I haven't seen enough of McLean to compare but from what I've read they both seem pretty similar players.

Good in and under but slow in leg speed.

Can those a bit more learned on McLean illustrate the differences (if any) that separate them both and whether or not pick 11 was a good deal or a bit over the odds for McLean.

Was pick 11 worth it? When McLean has a premiership medallion around his neck then it was worth it.

You wouldn't pick him if you thought he wouldn't be part of our next premiership.

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Delulio is a member of TISM

Hasnt eactly set the world on fire in any of the pre season games...

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Well pick 11 would have been Lucas had we retained it, and Pick 12 may have been a guy like Jetta, Pittard, Gysberts or Howard, so there's a guide as to what pick 11 was roughly worth.

He does look a bit flat-footed but so do a lot of players this time of year, so I'm not going to judge that just yet. He brings more strength at the contest and better skills than Bentick. Seems to apply more pressure at stoppages than Bentick ever did. Bentick was very much a stoppage negator, to the point where he began to negate our own stoppages. Had a lot of heart, but certainly wasn't as polished as Brock is.

We need to ensure we use Brock in general play because he uses the ball well, but there may be the odd issue of him being burned by his opposite number. Having said that I wouldn't label guys like Black, Mitchell, Bolton & Cross as express either. It's important that he marks these types directly in tight situations.

The important thing to remember is where would we be in stoppage situations without him. We'd have Hadley, then daylight, with the real possibility Hadley could break down at any time.

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I hope the same people who are bagging Brock are not the same people who were frustrated that we were using Judd as our clearance player last year, or the ones who reckoned we weren't hard enough at the contest.

I haven't seen anything other than the Swans game - but Brock will be fine. What he requires is a gameplan that makes the most of his strengths (hardball clearance player) and minimises his weaknesses (lack of pace). None of the blokes around the league that play his sort of role (Sewell, Mitchell, Black, Ball, Hayes, etc) are quick either. So why do they look so good? Because they have plans which take advantage of their ball winning ability and compensate for their lack of pace. The players in these teams are often cited around here as being the difference between us and them when we lose. How many times have I heard that we lost a game because we were useless in traffic? That we didn't have a defensive player who could make a tackle stick? That we didn't have someone who could do the grunt work? McLean is the player that should help us compete with the Hawthorns, St Kildas and Collingwoods. We just require a gameplan that takes full advantage of his abilities.

Brock McLean can play. Just relax.

I'm content with the trade but he needs to get the spikes on and do some training over 10 metres. Lacks any form of explosive pace whatsoever.
He also seems to be unsure of his place within the team. It wouldn't be easy walking into another club after 8 years at Melbourne.
I'm more than happy to give him plenty of time.

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Looking forward to seeing our potential realised.

Good post BV I think he is still feeling his way in the side and knowing team mates and them knowing his strengths Yesterday in third grappling in the pack eventually flipped out a handball -his Carlton mate missed it or wasn't expecting his strength to wrench the ball out and eventually Adelaide snaffled it
Did a lot of heavy work in packs yesterday and if he protects to some extent Judd Murph and Gibbs in the season proper then half of the job done
Agree looks a little slow but is still learning our sides strengths and weaknesses -will do better in regular season -hope he plays a blinder in round one.

Good points Molly and BV.

I was rapt we drafted Brock, bacause when Hadley broke his arm, there was no one left for the tough stuff in and under.

Then his preseason running form took me by surprise ans I was ecstatic we got him.

Then I saw him against the Swans and I thought he looked slow and loose defensively...paid no respect for his opponent. Since then there hasn't been too many positives....I live in hope.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

Adam Bentick:
[1] a real leader on and off the field (Kernahan called him 'a future captain of the club'.
[2] tough, inside player who gathered a huge number of tackles.
[3] Didn't get a lot of clearances.
[4] had issues with his disposal by foot.
[5] Always gave you a contest.
[6] was very aware of his strengths and weaknesses, hence his effort at becoming a tackling machine.
[7] Not over endowed in the pace department.

Brock McLean:
[1] a real leader on and off the field (was expected to be a future Captain of Melbourne).
[2] tough, inside player who egst where the ball is.
[3] Can get his share of clearances.
[4] Has some issues with his disposal by foot. He has some very bad days when it just doesn't work. He generally kicks few goals and more points, although he rarely gets shots from right in front.
[5] Usually gives you a contest: until the Swans game, I'd never seen him go through a game with so little impact. Hopefully it is a one off.

[6] I'm not quiter sure that Brock is as aware of his issues as Benchy was. Benchy came up through the rookie list and was aware from the start of his relative standing. he did what he could. I haven't seen the same thing yet from Brock, although I hope to. Brock seems to have lost a little faith in his body, and while he is fine running around Visy Park, running around in a game is not the same and he seems to be reacting accordingly.
[7] Speed: Brock was ALWAYS quicker than Benchy, from their earliest days at the Cannons. However, it would be hard to say that at the moment. Brock's pace has been really down and it doesn't look to be improving. He really needs to work on this if he is to make the impact he should make.

Benchy didn't have a lot of really top games, but he did have at least 3 when he had 35+ possessions. He was ALWAYS serviceable. Brock has layed more better football, but he has also had some lows. His better footy has been at least a year in the past - he was ordinary at Melbourne in 2009.
On present form there wouldn't be much between them. Hopefully Brock can step up and make a real impact for us. But at the moment we are right to be worried.

well thats a relief, Ratten picked him coz he thought he'd be good!

Pick 11 isn't pick 57. If Mclean is no better than Hadley, there will be repercussions. Ratten made the call, now he has to make it work.

We wait in hope and wish Brock and Ratts all the best.

http://www.talkingcarlton.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=26198&p=959302

Jaysus. Hurry up Rd 1. Seriously.

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I think they were quite good mates from the same junior club - Maybe Aberfeldie?

It remains to be seen how good McLean will be however I'm pretty sure he will be better than Hulme, McCormick, Brett Johnson, Bentick and Bentley.
Since Ratten buggered his elbow in Rd 22 2001 we haven't had a half decent inside grunt midfielder.

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Forgive my ignorance but does Hadley have a premiership? Also had he not done a knee possibly have more than one? FFS give the bloke a chance. We shaould follor the Dogs lead and play in NZ - with the amount of sheep we attract our membership tally will be unsurmountab le

Your confused ? I am confused on why we would be questioning McLean when he hasn't played a senior game yet for the navy blue.

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Delulio is a member of TISM

I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that Hadley played in a premiership in his first year. Possibly only his 5th AFL game even.

Correct.

I hope Brock succeeds but we definitely paid well over the odds; Icke unsuccessfully tried to renegotiate the deal after it had been agreed to! I have seen all of Carlton's games in Melb and Brock's disposal has been average at best and diabolical at times. For a team that craves more speed and especially skill, Brock provides neither. Winning time trials doesn't disguise this! Other players mentioned as slow such as Mitchell, Hayes etc have good evasive skills, reasonable acceleration and superior skills when compared to Brock! Disappointingly, Juddy was still a battering ram in congested situations against the Crows on Friday!

Of course we overpaid, no other team would have provided a top 20 pick for a player that didn't finish in the top ten of the B & F of the bottom team! The game has changed significantly to Brock's detriment, since the last time he made a meaningful contribution in an important game (Sep 2006). At this early stage, Luke Ball has provided much better value at pick 30 after a very reasonable 2009 GF performance. I really do hope Brock proves me wrong!