Fev would have played in the granny if Hamill got suspended, they way he played in GF I wouldn't have preferred Fev in hindsight.

This guy should NEVER be allowed to return to Visy Park (aka Princes Park).

He left for $$$$ and it bit him in backside later in his career. Didn't get his name on the locker at Carlton nor that other mob. His rep at the other mob was soured, too, given the way he milked them for $$$ when his body was completely shot. We bent over backwards to get him off in GF week and he spits at us in our faces 12 months later.

He's a player that disgraced the No.4 Carlton guernsey after requesting it at the beginning of the year as Sticks was his idol growing up. What did he do? Took off that jumper, grinded and twisted his foot on that jumper like it meant nothing. Will never forget that image in the HUN after the game in Rd 5 2001 at Princes Park with one or two guys holding the Number 4 jumper in full view of Judas and his new team as he was just about to enter the visitors race after the loss. (Can someone find this picture? Been trying to find it)

Judas will never be considered a Carlton person - Carlton and his real name should never be associated with each other

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For some silly reason, you people want to assassinate him, and it's just rubbish. You people. All of you, ALL of you!

I think Hamill was getting substantially more money at St Kilda. I recall $600k compared to $350k. Elliott was a scapegoat. If he wasn't already going why would Elliott have called him out?

No one disliked him more than me at the time of his move. Over time, I understand it more. I think he knew his body was shot and he had a limited amount of time to make as much money as he could. I'm a bit nonplussed about it now.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

No name on a locker at either club and his manager got a well deserved hit by the karma train as well - everyone got what was coming to them.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill