Hello all,

I went to the romp against GWS at Manuka the other week and was struck with the 'local' feel of the game. When the laughing about a professional side playing a bunch of kids subsides....

While those in the crowd wearing team merchandise was overwhelmingly Carlton, there was an obvious relationship between the crowd and the GWS team. I am not sure how many kids playing for GWS are Canberra based, but there were definitely a few. There were plenty calling out to mates playing for GWS. There were heaps of kids still wearing their shorts from playing footy locally for teams like Eastlake (my old mob!) or Belconnen. It seemed that these kids could and maybe do realistically dream of getting picked up by GWS. Given the article below Sheedy has an admitted plan to foster a relationship with ACT AFL. There is a connection between the local junior clubs, to the ground (Eastlake plays about 500m away), and the team.
http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news...0203-ndf7.html

In contrast, I don't feel any of this emotion when attending a Carlton game in Melbourne. There is no relationship between the junior clubs our boys play for, the club, or the ground. I acknoweldge that we may never get back to Princes Park (or optus or visy etc etc) but will it ever be possible for us to grow this feeling at Etihad/MCG? Maybe we just need to make the most of opportunities to play practice games etc and hold club events at PP.

Comments?

By the way, this must be the first time my team was 150 points up and I STILL managed to feel jealous of the other mob!!!!

The scenario will change for the GWS in a few years once they've been in the current drafting system where you can get kids from everywhere.

It would be a massive cost and a huge resource to develop a reletionship between our current list and their junior clubs. Just about half of the Carlton team are from interstate, and I dare say we'd be lucky to have a handful of blokes form the "Carlton" area.

I'd love Carlton to establish official links with Glenelg and say Swan Districts in which we have 6 kids playing for us, and let those clubs use the resources that Carlton have, but with the SANFL and the WAFL around it'll never happen.

That's one thing I love about the SANFL, is the "feel" of supporting a local team, standing on the hill, the chatting to the lads after the game whilst having a beer.

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Go to http://www.snoutslouts.org/ for a look at the mighty GFC...

Yep, they feel pretty soulless don't they? I don't know what the club can do to improve that, maybe seating arrangements could be tweaked? We could paint the centre square, and 50m arcs Navy Blue every home game.

Going back to PP isn't an option, but I think you've hit on it in your last sentence. Practice games, club events, open training sessions, and club encouragement for us to get along to these things. The Bullants play 5 games at PP this season; the club could throw out an open invitation to members, and really make events out of them.

This is probably for another thread, however your feelings do seem to be part of common theme of disconnect between Carlton FC, and it's members/fans.

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I AM DISENFRANCHISED

With ground rationalisation a few years ago all clubs basically lost this feel for the suburban club with the exception of Geelong, Melbourne and possibly Richmond. I grew up in Carlton and all my brothers and sisters are Carlton supporters this despite mum follwoing the Pies and dad the Roos. Dad nearly got me and the younger brother over to the Roos, but my older brother intervened thankfully and we all support the Blues.

I think the new generation wont know any different, they will just come to accept that there are only two grounds in Melbourne and one in Geelong period. I also think that where you heartland supporters once were i.e. your recruiting zone has diminished and its open slather to whose flavour of the month. What i mean is that Brunswick, Coburg, Fawkner etc were diehard Carlton zones, but you will find most clubs have supporters in these areas. I live out in the western suburbs these days, its not only Bulldogs supporters out here, you see most clubs being represented and the Blues have a fair few out this way too.

Thats why its important to be competing year in and year out as a competitive team, our brand has been tarnished somewhat by our poor performances over the last 9 years and you'd imagine that we have lost thousands upon thousands of potential supporters. unless they have strong parenst who direct young kids to follow the teams they support, they will go with who is winning a lot of games, prime time TV, have high profiles and players who have high profile and media saturation.

When we weren't winning flags in the 70's and 80's we were playing in the finals most times and had household names like Jezza, Doull, Southby, Harmes, Johnston etc. This is wheer we need to get back to so we can build up our following again. The Pies and Bombers have been good of this over the last 10 years and theri membership reflects this.

PS - I also agree wholeheartedly about club functions, bullant games, practice matches etc being held at PP - its a real nice feel to go back there (even with the Heatley and Harris stands missing).

Personally I don't feel a strong connect with my local footy team, which is Starthmore but I have been to a few games and it definitely is a strong community feel.

I think suburban clubs are there for those who want to feel part of that sort of belonging.

I prefer my Blues really.

I grew up in Coburg so Carlton was my local VFL team and obviously Coburg in the VFA. Their Tiger allegiance has killed that. There was definitely a local feel for me at Princes Park that isnt there at MCG/ES and it never will.

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T E A M

Its really time for my "Northern Blues" proposal to get a run.

A stand alone "Northern Blues" team based at Princes Park - playing in the VFL is a no brainer and if the AFL go ahead with abolishing the Rookies and expanding the lists to 46 then its all the more reason for us to run a stand alone side.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

I agree aggers.....I REALLY miss the ressies in the CFC guernsey.

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No ones listening till you make a mistake.

I think the AFL would be foolish to ignore the positive aspects of "grass roots" footy.

The ground rationalisation, like many things, seemed like and may well have been a great idea at the time. Clubs had no money, the league was fearful of rival codes etc.

This is no longer the case. I've been to ES and as an interstate visitor it was the most uninviting and sterile venue I have ever been to for a football match. It was even worse than Waverley.

If I was a marketing professional who's abilities were being judged on memberships etc, i'd take on any club apart from those who play home games at ES, The MCG is a fantastic selling point.

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I hope Essendon* folds.

..having our own ressies team, with PP as our home ground [obviously] would in my opinion go a long way towards growing supporters/members.. ..watching the young recruits run around in navy-blue, with the family feel of PP [especially compared to larger stadiums] will make for an attractive afternoon out.. ..there's plenty of times when either the seniors are interstate, or playing maybe a night game where it's not always easy to attend [especially for young faimilies].. ..having a back-up match to attend where the blues are still playing is a great idea..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

And adding this little chestnut as well:

3 of the last 4 AFL Premierships have been won by AFL sides with stand alone VFL teams.

Watch the groundswell of support for this concept to grow.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

I tend to agree with much of the sentiment here, the fact remains, though, the game has gone national but most Melbourne clubs are still hanging on to a suburban culture. The footy industry is very inward looking, especially so in Melbourne.

Carlton needs to embrace the national concept more directly and with any luck this should translate into membership sales and the like.

I think working hard to keep a genuine connection to PP is a great idea, but that doesn't mean the club cannot look well beyond it's current horizons to connect with its fans.

It's never going to be like it was back in the 70s/80s and prior, so best to make the most of the club's proud history while adapting to a new model for capturing support.

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I reckon a stand alone reserves team would be a great way to keep in touch with the old time suburban feel. DO IT!!!

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At least Waverly felt like a suburban ground, haha.

I agree that ES and to a lesser extent MCG are sterile these days, but I have to say, as someone who only gets to a couple of games a year I reckon Etihad is actually a great venue to access and to watch footy at (previous mentioned atmosphere issues aside).

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A stand alone reserves team would probably be the best for the Blues, but i'd feel sorry for the Northern Bullants. Being an old VFA person, I'd hate to see another team fold for good like my old team Prahran.

The only problem I can see with a VFL side is where you get the extra players from? I don't know the story with Geelong and Collingwood - are they allowed to have blokes on the books who are signed to their 'VFL' side? Or do they have to get top up players from the local league in each week?

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The only way for some people to understand is for them to be on the receiving end

Left wing moralists
In self serving denial
They shit me no end

..i don't think the cats have a fully fledged stand alone ressies team, but i think that have a bit more influence/input into their ressies team that what is standard for vfl/afl affliates.. ..in regards to the pies, no idea where they get their top-ups from.. ..i guess they'd have 2 books.. ..pies afl senior team/rookies.. ..and then their vfl books..

..quick question, is there salary caps for vfl teams..?.. ..if there isn't, and if afl clubs get their own ressies, i can see possible ways around salary caps..

..can see older stars on their last contract being 'promised' a year after retirement in their vfl side on top coin, a sneaky back-ended type contract..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

IIRC

The VFL cap is set at $300 k.

SANFL 400 k.

The SANFL is decreasing their to $350 k, and also bringing in an import rule in the next season or two.

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Go to http://www.snoutslouts.org/ for a look at the mighty GFC...

Blokes signed.

A reserve league might kill off opportunities for the next Curnow/Barlow/Pods though. That's the flip-side.

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29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.

Really? I know a guy who played with the Collingwood VFL team last year because they were short for a particular game, got a phone call late Friday night to see if he was interested in playing in the VFL team the following day. He never signed anything with Collingwood.

They have a VFL list, but there are definitely ring-ins.

http://www.collingwoodfc.com.au/VFL/VFL ... fault.aspx

There's last year's list.

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29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.