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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:36 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3561
Pros
Finally the MC may see that Browne offers nothing (BTW, nor does Anderson)

Cons
lazy footballers who refuse to gut run both ways

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:47 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:52 pm
Posts: 2044
Pros- Same guys give you something when the team is swimming against the tide: simpson, scotland, Judd, Betts with cameos from Carrazzo, Hadley, Jacobs and Waite. We had 14 passengers tonight


Cons-

The coach was awful tonight. Did we start the first quarter with an extra man in defence against a weakside under the roof. I thoought that set a defensive mindset for the whole night.

There were no moves, tackling and run.

Kreuzer needs games as a permanent forward, especially on nights like tonight, when we struggle to score


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:47 pm 
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Ken Hands
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Got to learn that there's no easy wins in the AFL.
Got to learn respect for the opposition.
Players to intent on relying on someone else to do the job if things aren't going our way.


PROS

Hmmm, struggling.
Betts of course.
Gibbs tried hard.
Carrazzo beat Harvey but didn't hurt the Roos the other way, which a good tagger needs to do theses days.

CONS

First quarter , too intent on flexing our muscles than finding the ball. This is when the game was lost and we went out there with the wrong mindset. Had to play catch up footy all night, which was too difficult as North were on tonight. We underestimated our opponent.
Coaches box didn't seem to have the answers.
Browne - felt like he was injured or sick. Was soft which is unlike Browne. Will go back to the Ants.
Too many others had bad nights on the same night, why does that happen. Must be mindset. This will happen with a young team, but coaches must work super hard on motivation techniques, especially after we've won one or two which is when we are most likely to falter, regardless of the opposition.

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:50 pm 
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Trevor Keogh
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Location: Melbourne
Pros:
Betts, Murphy, Judd

Cons:

- Too weak, every of our player gets pushed off too easily.
- Defensive pressure is pretty much non-existence.
- Nothing going forward. A lot of times our midfielders look up the ground and there's no one to kick it to, which resulted the player with the ball getting tackled.
- Russell and Walker, Their timing of the jump and reading the flight of the ball was truly awful tonight.
- Setenta, i love this guy and i wish he plays well, but 2 weeks in a row he offered nothing. He always stands behind his opponent and a lot time he just does not go for the ball at all.
- Browne is freaking too slow
- tackling, can't hold down an opponent.
- Robinson, he goes hard at the ball but a lot of times he just do these unnecessary dive on the ball were totally ineffective.
- Waite, he is either very hot or very cold. Took some good mark, but sometimes he just plays really dumb football.
- Joseph, he is sooooo out of form at the moment.


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:53 pm 
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Garry Crane
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pro:
Jammo still a gun when the entire team is off
Jacobs & kruezer played well
Carrazzo defeated Harvey
Betts & Waite up forward was serviceable
Got many good players to come back

con:
mentally weak team
umpiring was beyond a joke
hadley, ohailpin, browne - GONE!
joseph had a shocker (but at least never gave up)

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:55 pm 
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Horrie Clover

Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:05 pm
Posts: 396
Location: Avondale Heights
Pros:
Betts
Gibbs when onball
Jacobs
Garlett

Cons:
Umpires
fwd line- non existant, dont know how but how can we kill it out of the centre so much but each time we burst clear we had to hold it up cos theres no one to kick it too? Spewin Hendo didnt play.
Browne- not good enough and was praised last season for goin in hard, lost that tonight, didnt go when he had to on numerous occassions.
Thornton- Adds nothing
Russell- not the best of nights
Joseph- nightmare, stupid frees & got out bodied, out played and embarrassed all night
Setants- strung a few bad games together now, lacked his 1% work tonight even.

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:59 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Pro: The world cup is on

Con: Knew we would lose , yet tipped us :donk:

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 12:00 am 
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formerly King Kenny
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Pro: World Cup has started :thumbsup:


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 12:09 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Mon May 31, 2010 10:07 pm
Posts: 1984
Not sure if you would have this as a pro or a con, but the following players had absolute shockers:
Kreuzer
Russell
Joseph
Houlihan
Walker
Setanta
Carrazzo
Scotland
Robinson

Browne (currently not up to it, shouldn't play again this year)


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:07 am 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:35 am
Posts: 2125
PROS
Sauce
Hadley
Betts

CONS
Woeful, undisciplined performance by AJ I can take him getting slaughtered by Thmas but then giving away a series of off ball tiggy touchwood frees. It's dumb, selfish and unacceptable. ow about trying to have contact with Thomas when he has the ball, not when an umpire is a metre away and the ball is not even live
Browne - tries hard but looks a metre slower than everyone else
Army rushed back, was okay but misjudged the ball and would have been better for a run in the 2s.
Big K looks like a tired ordinary player at the moment. Getting jumped all over at centre bounces and not getting the ball around the ground.
MC out thought. The Roos shut us down and we again didn't seem to have a plan B
Always obvious that the Roos would come out firing it was their grand final. The only ones who didn't anticiopate this were the 22 guys in Carlton jumpers.
Need to get back our run our of the backline and to dominate the middle. Need more intensity.
We are good as hunters, not so good as the hunted.
This loss negates one of our unexpected wins.
Why can't we win more than 2 in a row.


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:12 am 
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Bruce Comben

Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2008 11:15 pm
Posts: 40
Location: carlton
simonverbeek wrote:
A really immature performance from I guess what’s still an immature team. Too many inexcusable efforts and errors from players that you would hope should know better.

PROS

1. Hadlee – doing what McLean was recruited for, in and under, dishing it out well.

2. Carrazzo – shaky early but came back to beat Harvey IMO. Is a reliable tagger now.

3. Gibbs in the middle – Much more useful than he is in defence. Why does he only get moved into the middle when it’s panic stations?

4. Eddie Betts - had to replace Fevola as the only credible forward.

5. A wake up call for these blokes to provide some real consistency before reading their own publicity. We have not been able to string more than 2-3 good weeks together and this needs to be a focus as we move forward.

CONS

1. The whole defence – A disgraceful effort. Didn’t play tight enough and conceded too many soft goals. Joseph, Armfield, Russel, Walker all played their worst games for the year and looked rattled. Our game plan relies on these blokes running off and if they’re all down its game over.

2. The forward line – too many ineffective I50’s. Houlihan, Setanta were poor. Waite kicked three but wasn’t a good target.

3. Walker – After BOG last week, gave away silly frees, didn’t want to play tight on his man and misjudged numerous marking contests. Needs to learn from it.

4. Browne – not good enough. Lost one on one contests. Bullants.

5. Lack of run through the corridor – the game plan broke down once the defence was beaten. We won the clearances and breaks but it didn’t matter because we could not break the lines.

Inability to string together consistent performances. A hallmark of our young team, but good performances have been punctuated by poor football against Coll, Haw and now North. We must try to eradicate these regular off days.

An off night.

An opportunity lost.

Not acceptable.



simon, you're the best judge here.....

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:13 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Location: Half back flank
Con: Got a whole flower long weekend to think about that match :mad:

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:30 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Posts: 4426
Pros
Gibbs when moved into the middle but by then the game was gone
not much else
Cons
Ratten had his worst night since the Essendon* game. Very poor performance.
Lazy predictable performance.
Yes we beat last years grand finalists but so have other teams.
The reality is we lack mental toughness when challenged and we lack creativity in the box
At best we are a middle of the table team at the moment and that is not
good enough given our list IMO
whilst I never blame umpiring for losses and they certainly did not cost us the game
their performance was the worst I have ever seen

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:37 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Pro: We're a young team

Con: So are they

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:39 am 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Pro: The point of North Melbourne is pretty obvious right now.


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:46 am 
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John Nicholls

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:52 am
Posts: 9105
Location: Nth Fitzroy
We have won a high percentage of games this year with Gibbs in defence playing well. It has been one of the moves that got our gameplan firing. Tonight he was terrible in defense in the first 40 mins. Like the rest of defense he was making errors of his own doing and looked to be not switched on.
We looked a little better with him in the middle but we didnt win so although Gibbs looked better in the middle we still lost by the same amount we were down when he went in.

In short i prefer gibbs in the backline playing well because more often than not when that is the case we win.

Con:- Not having 2 Gibbs.


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:55 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Mon May 31, 2010 10:07 pm
Posts: 1984
the two games where Gibbs has really starred in defense were v Geelong and v West Coast. In the West Coast game, he didn't really have an opponent in the second half, had roughly the same number of possessions as the first half, but the team didn't benefit nearly as much (ie we won by a lot more in the first half than we did in the second). V Geelong, Judd and Murphy both had really good games in the middle, as did McLean, so he wasn't really needed there.
Consider two games where Gibbs has started in defense, moved into the midfield, and almost instantly turned the game (v Collingwood and v Kangaroos).

Unfortunately, we have been unable to field our first choice back 6, but when we do, we will be much better off with Gibbs in the middle (and getting forward).


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:11 am 
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John Nicholls

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:52 am
Posts: 9105
Location: Nth Fitzroy
Stamos wrote:
the two games where Gibbs has really starred in defense were v Geelong and v West Coast. In the West Coast game, he didn't really have an opponent in the second half, had roughly the same number of possessions as the first half, but the team didn't benefit nearly as much (ie we won by a lot more in the first half than we did in the second). V Geelong, Judd and Murphy both had really good games in the middle, as did McLean, so he wasn't really needed there.
Consider two games where Gibbs has started in defense, moved into the midfield, and almost instantly turned the game (v Collingwood and v Kangaroos).

Unfortunately, we have been unable to field our first choice back 6, but when we do, we will be much better off with Gibbs in the middle (and getting forward).


I am just playing the percentages. Port he was in defence and did well on Motlop. Last week he was in defense and although he was beaten by Green we still won. Not sure where he lined up against the saints but i am betting he was behind the ball. We just seem to win more with him in defense and i feel safe with him mopping up down there and sending the ball forward through the corridor and linking up to pump the ball inside 50.

Its only a matter of opinion and i repect yours. You raise some good points.

I do like it when gibbs moves further up the ground as the game wears on and the pace has gone out of it a bit and i do think he is very good at centre clearences.


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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:53 am 
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Herald Sun columnist
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Pro
On our win two lose one scenario, we should beat Freo and Brions.

Con
On our win two lose one, we should lose to the Doggies.

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 Post subject: Re: R12: Pros & Cons
PostPosted: Sat Jun 12, 2010 8:58 am 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Michael Jezz wrote:
The coach was awful tonight. Did we start the first quarter with an extra man in defence against a weakside under the roof. I thoought that set a defensive mindset for the whole night.

There were no moves, tackling and run.


No we didn't start the first quarter with an extra man in defence.

I was sitting right behind the bench. There were plenty of moves and the coach doesn't control tackling and run.

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