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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 12:52 pm 
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Robert Walls
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Posts: 3996
Location: Steven Seagal's Martial Arts Academy
Fire Ratten.
Make Bentick captain.
Put Brock at CHF.
Rip up your membership.

Problem solved
:lol:


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 1:01 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 2:01 pm
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I've seen a bit of Brock pre-season and what disappoints me are his foot skills.

Pick 5, touted as a future Dees captain, yet his kicking and general disposal (a few loopy handballs v Crows) have been very average.

Please, someone tell me they watched him closely at the Dees and things will turn around.


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 1:20 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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beowulf wrote:
Adam Bentick:
[1] a real leader on and off the field (Kernahan called him 'a future captain of the club'.
[2] tough, inside player who gathered a huge number of tackles.
[3] Didn't get a lot of clearances.
[4] had issues with his disposal by foot.
[5] Always gave you a contest.
[6] was very aware of his strengths and weaknesses, hence his effort at becoming a tackling machine.
[7] Not over endowed in the pace department.

Brock McLean:
[1] a real leader on and off the field (was expected to be a future Captain of Melbourne).
[2] tough, inside player who egst where the ball is.
[3] Can get his share of clearances.
[4] Has some issues with his disposal by foot. He has some very bad days when it just doesn't work. He generally kicks few goals and more points, although he rarely gets shots from right in front.
[5] Usually gives you a contest: until the Swans game, I'd never seen him go through a game with so little impact. Hopefully it is a one off.

[6] I'm not quiter sure that Brock is as aware of his issues as Benchy was. Benchy came up through the rookie list and was aware from the start of his relative standing. he did what he could. I haven't seen the same thing yet from Brock, although I hope to. Brock seems to have lost a little faith in his body, and while he is fine running around Visy Park, running around in a game is not the same and he seems to be reacting accordingly.
[7] Speed: Brock was ALWAYS quicker than Benchy, from their earliest days at the Cannons. However, it would be hard to say that at the moment. Brock's pace has been really down and it doesn't look to be improving. He really needs to work on this if he is to make the impact he should make.

Benchy didn't have a lot of really top games, but he did have at least 3 when he had 35+ possessions. He was ALWAYS serviceable. Brock has layed more better football, but he has also had some lows. His better footy has been at least a year in the past - he was ordinary at Melbourne in 2009.
On present form there wouldn't be much between them. Hopefully Brock can step up and make a real impact for us. But at the moment we are right to be worried.


Thanks beowulf good post. :smile:


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 1:24 pm 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:14 pm
Posts: 5991
Location: Melbourne
I am concerned, but will wait until the real stuff before making a judgement.


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 1:45 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25309
Location: Bondi Beach
beowulf wrote:
Adam Bentick:


[6] I'm not quiter sure that Brock is as aware of his issues as Benchy was. Benchy came up through the rookie list and was aware from the start of his relative standing. he did what he could. I haven't seen the same thing yet from Brock, although I hope to. Brock seems to have lost a little faith in his body, and while he is fine running around Visy Park, running around in a game is not the same and he seems to be reacting accordingly.
........ But at the moment we are right to be worried.


Great post beowulf.

I have no doubt that Brock is not playing anywhere near our expectations. If Brock is out of form...or continuing his 2009 form, then he is not ready for the first 22 imo. It's time now for him to realise what his relative standing is.

If it's true that Broc's lack of in and under support left Judd as the battering ram against the Crows then....drop Brock for round 1.
Who cares if we paid too much for him...we'll be paying more if this bloke is out of form and playing in the seniors.

I only saw him at the Swans and wasn't blown away by him at the training session I saw like others were.

Sure I was in favour of the decision to trade for him, but I trusted the MC...I don't trust them as much as others do despite the fact that I gave them the benefit of the doubt with the failed Johnson PSD selection. I fear the MC will play Brock whether he's in form or outa form to save face. That's what I'm fearful of. Last year Ratts and the MC showed courage to drop Scotto, Houla and Stevens for periods of time.

I wonder if common sense will prevail in 2010?

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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 2:05 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2006 6:54 pm
Posts: 14686
Location: The Vodka Train
Blues Clues wrote:
I've seen a bit of Brock pre-season and what disappoints me are his foot skills.

Pick 5, touted as a future Dees captain, yet his kicking and general disposal (a few loopy handballs v Crows) have been very average.

Please, someone tell me they watched him closely at the Dees and things will turn around.


.. ..best mate is a Dee's tragic so i watch a fair few of their games, and i can honestly say that i haven't seen Brock play as poorly as he has recently.. ..yes, his '06 form was great, and yes that was a while ago.. ..last season he was average, but was playing unfit/injured and honestly once the Dee's went chasing their PP you can't really judge their team/players honestly.. ..his '08 form was pretty good, so i reckon he should come good season proper, and give us what we need.. ..but i ain't no prophet, so don't quote me..

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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:26 pm 
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formerly Fevola

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 1:57 pm
Posts: 4773
Thats what I reckon.

I have never seen Brock play so badly as he has this pre-season with us.

Hope he changes in the season proper.

He has been so slow and flat footed all pre-season games. Just watching players run past him.


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 9:10 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25309
Location: Bondi Beach
Drewgirl wrote:
Thats what I reckon.

I have never seen Brock play so badly as he has this pre-season with us.

Hope he changes in the season proper.

He has been so slow and flat footed all pre-season games. Just watching players run past him.


So do we allow him to find senior form in the Ants till mid season?

If he's outa form he's outa form. It's OK imo, whilst we have Hadley, Joseph, Carrazzo, Scotland with hard and tough bodies to extract (to free up Judd).

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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:40 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Brock looks like he's a darn sight bigger in the upper body than most of the Carlton players. This is good for tackling and wrenching the ball out of opponents hands, but not so good for foot speed. You can't expect someone with that body shape to play like Simmo, give the guy a chance.


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:16 am 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2006 6:54 pm
Posts: 14686
Location: The Vodka Train
Stone Free wrote:
Brock looks like he's a darn sight bigger in the upper body than most of the Carlton players. This is good for tackling and wrenching the ball out of opponents hands, but not so good for foot speed. You can't expect someone with that body shape to play like Simmo, give the guy a chance.


..agreed, his quite strong.. ..and he's got genuine hardness/mongrel in him which we need, cos we can tend towards bein' a little soft at times.. ..courtesy of playing so many kids over the years.. ..the team's getting stronger, but having players like Brock and Walks in the team will bring back some beef..

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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:27 am 
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Horrie Clover

Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 366
[GoogleVideo][/GoogleVideo]

No problem with getting his type into our line up, but we paid over the odds. Shane Tuck would have cost 1/3rd as much for the same, if not better output. You win some, you lose some.


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:59 am 
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Laurie Kerr

Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 5:58 pm
Posts: 133
pinnell wrote:
[GoogleVideo][/GoogleVideo]

No problem with getting his type into our line up, but we paid over the odds. Shane Tuck would have cost 1/3rd as much for the same, if not better output. You win some, you lose some.



Daniel Harris who i rate as a pure stoppage / pack footballer was also available for nothing. Given we got Brock for a very niche role, could we have given up a much later pick for someone else (i.e. these 2) to do a similar job? Wont know until the real stuff starts.


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 12:49 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Sun Dec 23, 2007 11:51 am
Posts: 1291
Unfortunately Brock turned up to a function/venue early Saturday night in an obviously inebriated state. Prior to 11pm (within an hour of arriving) he was escorted out by security. During his short stay, he generally made an ass of himself. Very embarrassing and extremely disappointing, especially with everything that has gone on during this pre-season. :mad:


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:10 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 25309
Location: Bondi Beach
ColourMan wrote:
Unfortunately Brock turned up to a function/venue early Saturday night in an obviously inebriated state. Prior to 11pm (within an hour of arriving) he was escorted out by security. During his short stay, he generally made an ass of himself. Very embarrassing and extremely disappointing, especially with everything that has gone on during this pre-season. :mad:


:oops:

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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:32 pm 
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Bert Deacon
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Location: A Fevola punt from TEAC oval.
Seen him live vs Adelaide and Brissie, watched the Swans game ... IMO on form he doesn't deserve a spot in the 22 come Rnd 1. Give me Hads ahead of Brock at this stage.

A change in culture and game style to get used to, let's hope he comes right over the season.

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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:06 pm 
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Adrian Gallagher

Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:01 pm
Posts: 57
LosAzules wrote:
Seen him live vs Adelaide and Brissie, watched the Swans game ... IMO on form he doesn't deserve a spot in the 22 come Rnd 1. Give me Hads ahead of Brock at this stage.

A change in culture and game style to get used to, let's hope he comes right over the season.

What does "change in culture" mean for McLean?

Give me Hads any time!


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 8:11 pm 
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formerly King Kenny
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McLean's best is far superior to anything Bentick could ever offer and that goes for Hadley as well.

Whether he gets back to his best is the question to ask.


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:24 am 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2006 5:24 pm
Posts: 1531
Location: Melbourne
What a bloody insult

Comparing McLean to Bentick.

Everyone has bad patches in games. Brock is probably going thru a bad patch in pre season

Yes it is preseason!!!! Before the season STARTS!!!!! When players are generally out of form.

Yes there is huge expectations on him coming from Melbourne, but everyone can have a bad patch or be trying a new kicking technique or have issues adjusting to a new gameplan.

People, get off his case, judge him in round 10 onwards.

Yes he is slow but so are a lot of other good players and you always look slow when u dont have the ball.
Anyone remember the slowest player in the early nineties? Yea Greg Williams. The game isn't any quicker in the packs. Diesal would still dominate today.


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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:18 am 
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Bruce Doull
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All I can do is look at what the club does and form an opinion based on what I know. It's my beliefe, and always has been, that we paid far too much for McLean given we already had Bentick. The two players are too similar and you wouldn't need 2 of them.

We could have traded Fev as we did and had picks 11 and 12. To me, that would have been a far better outcome.

I hope BM plays 22+games this season and contributes, but at this point, I don't see the value.

To be well worth the trade, BM will have to give us 20+ disposals and lay 6 tackles per game AND kick a goal per game. I'm hoping he can, but doubt he will.

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 Post subject: Re: McLean v Bentick
PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:12 am 
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Bert Deacon
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I think the coaching staff are well aware that Brock's lack of pace could be an issue and i think Ratten sums it up well in the Q&A article with this response in regards to BM:

"I think the balance around him is very critical. How we can let him play to his strengths and let players around him assist him in his role. He'll help us win the inside footy - there's no doubt about that."

The comment has me thinking that the focus will be on the other midfielders in our team to ensure that Brock doesn't get burnt by his opponent. I have no doubt he will help at the stoppages, the question for me is more to do with how effective he will be around the ground in open play and how much of an influence his opponent will have in open play.

I am yet to form an opinion on whether the trade for BM was wise or not, on paper it looked good but his form pre-season has not been that great (maybe I just had a higher expectation/opinion of him), so I'll leave it until mid-season to see how he goes in the real games before I start condeming or praising the trade.

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