As much as it pains me to say, can we get back on topic please?

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

Guys, its a bit early to turn into Richmond supporters and start ripping up memberships/spitting on the coach.

Was a poor game today in all areas. Only Yarran/betts had a good game. Rest were poo. And that doesn't have anything to do with a coach.

A coach can only tell the players so much and a lot of tonite was that the players weren't doing the basics well at all. Kicking ball out of bounds 7 times, dropping marks, having troubles picking up a ball off the ground etc. Tonite was just one of those days that even the best players in the team had shockers.

Yeah you will say there is a skills coach blah blah, but the skills tonight were ridiculous. Teams can have great training sessions and come out and play bad on game day.

I'm in two minds about Rattens coaching style. I think it is more due to him being a new coach and not a established coach. Carlton made the finals last year and nearly had a top 4 spot. Ratten so far has a tick for me so far , even though l query a few decisions.

Last thing l want is to get another coach and have the team gutted like Tigers/North Melb and have a couple woeful years.

Have to cut Ratten a bit of slack, he has lost one of the best forwards in the game and has to manufacture a forward line with setanta/hendo as his replacement. Game plan changes will take a while to take effect.

Getting a big name coach is what we did when we got Pagan, so don't think a new coach will fix everything

This is year 3.
Ratten has had enough time now to recruit, teach, weed out, drill a game plan.
IMO we should be looking for other coaching options if things don't improve significantly by round 12.

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Scott, things aren't as happy as they used to be down here at the unemployment office. Joblessness is no longer just for Philosophy majors - useful people are starting to feel the pinch.

The circumstances surrounding Rattens appointment were very different to those that we have now - He was a breath of footballing fresh air for many after the Pagan period - which in some ways was a bit of an autocracy - that did not suit Carlton at all..

Ratten has coaching talents and skills - otherside he wouldnt have got the job. But his shortcomings are also significant too.

These were overlooked - in favour of the fact that he was a person that at the time brought new hope and vision and a management style which was more acceptable to many people..

The ongoing need to manufacture football hope and vision - very much needed to continue the rebuilding Carlton's membership base from the lows of 2002 were also a significant consideration.

Irrespective of his talent and of the personnell that he had at his disposal - Hope and vision in latter days of Pagan were nothing more than cold ashes in a fireplace

The next coach that will be selected will be also driven by these factors to some extent - but because we are at a different point in the player development cycle now - compared to those of a few years back - other coaching talents specific to our needs in 2010 or 2011 - will be a bigger priority.

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My Blue Heaven

I think we should be looking at the forward line coach, more so then just targetting Ratten.

Saints play great defensive footy........would SOS have anything to do with that?
Perhaps we could learn something. Who's our defensive coach...? Montgomery.....may be a nice bloke and all .........but

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I see you watching me watching you.

What a coincidence that even our best players and Ratten have shockers every time we play Essendon*. For mine it goes beyond just 'having one of those days'.

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Premierships: 1869, 1871, 1873, 1874, 1875, 1877, 1887, 1906, 1907, 1908, 1914, 1915, 1938, 1945, 1947, 1968, 1970, 1972, 1979, 1981, 1982, 1987, 1995.

"GIBBS."

Every time we play Essendon* we get screwed by umpires, lose momentum and never recover.

Look at the assistant coaches, not just ratten

The biggest issue for me is we keep making the same mistakes (coaching) and we continue to butcher the ball (that's coaching and players).

How do we fix this? I don't have a simple short term solution for you.

I think we need to make it clear to the players that poor skills will leave you in the Bullants firstly. Secondly we need to act upon this.

The club needs to make it clear we are not just going to automatically renew our favourite son - we must see some improvement. Where is the heart in the team? Don't tell me just because Judd didn't play we suddenly have no guts. There are more serious issues with this team (or culture at the club).

As for an alternative I am not sure. As much as I really do not like him, Laidley is the only one I know of that is available and could take this group somewhere. Can he win a premiership? I don't know.

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The great are great to us only because we are on our knees. Let us arise.
--Robert Collier

Nah its the players fault...sack the lot of them....lets rebuild and give Ratts another 3 years to develop a very clear game plan...

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"Truth, for the tyrants, is the most terrible and cruel of all bindings; it is like an incandescent iron falling across their chests. And it is even more agonizing than hot iron, for that only burns the flesh, while truth burns its way into the soul"     — Lauro Aguirre

Coaches are butchering the ball? Wow.



Who's the 'we' you speak of. The nuff-nuff Carlton supporters?



Carlton isn't interested in Dean Laidley. Laidley needs a blue-collar culture throughout the organisation he is coach of. Carlton doesn't fit and it would be a disaster ala Pagan (which incidently all you nuff-nuffs loved)...Gee I hate nuff-nuffs...no @#$%&! clue about anything.

Yes I have been saying that for a while
Wonder if the doc and Cazz or club 29 will be so against that one this week

Ratten is a dumb coach

doesnt have a feel for the game

doesnt think outside the "norm'
doesnt try anything different

gets the wrong matchups often but doesnt change them in the course of a match

face it peoples the club [REDACTED] up big time by appointing him . The process wasnt thorough enough and that has a lot to do with the fact that he is a mate of sticks and Dog Brown.

It was laughable that Essendon* beat us the same way it beat us the last 5 times run through the corridor
The whole coaching staff should be sacked today in the perfect world

We should be getting better where not

sack sticks and Ratts

I dont think I have been that pissed off as I was last night for a very long time.

Not even that finals loss against Brisbane pissed me of as that performance last night.

Some players need to be dropped.

BTW good debut by Kane Lucas

where?

Thats right deflect the real issues from what we should be discussing

We are in seious trouble
Sinners and I have saying this for a couple of years

Last night brought that all home
The club can either make changes or continue on the same path to the abyss

ok Keogh - let me see if I'm following you. First things first.

You want to sack the coach and his assistants one month into the season. Is this correct? Or are you merely suggesting the board tell Ratten and assistants that if the club doesn't play finals football, their contracts for 2011 will be terminted (and we'll have to pay them out).

Sacking him now has real implications, not only to him as a coach, but what he has been to the club over the years.

Even get a Matthews down there in a mentoring role.

Someone to upskill his coaching, it is getting frustrating, and only round 3.

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Supporting the Blues No Matter What

I and others have have already said that losing Fevola will expose Ratten.

Ratten is only a coach that we collectively experience along the way.

So what is happening now isnt a surprise.

The negative sentiments expressed here will only become worse over the next month.

Instead of just asking the question - I think that the tone will become more proactive - a bit more like a demand.

Thats the usual way that these things pan out when a string of losses dashes previous expectations

Maybe a Sack Ratten thread will be started - like the sack Pagan one a few years beck.

How many pages did that thread run to?

But at least we are now in an even better position to pay contracts out - but on the other hand - the glue that binds long standing friendships together can be very strong - which works in Ratten's Favour

Despite the growing clamour for a sacrifice during the season - This is why I have tended towards either an end of season payout or the non renewal of a contract..

Then theres the issue of when the war starts..

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My Blue Heaven

That's all guesswork dadadadadada.

You are singling out Houla, and he was playing in the same team as Kerna, Braddles, SOS, Ratts, Kouta etc etc iin 2000 as a 20yo. Not a bad effort. So someone could see more in him than you did...and take advantage of the qualities he brought to the table. Perhaps we are trying to make Houla the player he is not. He may just be suited to the forwardline for all we know.

The players should take a good long hard look at themselves.
The coach should be asking who is listening to him from the selected team.

Skills, endevour, commitment, passion...we seem devoid of these qualities this week.
Last week we just left our skills back home.

I mean 'we' as the eam, not just Houla.

There just seems to be a bit of ticker missing.
Yeah I want that to change.
But I don't know why we are having this problem; we shouldn't be.
We should be getting better by the week, especially now that [REDACTED] Fevola is gone.

As Ratts said....it's all a bit embarassing.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Good post BB.

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"It was like calling your ex girlfriend after a night on the booze, just a really bad decision".