We didn't need Mclean because we had Bentick?

That's the equivalent of saying we didn't need Judd because we had Grigg...

I wasn't that aware that AB was still on our list.

The way people are posting, you'd assume that we had traded for Lovett and not Mclean.

We don't need any more youth.

I'm rapt to get Lucas, but draft picks are overrated.

Look at how many were traded last year because the draft was weak.

First round picks were traded for Jolly, Lovett and Mclean.

How often has that happened?

If we hadn't traded for Mclean, we might have picked up Ball to get that inside player we needed.

I'd rather have Mclean who could play for another seven years.

It would be a bit like me giving away a 2001 Land Cruiser for scrap and buying a 2003 for $45K - Why would I? Sure, it's a slightly better model, but only slightly.

Maybe I'd have been better off keeping the 2001 model and buying a convertible with the $45 grand.

I think we, as members, have every right to ask questions about what they are doing when they do it rather than being too smart after the fact.

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yeah and I think its about time we started sacking left right and centre based on preseason form

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

DB, I couldn't give a damn about pre-season. I'm going on what I know of Bentick and what I know of McLean. I don't blame McLean and I won't be holding him responsible in any way ,shape or form.

But let me just say that if this turns out to be a @#$%&! up, I WILL want heads to roll. My gut instinct was that it was a bad move - I'm no expert, so those who get paid hansomely to be experts, should have their arses kicked.

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If.....and that is a big IF.....McLean fails, along with Johnson, then yes heads should roll.
It is obvious that they were selected by those in the know.
That being ex Demons coaches Ratts and Riley.
My opinion is simple: if they can't judge players they've coached and know well, then how can they judge and coach players under their control who they also supposedly know well?

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Would you also include football manager Icke in your sackings if McLean fails?

What I'm saying Rexy is that if 2 Melb players were drafted by their ex coaches to Carlton and they both turn out to be failures, then those or he who lobbied for their selection (I'm assuming it's at least one of the ex coaches Ratts and Riley) well they don't really recognise the talent our team need to move forward, and as a result shouldn't be privy to holding the reigns of the team, given they lack that important something that is required to go forward. Simple.

Was Icke an ex Melb development coach? He may have been.

Look, whoever lobbied for the selection of failures should not be given the opportunity to make those decisions again.
Am I being unfair?

Given you're on my tail Rexy, I'll address the following to you:

If both McLean and Johnson fail, they have cost us a PSD selection and pick 11.
Should the person or persons responsible for their selections be allowed to continue to pick and chose who the club should trade for post 2010? What do you reckon?

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

and what I am saying is why don't we wait until he's played a few games for Carlton.

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This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world - Walsh. Its up there with mad dogs, Englishmen and the midday sun!

Dannyboy is correct of course that McLean should be given an opportunity before threats of mass sackings are spewed out.

It would seem obvious that Ratts and Riley had major input into the recruitment of McLean but when talking about who's responsible if McLean doesn't perform to expectations then Icke as Football Operations Manager must also take a large share of the responsibility as recruitment and list management is a major component of his portfolio I presume.

There will always been hits and misses with recruitment. When it comes to sacking or retaining those responsible for list management one needs to assess their total record of hits and misses.
I've been happy with most of the additions to our list over the last 5 years. Yes there were mistakes such as Ackland, but I'm still willing to give Johnson a further opportunity as he's still young as well as McLean.

I just can't believe how bad McLean is... woeful, woeful, woeful. Worst player in the comp. Worst player in the history of the CFC. In the annals of of Carlton there's just going to be a footnote under his name that says 'woeful'.

On the flipside though, there won't be a single mention in the annals of the Carlton Football Club for 99 of the 100 people who are bagging him on this site.

I'm with Dannyboy and Rexy. Rome wan't built in a day and all that. Give McLean a chance in the real stuff for awhile. If he doesn't perform then questions can be asked of Ratts/Riley/Icke. Whoever heard of monstering a player based on pre season form? Except on TC that is.

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"Get ready, Teddy - you're on": Ron Barassi half time 1970 Grand Final

I think you're missing my point guys, I agree that McLean needs to show what he can do in a real game, I'm not being critical of him as a footballer or as a person, but my first response to recruiting him was 'Why?' .

Why give up pick 11 for a type of player we already had and weren't playing because he didn't suit our game plan?

Time will tell and he could well turn out to be the difference between finals, and grand final victory - I'll be as happy as you guys if that's the case.

But, if he turns out to deliver very little and Talia stars for the Crows I'll be @#$%&! furious.

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I have a big party weekend happening and that started last night.
The first to arrive was a Demons supporter. He thinks Brock still has a lot to offer the Blues, and injury had interupted his last 2 seasons, but he's still oung and talented.

I was rapt we got McLean for the in and under role, and still hope he will improve starting round 1.

I do think that there will be some serious questions raised if both Johnson and McLean fail. It's unCarlton like not to.

I'm not too fussed about the selections of McLean and Johnson because I'm focussing on us reaching the top 4 with or without them, such is my confidence in the list.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

IMO McLean is a better in and under player than Bentick whereas Bentick is a tackling machine.

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"One of my favorite philosophical tenets is that people will agree with you only if they already agree with you. You do not change people's minds." - Frank Zappa

I thought we were supposed to support the players and not be ferals like Fevola claimed?

People whine about Talking Players being closed, yet I can see why it was shut after just five minutes.

Chicken littles want to criticise players like it's their role to keep Carlton accountable like a government.

I don't think Bentick is as close to McLean as you believe Duke. If he was another club would have surely drafted him.

We traded for him to help free Judd up, which is crucial, Bentick wasn't up to it and Hadley struggling to get out there.

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"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent." Qui-Gon Jinn 15-05-2005

"there’s more chance of me becoming the full forward for the [Western Bulldogs] than there is of any change in the Labor Party." Julia Gillard 18-05-2010

The general concensus on the Demonland/ology forums is that McLean's last two/three years have been utter garbage, and his pre-season form at Carlton has been a continuation of his last few years at Melbourne. The point of contention is whether his situation is redeemable, i.e. can he recapture his 2006 form? My tentative thought is 'no', but it remains to be seen really. If he is able to, then Carlton will be very pleased with the results, and there's no doubt in my mind that he's a better player than Bentick at his best. At his worst? ...

On Chris Johnson, I couldn't see him out the door fast enough. The guy is just no good, there's not much more to it than that.

Gosh. How bad are Melbourne then if McLean managed second in the B&F in 2008?

We should have picked Dale Thomas.

Our premiership window is flowered now.

Sack everyone.
Offer Talia $1 million.
Do it now before it's too late!!!!

Sour grapes ....perhaps? Of course the general consensus is we can do without him!!

Hads form before going down with a broken arm was exactly what the blues needed last year, and made us a much more balanced side, if Mclean and Hads can compete for that spot or bring some necessary depth to that role then it is all the better!!

Mclean really should be given plenty of time to get used to the role within a new team and get some injury free game time before we turn all Richmond on him