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PostPosted: Sat Apr 30, 2011 11:18 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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deano35 wrote:
Pretty impressive list of achievements BUT you forgot this little 1...........

1995 premiership player and VERY close if not BEST mate of B. Ratten a fellow 1995 premiership player.

Now your NEVER going to bag your best mate are you????
Funny how Ratts rates Judd up there with none other than G. Williams.


You obviously don't know GW toooooo well. He's certainly not the sort of guy to sugarcoat anything. Very, very considered is Greg, mostly talking about him self, but also about others he has an opinion on. If he didn't honestly believe it he wouldn't say it.

Regards Cazzesman

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Last edited by jimmae on Sat Apr 30, 2011 11:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 6:33 am 
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Craig Bradley

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Cazzeman diesel however qualified isnt going to bag a mate on national tv and say he isnt up to it even if he thinks he isnt up to it. And just because he is a champion of the game doesnt mean he is right if he thinks Ratts is up to it.
Its just spin to satisfy Channel 7 viewers.

Its like the person who goes home to mum at 40 years of age because their partner has left them. Of course most mums would blame the inlaw totally. Sellers Maclure is pretty well qualified to speak on matters. He is been critical of Ratts and the club in general.


And as I have said on a few occasions people with experience in certain fields and high up the corporate deep down dont have a clue.

Look no further than George Bush . I have always said that Ratts in the long term isnt the answer. One win through half of footy in wet conditions with praise from a player who is on a freebie from the AFL and you guys are falling over yourselves in raptures. And you excuse posters like myself on being too premature in calling for ratts head.

As I have said for a long time there is too much of the old school boys club etc 95 flag heroes mentality at Carlton.
This is 2011


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 7:28 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Donstuie wrote:
Is this the biggest case of calling the WAAMBULANCE in recent times?

Quote:
THE AFL will launch an investigation into a controversial interchange infringement that cost Sydney a vital goal in its loss to Carlton at the SCG.

Swans coach John Longmire was furious after his side's 16-point defeat, claiming the interchange steward had made a major error and should have immediately reversed the decision.

The Blues had kicked three consecutive goals through Eddie Betts to take the lead late in the third quarter when the Swans were penalised for having 19 players on the field.

Adam Goodes was coming off the ground and Daniel Hannebery was attempting to come on.

Carlton were awarded a 50m penalty from which Setanta O'hAilpin kicked a fourth straight goal. The penalty enraged the Sydney bench, who were convinced they had not breached the rules.

Longmire said the Swans actually had five players off the field, with Jesse White out of view receiving treatment.

"We had plenty of players on the bench and not enough on the ground and I could see that from the coaches box 80 metres away," Longmire said.

The interchange steward was confident he had made the right call, but official statistics recorder Champion Data, who monitor rotations, is believed to be siding with the Swans.


OMG! An umpiring decision cost you a goal. Alert the !@#$%& National Guard!


And the lovely irony: If it wasn't for the Swans cheating and having 19 on the field against Norf, which did actually cost North the match (it was a draw, IIRC), then these regulations wouldn't be in place.

Karma has kicked you right in the gonads, Horse.

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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 9:36 am 
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Vale 1953-2020
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George Bush went home to his mum because Sellers left him after 40 years. That's why we should sakc Ratts. Makes sense to me.

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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 9:48 am 
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Robert Walls

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Quote:
And as I have said on a few occasions people with experience in certain fields and high up the corporate deep down dont have a clue

:clap: :clap: :clap:

i guess that also applies to people from forums such as this :idea:


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 10:07 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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deano35 wrote:

Funny how Ratts rates Judd up there with none other than G. Williams.


Perhaps one could mount the argument that both Ratts and GW are extremely good judges of ability and character. :wink:

Regards Cazzesman

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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 10:13 am 
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Stephen Silvagni

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Bottom line is that those who work closely with Ratten are the only ones who really know his value as a coach.

He may have amazing insight in the game (as Parkin once alluded too), but the players are not quite at the level required to achieve the instructions.

In footy clubs there's a mix of 'types' in a team. Smart players, and not so smart players. Experienced players and inexperienced players. Developed players and undeveloped players. Some can look at the complexities of the great game and understand the complex directions from their coach and there's others who you have to give just basic instructions to follow because their make up doesn't allow them to evaluate complex equations or directives, or multi tasking.

I remember Sam Kekovich as our coach and I tell you I'd say 80% didn't understand what he was talking about because of the language he used and also because he was well versed with the complexities of the game and forgot that his audience were not at the same level of understanding.

No one knows better than those around Ratten whether he can coach or not. What we all know is that our team is still developing and we have important spots to fill at the 2 most important positions in the spine: CHF and CHB. I can't blame Ratts for the stage of our development nor for the missing CHB and CHF. We had the CHF but traded him for Judd. That's no ones fault. That's life.

We have to deal with what we've got...and there's a few injuries we've been hit with since round 1...and we have lost only one game, and barring 20 minutes of the game against the reigning premiers, we more than matched them...next time Kreuzer, Houla and Bower will be back. Who knows, but when we next play the Pies in 11 weeks, we may have Watson improve so much that he cements his position at CHB. Thatis out of Ratten's control, but I bet you any money he will do whatever he can to get us over the Pies and make the top 4.
That's good enough for me.

But if there's a better coach than Ratten in the waiting then by all means bring him on.
I just don't see the need for all that talk till the end of the season.
And for those who have forgotten, we are currently cemented in the top 4 after 6 rounds, and should be happy with that.

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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 10:16 am 
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Rod Ashman

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Cazzesman wrote:
Maybe you and Josh Kaplan need to have a cup of tea with this guy who has been around footy abit....

250 AFL games
Dual Brownlow Medal winner (should have been 3)
Twice Players Association Most Valuable Player award winner (with Geelong in 1985 and Carlton in 1994)
Norm Smith Medal winner with Carlton as best on ground during the 1995 AFL Grand Final.
4 time All-Australian Team member.
In 2001 inducted into the Australian Football Hall of Fame.
In 2009 inducted into the Sydney Swan's inaugural Hall of Fame.

He seems to have a different opinion but I'm sure you and Josh watch alot of footy on the telly which no doubt helps your thought process on the matter.

Regards Cazzesman


Pretty irrelevant Mr C. His mate Sticks gets to pick the coach and he appointed Britts and then sacked him, Pagan and then sacked him and was desperate to get Voss.

Ratts will hold his job if we do well this year and will lose it if we don't. He appears to be taking far less responsibility on game day. He would have had very little idea of what was happening on Friday night, watching from the bench. We appear to have more of a coaching collective now and that is fine. It is in Brett's hands. He is extraordinarily lucky to have got the job with little experience and without the club looking beyond our locker room, and in getting a player like Judd who almost singlehandedly sets up all our victories, Ratts is looking the goods at the moment as he was this time last year and I think this year we will go on with it.

But Greg Williams is not in the inner sanctum anymore, as he said the other night. He was a great footballer, utterly singleminded and the sort of player who didn't need a coach. I don't think old team mates pushing up for each other is that relevant, and a great playing record doesn't make you a great administrator or off field judge.

Diesel wouldn't have made a great coach himself, had ordinary communication skills and was very much about himself. That didn't stop him being a super footballer.

I always remember that old moron Crackers Keenan coming up with absurdities and justifying them by quoting how many games he had played - he didn't seem to realise that having a brain the size of a pea invalidated most of what he said.

I am not suggesting for a moment that Diesel is not a massively smarter guy, but his opinion of Ratts is not relevant. As I say Ratts is a very very lucky man and now with guys like Alan Rchardson and players like Judd and a host of #1 and high picks he can make a career as a coach. Is he the best? Will he do what coaches need to do and make the team much greater than the sum of the parts? At the moment things are looking good lets hope they continue. But we only get one go at this. Judd is a once in 30 years player, and we won't ever have a better go at the draft that the last 8 years, so if we have the best coach for the job, we may sneak a flag before the GC juggernaut gets rolling in 4 years time, if we haven't we may miss the chance and have a long wait. Ratts has massive responsibility on his shoulders a do those who chose him. Things looking good so far. Top 4 this year, and then a flga chance next year. Sts are gone, Cats too old, Hawks slipped and after this year the Woods may have a dual flag hangover. 2012/3 will be our years. Lets hope we grasp them.


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 10:28 am 
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formerly King Kenny
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gerry atric wrote:
Cazzesman wrote:
Maybe you and Josh Kaplan need to have a cup of tea with this guy who has been around footy abit....

250 AFL games
Dual Brownlow Medal winner (should have been 3)
Twice Players Association Most Valuable Player award winner (with Geelong in 1985 and Carlton in 1994)
Norm Smith Medal winner with Carlton as best on ground during the 1995 AFL Grand Final.
4 time All-Australian Team member.
In 2001 inducted into the Australian Football Hall of Fame.
In 2009 inducted into the Sydney Swan's inaugural Hall of Fame.

He seems to have a different opinion but I'm sure you and Josh watch alot of footy on the telly which no doubt helps your thought process on the matter.

Regards Cazzesman


He appears to be taking far less responsibility on game day. He would have had very little idea of what was happening on Friday night, watching from the bench.


Rubbish. He has tactical coaches watching the game in the box whilst Ratts is in the face of players the entire game on the bench delivering a coaches message.


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 10:45 am 
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Adrian Gallagher
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gerry atric wrote:
Pretty irrelevant Mr C. His mate Sticks gets to pick the coach and he appointed Britts and then sacked him, Pagan and then sacked him and was desperate to get Voss.

Is this all accurate?
How long has Sticks been president?
Is the president the only voice in appointment of a coach?
Unfortunate for Ratten to be stuck with a player like Judd who will prevent him from getting any credit for any success that may come Carlton's way this year. :roll:

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Last edited by jimmae on Sun May 01, 2011 1:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 11:05 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Scotto on before the game was asked about Ratten and he basically said "he's getting better as a coach" .

That's not a response you hear made by senior players about their coach very often. He then mentioned the impact Brown and Richardson have made and that the group (players and coaches) were improving together. He sounded, to me at least, quite proud of the groups improvements.

I've been unconvinced by Ratts because I just didn't think he had the presence or confidence to bring in an effective style of play, but Scotto's answers seem to suggest there is a level of solidarity in the playing and coaching group that has not existed before.

It was quite heartening.

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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 11:07 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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gerry atric wrote:

Pretty irrelevant Mr C. His mate Sticks gets to pick the coach and he appointed Britts and then sacked him, Pagan and then sacked him and was desperate to get Voss.

Ratts will hold his job if we do well this year and will lose it if we don't. He appears to be taking far less responsibility on game day. He would have had very little idea of what was happening on Friday night, watching from the bench. We appear to have more of a coaching collective now and that is fine. It is in Brett's hands. He is extraordinarily lucky to have got the job with little experience and without the club looking beyond our locker room, and in getting a player like Judd who almost singlehandedly sets up all our victories, Ratts is looking the goods at the moment as he was this time last year and I think this year we will go on with it.

But Greg Williams is not in the inner sanctum anymore, as he said the other night. He was a great footballer, utterly singleminded and the sort of player who didn't need a coach. I don't think old team mates pushing up for each other is that relevant, and a great playing record doesn't make you a great administrator or off field judge.



Regardless of friendships I'd suggest GW has abit more cred and experience in and around the Job to judge the abilities of Ratts, than the vast majority on TC. After 6 rounds in 2011 and 2010 and 2009 the facts are that the team is improving regardless of whether he was lucky to get the job or not. How far it goes no-one knows.

As for the regular comments about Judd making Ratts look better than he is, hasn't Buddy, King Carey, Gazza Snr and Jnr, Hirdy, Bucks, Vossy, Johnno Brown, Hayes, Cousins and a huge array of other Champions done the same thing for their respective Coaches. Great players makes Coaches look good. If the other 21 players didn't come out after 1/2 time I doubt Judd would beat them on his own.

As for Ratts not having an idea about what is going on because he sits on the bench.................... :roll: :roll: :roll: . I would have thought that talking to your players the moment thay come off the ground is a good way to get to the crux of the matter instantly. He can talk to the onballers and find out the who, what, when and why. He can assess the mental and physical condition of each player instantly whilst sitting next to Justin Cordy. From there he can feed that info back to the Box. If the Box get accurate feedback about the players condition then the box can better implement any tactical changes.

Now Ratts has spread the load with himself on the bench you are still critical for reasons unknown. He sits on the bench because he feels it is best for the team to get instant feedback. His new 1 on 1 style seems to be working. The players are playing with good intensity and passion I have no doubt Ratts appreance on the bench where he is free to interact has plenty to do with the success. Brown and Richardson are obiously very tactically savvy so it is a win win for the Club.

Regards Cazzesman

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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 11:10 am 
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Craig Bradley

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When the coaching job was up for grabs after round 17 2007 I listed some candidates who should be looked at.

One was Alan Richardson who atleast is at the club.
the other was Brendan McCarthy who I saw first hand at Ocean Grove.
Best coach I have ever heard seen watch go about his business but because he played 80 games for Newtown as apposed to 250 for the navy blue he didnt get thought of.
Just happens to be an article in the age today about him and sums him up. He was born to coach and would be a shame if he doesnt become a senior coach at AFL level. If Ratts doesnt workiout then I would be definitely being interviewing him


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 12:35 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Listening to Caro at laughing at how lazy and under-prepared her and other commentators offerings are re this game and Carltons/Judds performance and her insinuation we're a 1 man team.

Said she watched the wedding and only saw Foxsports highlights - completely oblivious to likes of Ellard Curnow Murph Carrotts Scotto racking up 49 tackles, 58 contested possessions for a start.

Judd was enormous but there's a few slipping under the radar who deserve a bit more respect from these so-called experts.


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 1:07 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Cazzesman wrote:
deano35 wrote:

Funny how Ratts rates Judd up there with none other than G. Williams.


Perhaps one could mount the argument that both Ratts and GW are extremely good judges of ability and character. :wink:

Regards Cazzesman

Just to tack onto this, I've met Greg Williams several times and have heard many stories regarding the man.

He is an honest and typically very serious man; he wouldn't go on the record and say these things about Ratten if he didn't believe them. If he felt otherwise, he would simply shy away from comment. Anyone who watched him play would probably realise this, despite his fiery temper.

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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 1:10 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Rexy wrote:
Listening to Caro at laughing at how lazy and under-prepared her and other commentators offerings are re this game and Carltons/Judds performance and her insinuation we're a 1 man team.

Said she watched the wedding and only saw Foxsports highlights - completely oblivious to likes of Ellard Curnow Murph Carrotts Scotto racking up 49 tackles, 58 contested possessions for a start.

Judd was enormous but there's a few slipping under the radar who deserve a bit more respect from these so-called experts.

You're talking about that wannabe ABC sports show that caters to the average flower from Sydney?

That thing is a hunk of crap. It's a sports show for bandwagon types who don't bother with learning a thing about any sports. That should be obvious as soon as they let Caro weigh in on anything other than AFL.

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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 1:15 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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keogh wrote:
When the coaching job was up for grabs after round 17 2007 I listed some candidates who should be looked at.

One was Alan Richardson who atleast is at the club.
the other was Brendan McCarthy who I saw first hand at Ocean Grove.
Best coach I have ever heard seen watch go about his business but because he played 80 games for Newtown as apposed to 250 for the navy blue he didnt get thought of.
Just happens to be an article in the age today about him and sums him up. He was born to coach and would be a shame if he doesnt become a senior coach at AFL level. If Ratts doesnt workiout then I would be definitely being interviewing him


If Brendan McCartney was such a good candidate why didn't he get the gig at Geelong? Maybe he just wasn't up to it!?


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 1:18 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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jimmae wrote:
Rexy wrote:
Listening to Caro at laughing at how lazy and under-prepared her and other commentators offerings are re this game and Carltons/Judds performance and her insinuation we're a 1 man team.

Said she watched the wedding and only saw Foxsports highlights - completely oblivious to likes of Ellard Curnow Murph Carrotts Scotto racking up 49 tackles, 58 contested possessions for a start.

Judd was enormous but there's a few slipping under the radar who deserve a bit more respect from these so-called experts.

You're talking about that wannabe ABC sports show that caters to the average flower from Sydney?

That thing is a hunk of crap. It's a sports show for bandwagon types who don't bother with learning a thing about any sports. That should be obvious as soon as they let Caro weigh in on anything other than AFL.


I can't stand listening to Caro's bias against carlton and for Richmond.


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 3:07 pm 
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formerly Josh Kaplan

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Looks like Cazz is up for a scrap.. that's fine.

Our performance on Friday night was fantastic. I think we are structuring up far better than I have seen for many years and our defence is looking more cohesive. I'm a little bewildered as to why you're giving us a week by week report on Ratten when you were so keen to judge him at the end of this season.

The entire club is under no illusions as to what Ratten needs to do to get a contract extension. The fact of the matter is there are some seriously high quality coaches available at the end of this season, and our club would be derelict in their duty to its members if we don't explore every available option to ensure we have the best group of coaches available, led by the best senior coach available.

BR needs to do a hell of a lot more convincing for a far longer period of time if he is going to be the man in 12. This can only be a good thing for our footy club.


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PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2011 3:17 pm 
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Craig Bradley

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Im on record as a doubter before the season started but WANT TO GIVE HIM A FAIR GO

Greg Williams is a straight shooter he wouldnt be so strong in his support if he thinks the guy is not up to it

I agree we should wait until the end of the season to judge his performance

HOWEVER I think he cant be faulted this year so far in his performance .As Scotto says he is growing into the job.He is much more measured and assured in interviews .


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