I have always doubted Ratten. My posts last week were criticised when I said this forum is overly optimistic of where we are at and it is time to take off the rose Coloured glasses. Here is the critique of the Pro Ratten stance

Pro Ratten Camp- Ratten can coach against any club but has a problem with Essendon*.

This is not the case. Ratten has misfired on a number of occassions. Here are some of them: Fremantle & Adelaide last year.
The final against Brisbane. He lacks tactical experience, gameday nous or whatever you want to call it

It is the Players Fault. They aren't fired up.

This is the greatest cop out arguement I have ever heard. Motivation is partly the coaches responsibility but more importantly it is a direct result of a gameplan that works. If a player consistently is forced to follow tactics that are flawed and they result in the team losing possession, eventually, the team will become disheartened.
We don't have a kickout strategy. We don't have a forward entry strategy. IMO, once we lost Fevola we needed to be able to impliment a run and carry game like the bulldogs.

It is the recruiting departments fault.
Sorry, the recruting department has not got it right all the time but there is enough talent there to at least be a top 8 side.
It is anot as if Ratten didn't have a say in some of the selections and trades either:Johnson, Fevola, Yarran over Rich

Ratten has not got qualtity assistants
Surely a good coach appoints his own assitants


Supporters need to be more patient
Ratten has had nearly 3 years. Murphy is in his 5th season Gibbs is in his 4th season. Kreuzer is in his 3rd. There is no excusess now.


Supporters want Blood like the PAgan Years
Pagan didnt have the cattle and he was an older coach wwith yesterdays tactiçs. Ratten has the cattle and is a youing coach with no tactics and no evident gameplan

I've said it once and I'll say it again. When Laidley put himself back in the market for a coaching role, why the hell didn't the club chase after his services? He is great tactically, and could very well be our missing link. Not suggesting he should have replaced Ratten as head coach, but maybe worked as an assistant, it may have done wonders.

But no, it must be a member of the Carlton boys club.

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Premierships: 1869, 1871, 1873, 1874, 1875, 1877, 1887, 1906, 1907, 1908, 1914, 1915, 1938, 1945, 1947, 1968, 1970, 1972, 1979, 1981, 1982, 1987, 1995.

"GIBBS."

would be nice if you tried the same

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

Ok here goes...it's the players fault....they are lazy and you can't blame Ratts for bad kicking or bad kickouts or playing the wings or being as slow as a wet week...our list is so young....we are still developing....Fev has left a big hole....Judd was missing....we just weren't fired up (yes I know it was Essendon* but still)...Knights is a top coach....etc.................................................how was that Gro????

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"Truth, for the tyrants, is the most terrible and cruel of all bindings; it is like an incandescent iron falling across their chests. And it is even more agonizing than hot iron, for that only burns the flesh, while truth burns its way into the soul"     — Lauro Aguirre

different at least

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*(grow - fun - gah)

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.

There's a bit of a difference in quality and experience between Sydney's half back line and ours. They also have the support of a hard working midfield who will work back into defense to cover.

Ratts had little choice into the input of his assistants. Would you hire David Teague?

Can someone change the title of this thread to the correct spelling?
I greatly respect the opinions of many on here who will virtually support Ratten till the end- I include Cazz and others in that- but I asked this question last season. Can someone please name one member of our current coaching staff who would walk into a role at any other AFL club?

How is that not enough of a wake up call?

I'm expecting the usual responses- ie: 'the pessimists are only coming out after a loss.. etc.'

We are treading some serious water with our current coaching panel. We are not developing our blue chip talent to the best of their ability. Ratts himself lacks so much confidence in his own beliefs/ structures/ game plan it is no wonder the players look lost, confused and scared to even attempt to play the corridor. The club needs to concentrate on putting together a back up coaching plan for our club for next year, and attempt to orchestrate it in as clean a fashion as possible.

Will always respect Ratts for his on field deeds. Gun player and no doubt he bleeds Navy Blue.

Fair to say I have significant doubts he has what it takes tactically to be an AFL Head Coach.

In all seriousness, if our season goes pear shaped and we don't win a game in the next 7 or 8 weeks (unfortunately an all too real possibility ), what will the club do?

Will they have the balls to make tough decisions regardless of any mitigating circumstances?

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We are on our way back...

And that's another major issue. Look at Voss at Brisbane or Roos at Sydney or Thompson at Geelong or Lyon at St Kilda they ALL appoint the people they want to support them. Even Scott at North and Hardwick at Richmond picked their assistants.

What do we do?? Appoint Teague, Lappin, Riley, Montgomery, Bradley and Harvey. Some real coaching success joining a guy with bugger all coaching background to begin with. Combine that with a very young side and club devoid of success for the last 15 years and we expect to be back into the top 4???

FFS!!

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#NewBlues beginning 25th August 2015

The thing that upsets me most of all is watching a string of Carlton losses - that can all be traced back to coaching deficiencies - and then listening to the excuses that grow ever thinner and thinner..

And then floundering around with the same people, making the same mistakes for another season.

Its all a bit depressing - waiting for the slow moving wheels of reality to turn in the minds of the board....

but I as I have said - the second half of the season will be nowehere near as bad as the first.

We will cause a few upsets along the way - and I think that this will just get Ratten over the line in season 2010.

But it will be cold comfort if we dont make the 8.

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My Blue Heaven

One more chance from me.

If he can't get a Carlton team to beat another bogey team in Adelaide, when they've just been knocked off by Melbourne, and now have several key injuries to add to a long list already, then Ratts has lost my support also.

Ratten develops the game plan, he motivates the players, he sets the training program, he provides the reviews and using poor kicking and general poor kills is not an excuse as Ratten and the MC pick the team.

Carlton have proven we play best when it's high intensity, high risk football, we play direct and move the ball fast. Bring it!!

Has he been sacked yet?
WTF are we waiting for!

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C'mon Blueboys!

Like Harvey who once played against Sticks - Boys club
Riley coached with Ratts and Melb - Boys Club
Montgomery played against Ratts - Boys Club

........hang on i am sure Laidley played against Sticks. Surely he is in the Boys Club.

and what were Laidley's tactics. He was an ok coach but couldnt handle zones and Port just copped a flogging from Briz.

What Ratten must do first is make a statement that half arsed efforts by players are not acceptable.
You dont wait till after the Adelaide you do it now and make a statement.
Players have got away with it too long.

Last night's effort was so poor that it Ratten must take a stand
OUT Warnock, Houlihan,Gibbs, Yarran,O'Hailpin, Thornton, McLean
IN Jacobs, Gartlett,White, Kerr, Davies, Hadley,Anderson, Judd

To me these 7 blokes did not put in enough.

It doesnt matter about winning at the moment

Its more about playing hard accountable footy.

There could be 3 or 4 more as well.

There needs a complete change in attitude

Because that was shit Sat night

I don't often agree with you, but you're right with this.

A bit harsh on McLean though, given he was injured.

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

A bit harsh on McLean?

He wants to drop Gibbs.

Sums up where he's at right there.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

I've got no issue with GIBBS being dropped if he's playing unaccountable footy, or is out of form. For too long unaccountable footballers never paid for it.

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And so while others miserably pledge themselves to the pursuit of ambition and brief power, I will be stretched out in the shade, singing.

I thought he did that...


7 definately out..with 4 more possibles?

11 changes...what are you going for...the Guiness Book of Records?

When you look at that list its quite sobering - do any of them have coaching experience at successful clubs? The problem is you have an inexperienced coach who I suppose feels a little insecure. He may not want anyone he might perceive as a threat ie Laidley.

When you expanded on yr post re tactical mentors eg Simon Lloyd it made more sense.

But the question remains, if Ratts isn't a tactical genius, what does he bring to the table? Inspirational leadership?
Unconditional respect?
Fearsome discipline?
Outstanding management skills?
Clear coaching philosophy / game style?
Clarity of purpose?
Teaching skills?
Previous coaching experience at a successful club?

I don't know the answer but I don't know that he ticks many of the above boxes. Most new coaches take time to put their stamp on a club but I wonder if Ratts is still learning about what kind of coach he needs to be.

He started this job in 2007. A senior coach should arrive knowing exactly what he wants to do and how he wants to do it, with the confidence from experience that he can achieve it and how to achieve it.

If he didn't arrive with this knowledge, the decision to appoint him was incorrect.