It was shocking umpiring. I think that theory could have legs if they choose these same umpires for the game against Essendon* later in the year.


The interpretation of holding the ball was odd. North could drop the ball after at least 5 seconds of being tackled with the ball , but w no penalty play on. ..but if carlton did it iwas holding the ball.... what was the free kick count 25 to 5? or something similar in the 3rd quarter.


Out : browne, kreuzer?,


in: yarran, hampson..would also like to see what Grigg or Lucas are capable of again....so not sure who to drop for them.

Too many players got ahead of themselves and paid the price.
Armfield trying to kick off one step. (Out on the full) He's not been able to do it without shanking the kick previously, why would he think he can suddenly do it now?
AJ showing poor discipline and refusing to be goal side of his opponent at a defensive stoppage. Couple that with his sudden propensity to take on 2 tacklers instead of getting it on the boot and he is playing selfish and lazy football.
Too many soft efforts under pressure. Armfield going back into a pack to spoil and failing to contact the ball, twice. Russell dropping 3 marks under pressure. Carlos going back into bad habits and dropping his head in marking contests. Once he does that, he loses any advantage he has with his height and reach. He also refused to command the front position which good forwards must do.
A disappointing result all round.

Unfortunately we still lose confidence quickly when things dont go our way. It's a residual symptom of years of poor performance. As soon as we started turning the ball over, our run and risk taking was always going to diminish. Unfortunately it's a problem that can only be resolved by building a bank of confidence that comes from years of sustained success and strong performances.

Personally, I'm glad it has been exposed so we can address those deficiencies and certain players can go back and work on the areas required. Interestingly, there were times last night where Judd has stepped up previously and dragged us over the line. It's good for the players to see that he cant do it every game and some others are required to put their hand up occasionally.

well done to Simmo. I thought he gutsed it out well. As did Sauce and Garlett. The most disappointing aspect was that we were beaten to the contested footy in every quarter. The answer is pretty simple for the players. If you aren't prepared to work as hard as your opponent, anyone can pull your pants down.
Congratulations to North. Their youngsters outmuscled our players and worked harder to win the inside space at most contests and delivered a reality check to a lot of players with bigger reputations.

Out- T/Bird, Browne, Carlos and AJ.
In- Bower, Lucas, Yarran, Henderson

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Wasn't at the game, couldn't even watch on TV due to commitments.

Having read this thread, I'll comment on the vibe I'm getting:

- Astonished Army not given a go on Thomas;
- Jordy's form has been a bit indifferent past few weeks. Le Cras also got hold of him a few weeks ago. Not a "small forward" defender??
- Hendo for Carlos has to happen. The competition b/w the two will be healthy
- Milne hardly touches it a few weeks ago, Thomas has a career best 7, WTF!!
- Why do we play the flowering "shinboning spiritationalists" when their season/brand depends on it
- The form of a few of the "marginal" players made it alot easier for some genuine best 22'ers to get back in next week (Bower, Lucas, Yarran & Hendo). Grigga probably due a run too, we must get a good look at this kid in the next few weeks
- Does Krooze need a rest? Maybe a few weeks off and have him ready after the mid-season break? We don't want him to be our Josh Fraser! Hammer seems in good enough touch to slot straight back, another good game in Ants today will breathe life into this proposition. His athleticism and leap could be handy v Sandilands

Finally, we continue to lose to teams that have been haunting us for years - Bombers, Hawks and Roos. Let's not kid ourselves, we were lucky to beat the Roos last year, but it's galling that natural improvement doesn't clock in to see us now handling teams like this, especially knowing what our boys CAN do when in the zone. We won't be a top 4 team until we can get over the hoodoo these teams present. For some reason, we keep losing to teams that are, on form and on paper, inferior, yet they overcome it with greater intensity. This more than anything is really doing my head in.

Well flowerr me drunk in the middle of Bourke Street
This loss has pushed you over the edge...I mean, bold type, exclamation marks and large/colourful font.
Reading between the lines, I think you want Ratts sacked

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If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you!

You make a very VERY valid point Keogh. It will be interesting if the same people have a whinge about Cazzes or will they just be sheep going with popular opinion?

No offence to Cazzes who I have great respect for.

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You want the flame? Give us the marbles!!

It was a stupid, stubborn and pigheaded effort by Ratts to not move him. Not only was he getting pantsed but we missed his drive out of defence immensely. It's like we were robbing Peter to pay Paul but Paul wasn't getting any money.

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You want the flame? Give us the marbles!!

It was obvious in the first five minutes that we didn't turn up with the right mindset/attitude and it's quite troubling; why do we have these lapses every 3-4 weeks?

We comprehensively won the clearances yet always struggled to score; we couldn't deal with McMahon/Grima being loose in defence at times. The pressure their midfield applied made it even harder for our mids to find the right option and hit the target. The ball was often bombed in straight to the loose man. Would bring Hendo in and possibly keep Setanta up forward as well; let Waite play as a flanker and play a bit further up the ground. There was one passage of play early in the last where Simpson had a perfectly weighted kick to the top of the square - Waite didn't have the body strength to push his man under the ball and mark; the kick had perfect depth on it; it is that sort of kick which a Hendo/Kennedy type can mark and goal by leaning into their opponent then pushing off at the last moment.

Then there was the pathetic lack of forward pressure - there were plenty of crumbs given we struggled to take marks inside 50 yet the ball was rebounded with relative ease. Setanta's opponent ran off him, Waite's opponent ran off him - you can tell we're up and about when we win a free kick from a tackle inside 50. Garlett tried hard but looks a bit tired; Eddie didn't seem to chase as hard as normal. Garlett has kicked 2 goals in his last 4 weeks; mostebly needs a rest, maybe it's a good opportunity to give him a couple of weeks off.

Eddie was the CHF once again for a lot of entries; would be fine if he was a bit taller but it gave their defenders an opportunity if the kick to him was off just a fraction. Yarran is important in this aspect because of his frame/height and ability to mark overhead. Hopefully he has a good run today and can come straight back in to provide more defensive pressure and marking ability.

Joseph really has had a poor year compared to last; not unexpected with young players but you have to know your limitations. You aren't good enough and don't have the speed/evasive ability to run around your man AJ. You haven't 'made it' yet...don't be so arrogant; get back to the basics and give the ball off to more accomplished players when you have the opportunity.

Agree with Club29 on all the defenders having a bad night; as BV mentioned JR was uncharacteristically bad - he's been marking those long bombs all year but started dropping his head which was disappointing. The move off Thomas should have been made sooner with Armfield the better matchup IMO - he has the speed to go with him on the lead and get a spoil in but also the agility at ground level to not let him run away. Maybe if he hadn't just come into the team he would have been the one to start on him. How often did our players get fooled because they thought Thomas would go onto his right foot? He's always going to go to his right side first and then come back onto his left yet all our defenders appeared to fall for it. Poor concentration and dumb football.

Houlihan couldn't get into the game at all; seemed unable to cope with the heightened pressure from North. Waite was good at times in marking contests but still overcommits a lot and allows his opponent to run away with little pressure. Hadley was good in close but when it came to the spread he was poor and his lack of agility/pace meant it was like we were one down in the middle...he got caught a lot and coughed the ball up when put under pressure by the North small forwards.

Finally...Scott McLaren you imbecile...if the AFL had any sense that would be the last game you umpire this year; such an incompetent person in such a responsible position. Sack the hack.

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"You are being watched. The government has a secret system. A machine that spies on you every hour of every day. I know because I built it." - Finch

What I really want is for the team to do 60 minutes of 1 on 1 contested football over and over at the next training session just like the good old days of the 70's and 80's. Wallsy's idea of putting Shane Strempel in the circle of death and having him fight his way out is looking pretty damn good to me at the moment.

Regards Cazzesman

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Ricky Gervais - “Everyone has the right to hold whatever beliefs they want. And everyone else has the right to find those beliefs f***ing ridiculous.”

Heard Balme a few months back on the radio call us flakey and unreliable. I was angry at him for a second but then agreed. Our best footy is very good and has proven that it can beat the best but we continue to get hunted by lesser teams and we fall apart.
Getting over this is the big challenge infront of us. It probably wont be easy and we will probably have to get there with baby steps but as we mature we can over come this challenge.

I knew the FIGJAM Carlton would turn up... It happens eery time following a week of possitive press... This is why people dont really rate or respect us.. We play well against the good sides, and then down hill ski against the weaker sides and are made to look soft and second rate...
If last night's pathetic, weak and embaressing effort is anything to go by, we dont deserve to play Finals let alone make the Top 4 like some have suggested...

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James Hird and Essendon* FC - #FOREVERDRUGCHEATS

No doubt our week to week opposition will have this in mind and make it doubly difficult to break this cycle.
We have earned this reputation, unfortunately.

I said recently that I was happy to read negative comment on TC if it was backed up with corroborative or factual evidence. To that end, I would tender a copy of the 1st half of Fridays game to the Court of popular perception.

Regards Cazzesman

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Ricky Gervais - “Everyone has the right to hold whatever beliefs they want. And everyone else has the right to find those beliefs f***ing ridiculous.”

disagree we beat the cats and saints everything else we have beaten is junk crows port tiges demons - rubbish sides - sides not far off pies bombers lions north hawks we have struggled

says to me we are not as good as we think -sides at the same ability knock us over
we are soft and with the exception of Judd lack on field leadership if he doesnt step up we lose

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If you allow the Government to change the Laws in an emergency
They will create an Emergency to change the Laws

Our best chance of winning the flag this year may well be to make the finals in 8th position. With every team above us the betting favourite and the Blues the underdog, we're just in with a chance of walking away with the big one ... I think it could work ... Ratts, you listening?

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"It was like calling your ex girlfriend after a night on the booze, just a really bad decision".

Keogh is doing a good job of attempting to get a rise out of some.

Hellas has missed the point that if someone who regularly provides a more constructive opinion of what is happening feels he has to vent to prevent blowing a foofer valve, then the performance (note that: 1 performance) probably warrants it.

those who are regularly negative certainly will fit in this week, but they shouldn't feel validated as the team is just as likely to revert to the "Good" Carlton next time.

We need to draft illiterate players who can't read. BTW totally agree....Carlton are just about the most predictable side when it comes to who they lose to. Said a few weeks ago to mates, "We will lose one of WC, Melb or NM".

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If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you!

Mmmh....so through induction and inference, you're saying that Ratts must tender his resignation, effective immediately. Is Jezza still in a Camberra hotel waiting for that phonecall?

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If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you!

No I haven't missed the point at all, I just haven't missed Keogh's either. But I dare say the majority will ignore it because it doesn't suit them.

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You want the flame? Give us the marbles!!

Do you mean "deduction", Holmes?

Wasnt able to go to game last night and have only seen part of the replay (that was enough). I can get the idea of how we played by the posts on here.
this was always going to be a danger game. For some reason we cant beat North.
I think the Fev factor may be starting to show now, teams have worked out our foward structure and Setanta is having to cope with best defenders each week.
Really disappointing night from all accounts and changes are needed.