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Who should coach us next year?
Brad Scott 16%  16%  [ 16 ]
Michael Voss 20%  20%  [ 19 ]
Mark Williams 11%  11%  [ 11 ]
Don Pyke 22%  22%  [ 21 ]
Danny Daly 1%  1%  [ 1 ]
Scott Burns 1%  1%  [ 1 ]
Giansiracusa 5%  5%  [ 5 ]
Jaymie Graham 3%  3%  [ 3 ]
Adam Kingsley 16%  16%  [ 16 ]
Adam Yze 3%  3%  [ 3 ]
Nigel Lappin 1%  1%  [ 1 ]
Jarrad Schofield 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Steven King 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Total votes : 97
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:06 am 
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Craig Bradley
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:55 pm
Posts: 6363
Walsh wrote:
Sidefx wrote:
Walsh wrote:
Sidefx wrote:
Walsh wrote:
Pretty much I spent four years as a teen in a youth system in Europe and spent seven year with European club in my mid 20s - mainly in Italy (Serie D + C), Greece (Division B) and Campionnat National in France which is third division. I'm now a qualified Sports Scientist and Data Analyst - I can get a job in any European club if I want to and money spent with these clubs in line with AFL clubs. What I see from the Blues is a complete and utter headtwister. I can't believe these people take themselves seriously

Firstly, congratulations.
Personally I don't really rate soccer (not physical enough for me), however I do appreciate that it's an elite sport with a lot of competition and you seem to have done well. And I'm sure you've been exposed to all sorts of coaching and culture and believe in what you have been exposed to regarding that sport.
The part that confuses me is your qualifications.
Being both a scientist and data analyst you should defiantly understand the need to not only back your points with hard data but facts also, something you literally never do.
This makes pretty much everything you say have little to zero value, especially to someone like myself who appreciates some good old fashioned numbers.
And you seem to have no experience in boards or at board level which is clear by your views on our board, yet you keep trying to tell us we need more footballers.

Seeing as though you are looking to get involved with the club at some level, it would be great if you could provide some data and facts to back your opinions so I can take your points a little more seriously. Because the only thing I can agree on with you at the moment, is that we are light in the middle and the "old" board made some bad decisions, like the appointment of Teague in the first place.


With that sort of post and slight to it - I have nothing more to say to you. In Europe people would be laughing at this club endlessly. It seems the media is already doing that.

Righto Walsh, I didn't see my post as being slight at all, I though I was being quite direct in my opinions.
I guess asking for real evidence to back up some of your outlandish posts was a little too much. :thumbsup:


Back up what post - you immediately turned it personal. This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world.

No Walsh, you did. I simply asked a question based on a statement you made inferring you had more knowledge than the rest of us and the whole club in high performance culture.
I then commended you for your achievements and proceeded to point out the anomaly you presented with your apparent skillset and what you post.
I also asked for you to deliver more "facts" and "data" rather than continually posting the same drivel ad nauseam to help me understand and possibly see some reason in your posts.
The fact you are being so defensive when asked this, brings up even more red flags.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:08 am 
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Craig Bradley
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Cazzesman wrote:
Walsh wrote:
Back up what post - you immediately turned it personal. This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world.


He's got you there Sidefx. :yikes: Apparently they never have media mud slinging, team managers fighting on the sidelines, fake fouls, fans killing players, mass internet trolling or large fan fights inside and outside the stadiums in Europe.

I guess they are all to busy drinking tea with their pinky sticking out. :lol: :lol:

Walshy do you not think we read the papers and see the sports TV news articles on European sports.

Regards Cazzesman

I've been done by the elite once again.
:lol: :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:10 am 
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Cazzesman wrote:
Walsh wrote:
Back up what post - you immediately turned it personal. This type of slight is alien in the more cultured part of the world.


He's got you there Sidefx. :yikes: Apparently they never have media mud slinging, team managers fighting on the sidelines, fake fouls, fans killing players, mass internet trolling or large fan fights inside and outside the stadiums in Europe.

I guess they are all to busy drinking tea with their pinky sticking out. :lol: :lol:

Walshy do you not think we read the papers and see the sports TV news articles on European sports.

Regards Cazzesman


I am not referring to fans - they are by far more clannish over there and by far more passionate, fans have absolute no money and travel around the country just to watch their team - they are not part of the club they are the club - it's alittle bit different . I am referring to elite high performance organisations. Carlton is lacking as the fish rots from the head.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:12 am 
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Rod Ashman
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Cazzesman wrote:
Camel,

Any chance we can divert some of the money from the sponsorship drive and buy Mr Walsh a one way ticket to Europe. His love of the 'Great Game' knows no bounds and with his apparent skill set, he would provide an immediate boost to any statistician team.

Just a thought. :wink:

Win, win for all. :thumbsup:

Regards Cazzesman


Or send the rest of us to Europe. :smoking: To escape!

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:31 am 
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Rod Ashman
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CFC8795 wrote:
Cazzesman wrote:
Camel,

Any chance we can divert some of the money from the sponsorship drive and buy Mr Walsh a one way ticket to Europe. His love of the 'Great Game' knows no bounds and with his apparent skill set, he would provide an immediate boost to any statistician team.

Just a thought. :wink:

Win, win for all. :thumbsup:

Regards Cazzesman


Or send the rest of us to Europe. :smoking: To escape!

Might get to see Clarko while you are there.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:35 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24756
Location: Bondi Beach
Walsh wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
Walsh wrote:
Juddy&theKruezers wrote:
Walsh wrote:

Doesn't deserve this club you are probably right - Sammy will have his third coach and you are happy about whats happening at the club? You are too easily pleased.

Teague got the absolute best out of him any chance next coach will as well?

Wtf ? … bro really :lol:


Teague has two AA's and a Coleman medalist in one year under his belt.

You can blame his game plan which I accept but developing youngsters that are high performance personalities and right attitude. He has smashed it out of the ball park.

Weitering was good as gone but won B&F last year people were calling him to be traded in 2019 or have people forgotten? This board was calling H to be traded or have we forgotten?

Stocker, Jack, Kemp, Carrol are coming along nicely. Those that dont have a high performance mindset will never come on and be good players. SO yeah you can say he only focussed on those that are worth focussing on and developed young leaders.


Can't agree with that Walshy.

Walsh is self driven.
Weitering developed over the years and has a breakthrough year in Teague's first year...didn't happen overnight.
Harry had all the ball directed to him because Charlie was out, Levi a decoy on one leg, Jack and Gov injured most games..he was the sole target, and at 203cm and all that ball headed his way...I don't think Teague can take any credit for that.

Stocker...bashed his way into the team because Teague wouldn't play him till his 44 possession game. Stocker had a point to prove and did it...nothing to do with Teague's developing..

Kemp??? played last 2 games because all our other talls were out injured..Levi, Jones, Marchbank, Pittonet, McKay, Silvagni...Teague had no choice but to play the last man standing.

Gosh you exaggerate.

Development wasn't a strength of Teague. He chose to play an out of form unfit, and underdone players and out of form Murphy from round 2 onwards at the expense of playing youth.

Come on. Get real.

Teague's gone.

Lets move forward. I'm gettting sick of reading bullshit just to support a loser whose name happened to be Teague. He is a sacked coach. No one in the footy world except for a few diehard carlton fans who hate the Board would have NOT sacked Teague. It was inevitable...you fail to accept that.

Lets move forward.....come on Walshy....let explore blue skies...Sayers aint going anywhere for now.

...and suggesting Walsh should leave Carlton because Teague got sacked, because you think the Board is [REDACTED]...that's stupid and unhelpful and plain anti Carlton propaganda...I wish you would stop that or, hate to say this, just leave! I'm sick of anti Carlton people, and I've made that clear for the last 20 years. Its not on !!!


His record speaks for himself. I am not anti Carlton thats just damn rude. In Europe where real professionalism exists, we would be a laughing stock.

Basically there is a golden rule - if you havent lost the players and the players enjoy your game plan then you don't sack the manager. Finding good young managers that have players on side are too hard to find.

A golden rule the club has broken that you rarely see in other professional sports. The best example given is Pocchetino from Tottenhaam was given time to build his squad to compete at the elite level..he competed hard but failed to win silverware - after five years he was sacked. That was the correct call - he didnt lose the players and had players on side. But Tottenham grew sponsorship exponentially due the culture the club fostered.

If you cant see we are five years behind Bulldogs, Melbourne, Geelong, Hawthorn, Richmond etc then you can borrow my glasses.


I'm not being rude Walshy. I'm reflecting on your comments which I find anti carlton.

I know the world game well. I've been around too and have great contacts in the game overseas. The round ball game is very very different to Australian Rules (regardless what the damage the AFL Commission has done to the game).

Coaches are not there to be liked, they are there to be respected. If they are liked, good.

Aussie rules players are expected to by more physical at the contest than the round ball game. That takes a lot of courage and desire, let alone overcoming fears. Aussie rules coaches have alot more work to do on players mindset for that confrontation alone.

5 years??? You are making up numbers. i thought it was 4 years and 2 months. :wink:

Melbourne 2 years ago were 17th on the ladder, with only 7 wins and 78%.
They already had Lever and May in their stable. Not much changed.
Last year they missed finals with 9 wins.

You get my drift.

STOP exaggerating and degrading the prospects of my team.
We are not that far off.

Can you understand why I see your state of mind at present as Anti Carlton. You are trying to prove a point about Tague and sayers and taking you eye off the prize.

You want us to get Cerra for pick 6....why?...becaus e you say we are not that far off....now in one foul post its 5 years behind.

Come on, I liked your passion before Teague got sacked. Now you are just a bitter twisted soul.

Get over it...Blue skies...they are just ahead...we have to stick to the plan and make the most of what we've got in the hand, AND plug in some gaps.....and for the next month find us with a better coach than we had, and not a soccer coach!!

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:39 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24756
Location: Bondi Beach
Walsh wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
Walsh wrote:

Teague has two AA's and a Coleman medalist in one year under his belt.

You can blame his game plan which I accept but developing youngsters that are high performance personalities and right attitude. He has smashed it out of the ball park.

Weitering was good as gone but won B&F last year people were calling him to be traded in 2019 or have people forgotten? This board was calling H to be traded or have we forgotten?

Stocker, Jack, Kemp, Carrol are coming along nicely. Those that dont have a high performance mindset will never come on and be good players. SO yeah you can say he only focussed on those that are worth focussing on and developed young leaders.


Can't agree with that Walshy.

Walsh is self driven.
Weitering developed over the years and has a breakthrough year in Teague's first year...didn't happen overnight.
Harry had all the ball directed to him because Charlie was out, Levi a decoy on one leg, Jack and Gov injured most games..he was the sole target, and at 203cm and all that ball headed his way...I don't think Teague can take any credit for that.

Stocker...bashed his way into the team because Teague wouldn't play him till his 44 possession game. Stocker had a point to prove and did it...nothing to do with Teague's developing..

Kemp??? played last 2 games because all our other talls were out injured..Levi, Jones, Marchbank, Pittonet, McKay, Silvagni...Teague had no choice but to play the last man standing.

Gosh you exaggerate.

Development wasn't a strength of Teague. He chose to play an out of form unfit, and underdone players and out of form Murphy from round 2 onwards at the expense of playing youth.

Come on. Get real.

Teague's gone.

Lets move forward. I'm gettting sick of reading bullshit just to support a loser whose name happened to be Teague. He is a sacked coach. No one in the footy world except for a few diehard carlton fans who hate the Board would have NOT sacked Teague. It was inevitable...you fail to accept that.

Lets move forward.....come on Walshy....let explore blue skies...Sayers aint going anywhere for now.

...and suggesting Walsh should leave Carlton because Teague got sacked, because you think the Board is [REDACTED]...that's stupid and unhelpful and plain anti Carlton propaganda...I wish you would stop that or, hate to say this, just leave! I'm sick of anti Carlton people, and I've made that clear for the last 20 years. Its not on !!!


His record speaks for himself. I am not anti Carlton thats just damn rude. In Europe where real professionalism exists, we would be a laughing stock.

Basically there is a golden rule - if you havent lost the players and the players enjoy your game plan then you don't sack the manager. Finding good young managers that have players on side are too hard to find.

A golden rule the club has broken that you rarely see in other professional sports. The best example given is Pocchetino from Tottenhaam was given time to build his squad to compete at the elite level..he competed hard but failed to win silverware - after five years he was sacked. That was the correct call - he didnt lose the players and had players on side. But Tottenham grew sponsorship exponentially due the culture the club fostered.

If you cant see we are five years behind Bulldogs, Melbourne, Geelong, Hawthorn, Richmond etc then you can borrow my glasses.


Forget the rudeness...

i'm rebutted your fanciful point that Teague created AA's when he didn't.

Teague was at the club for 5 minutes and you credit him with that!

That's the exaggerating I'm talking about.

Lets stick to football, facts and the future.

What's done is done.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:46 am 
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Rod Ashman

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I was interested in the stat reported in the paper this morning that only 2 premiership coaches since 2000 had coached at senior level before (Matthews & Malthouse). All the rest coached premierships at the first team that appointed them. And this year will be no different.

Yes, this could be used as an argument to have kept Teague but I think the broader point is to highlight that it may be good for us to go through a process with a younger coach (as long as we make the right choice...).

I also note that there are even more coaches who have not delivered a Premiership...


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:46 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Walsh wrote:
Sayers would be seen as an idiot in Europe - sorry to say. Too many people are involved in professional sports over there not to notice his actions where non transparent and agenda driven.

In Europe when a manager takes a job he is told outright in mid range leagues. "Top five by mid season or renewal is not possible" - over there salary budget dictates where you end up on the ladder and even then it's super tough to entice the right people. We had translators, nutritionists, home buddies and what not. We had a German coach that spoke bad English and had to tell him to speak German so translators knows what he is saying....and this Sayers guy is going half cocked because he doesn't like the game plan? Fair enough I reckon... but in these situations you must give them a chance to bring his players in. Because who knows it might be revolutionary especially with injury list... but that will forever remain a mystery now - and that never happens in a professional environment. Yeah I guess Europeans are more switched on.


OMG, what are you doing?

I can see all these dotted lines ....... not relevant.

This is the coach thread...who will the next coach be....and you go off on a Sayers bashing here.

You know that there's Billions involved with some of these clubs you refer to, and you are comparing AFL, the Billion dollar INDUSTRY as a whole with them.

you realise the corruption that goes on in those clubs.

You realise they turn over coaches not because they are failures....corruption my dear boy.
You realise some coaches don't last a season over there

lets get your feet planted back in OZ...this is our world...and we take the good bits we can from the world of sport...and we have a soft cap salary we need to be mindful of.

Having said that, we are hearing of rumours Jeannie Pratt may just drop $12M to get Clarkson as her parting gift ... $12M...that's laughable in Europe. Ronaldo's bottled fart fetches more than that.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 10:47 am 
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bondiblue wrote:
"]
bondiblue wrote:
Walsh wrote:
Juddy&theKruezers wrote:
Walsh wrote:

Doesn't deserve this club you are probably right - Sammy will have his third coach and you are happy about whats happening at the club? You are too easily pleased.

Teague got the absolute best out of him any chance next coach will as well?

Wtf ? … bro really :lol:


Teague has two AA's and a Coleman medalist in one year under his belt.

You can blame his game plan which I accept but developing youngsters that are high performance personalities and right attitude. He has smashed it out of the ball park.

Weitering was good as gone but won B&F last year people were calling him to be traded in 2019 or have people forgotten? This board was calling H to be traded or have we forgotten?

Stocker, Jack, Kemp, Carrol are coming along nicely. Those that dont have a high performance mindset will never come on and be good players. SO yeah you can say he only focussed on those that are worth focussing on and developed young leaders.


Can't agree with that Walshy.

Walsh is self driven.
Weitering developed over the years and has a breakthrough year in Teague's first year...didn't happen overnight.
Harry had all the ball directed to him because Charlie was out, Levi a decoy on one leg, Jack and Gov injured most games..he was the sole target, and at 203cm and all that ball headed his way...I don't think Teague can take any credit for that.

Stocker...bashed his way into the team because Teague wouldn't play him till his 44 possession game. Stocker had a point to prove and did it...nothing to do with Teague's developing..

Kemp??? played last 2 games because all our other talls were out injured..Levi, Jones, Marchbank, Pittonet, McKay, Silvagni...Teague had no choice but to play the last man standing.

Gosh you exaggerate.

Development wasn't a strength of Teague. He chose to play an out of form unfit, and underdone players and out of form Murphy from round 2 onwards at the expense of playing youth.

Come on. Get real.

Teague's gone.

Lets move forward. I'm gettting sick of reading bullshit just to support a loser whose name happened to be Teague. He is a sacked coach. No one in the footy world except for a few diehard carlton fans who hate the Board would have NOT sacked Teague. It was inevitable...you fail to accept that.

Lets move forward.....come on Walshy....let explore blue skies...Sayers aint going anywhere for now.

...and suggesting Walsh should leave Carlton because Teague got sacked, because you think the Board is [REDACTED]...that's stupid and unhelpful and plain anti Carlton propaganda...I wish you would stop that or, hate to say this, just leave! I'm sick of anti Carlton people, and I've made that clear for the last 20 years. Its not on !!!


His record speaks for himself. I am not anti Carlton thats just damn rude. In Europe where real professionalism exists, we would be a laughing stock.

Basically there is a golden rule - if you havent lost the players and the players enjoy your game plan then you don't sack the manager. Finding good young managers that have players on side are too hard to find.

A golden rule the club has broken that you rarely see in other professional sports. The best example given is Pocchetino from Tottenhaam was given time to build his squad to compete at the elite level..he competed hard but failed to win silverware - after five years he was sacked. That was the correct call - he didnt lose the players and had players on side. But Tottenham grew sponsorship exponentially due the culture the club fostered.

If you cant see we are five years behind Bulldogs, Melbourne, Geelong, Hawthorn, Richmond etc then you can borrow my glasses.


I'm not being rude Walshy. I'm reflecting on your comments which I find anti carlton.

I know the world game well. I've been around too and have great contacts in the game overseas. The round ball game is very very different to Australian Rules (regardless what the damage the AFL Commission has done to the game).

Coaches are not there to be liked, they are there to be respected. If they are liked, good.

Aussie rules players are expected to by more physical at the contest than the round ball game. That takes a lot of courage and desire, let alone overcoming fears. Aussie rules coaches have alot more work to do on players mindset for that confrontation alone.

5 years??? You are making up numbers. i thought it was 4 years and 2 months. :wink:

Melbourne 2 years ago were 17th on the ladder, with only 7 wins and 78%.
They already had Lever and May in their stable. Not much changed.
Last year they missed finals with 9 wins.

You get my drift.

STOP exaggerating and degrading the prospects of my team.
We are not that far off.

Can you understand why I see your state of mind at present as Anti Carlton. You are trying to prove a point about Tague and sayers and taking you eye off the prize.

You want us to get Cerra for pick 6....why?...becaus e you say we are not that far off....now in one foul post its 5 years behind.

Come on, I liked your passion before Teague got sacked. Now you are just a bitter twisted soul.

Get over it...Blue skies...they are just ahead...we have to stick to the plan and make the most of what we've got in the hand, AND plug in some gaps.....and for the next month find us with a better coach than we had, and not a soccer coach!![/quote]

I understand your position but mistreatment of key personnel and flow on effects has wider repercussion. It's not that Teague was sacked - it was the mistreatment. You don't treat people like that in high performance environments especially to a very good clubman. We have now burnt two club champions within 10 years and its pretty much the same people pulling the strings. Club champions in Europe are venerated not treated with disrespect. So what you see is anti-Carlton from myself, I think the club needs to clean itself up or these little firecrackers of poor culture will continue and will continue to voice my discontent.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 11:00 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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thryleon wrote:
@bondiblue its not about winning. Ive faced a lot of criticism in the last 10 days for my views. I am simply expressing my frustration at this footy club.

We have form. In malthouses last season, we publically announced a rebuild in round 2. We declared his last season over before it began. We sacked mick 8 weeks later. The boys were lifeless on field.

I saw us repeating that mistake with the review. We declared a year before it was truly over and got wavering performances as the pressure mounted.

Thing is that turmoil would have existed already. We all knew lo giudice was out come end of season, and the rhetoric about Teague going started early when our record was poor 3 and 9 was something that I accepted as possible when we had lost 2 games and looked at the fixture.

Its a pattern that plays out at out club and its defined by our culture. We get into a position and then decide that things aren't working and rather than digging in we allow the pressure to amplify. Im not sure about this modus operandi as it puts people in self preservation mode. All of a sudden getting wins is more important than doing the right thing (Murphy to 300 is seen to be a point of weakness but I think if you look after your players, they will look after you).

Change itself isn't the issue, because there are factors involved that are harder to measure from the outside. So we go looking at things and cling to signs of why someone was moved on, like playing Murphy instead of a kid, or 5 goal run ons.

Leigh matthews came out with a statement when he was coaching Brisbane. Footy is a simple game. First to 100 points wins. Stats show this is true 97% of the time. Its also bullshit because teams don't score 100 points every week anymore, but it s a pressure valve release. Games not over until your opposition scores 100 points.

Anyway, until our club works out that these scenarios are more club defining than we think they are, we won't get further.

Back on topic. Im no Teague apologist. I think he might have done ok, but don't think he had the right amount of time to iron out inconsistencies in his game plan. I mean 10 of his games were about resetting after Bolton left and getting the players in a better headspace to attack games head on, and then we had the covid season which meant that the focus was a bit different and 2020 was marred by uncertainty. In essence covid hit at precisely the wrong time for an immature list and an immature coach. Better teams than ours showed covid cracks more than we did (West Coast being one).

Whats done is done though. Can't change it and I still respect the decision because a new president, potentially new ceo, new football department manager and then a new senior coach means you get people on boarding together and its something that plays out when you get senior leadership changes in almost all walks of life. The quicker it happens the better.

So now that all that has been said, we can get back on topic. Its becoming increasingly apparent to me, that the experienced coach handover to an apprentice in waiting is yielding better results than any other setup (of course that is a dependant on what the senior coach wants to do as mick and clarko didn't work in a forced environment with pressure). Paul roos into a coach in waiting is my preference.

Thing is in about 2 to 3 years when pressure mounts on the back of some undesirable results that's when we get tested to see if we can back our man in despite the downfalls.


Great post. seriously.

We have to wait it out for 3 years and see.

The pressure thing is real.
I don't think the players played as if pressure on their position/ status was a thing.
I think the whole place needed a shake up.

I believe in the list.
The Board had the courage to do the BIG rebuild.
Like coaches may need the extra year or two to tweak their game plan, so does the club.

Now it seems we are lining the ducks off field and on field.

Spotlight on CEO and Football manager. Pressure on to get the best out of them, or get people that are better.

I'm sure the level of urgency for high performance has hit the players where it should: between the ears.

Lets see. We haven't got a crystal ball. But what we do know is what we have, and its a list of a lot of first rounders and few current, ex and potential AA's and an eye for talent to fill gaps this and the next Trade period...that would be desirable for any coach.

Lyon's rejection is an issue with him and our process.
Clarkson wants a break and it sounds like Gil and the AFL Commission is interfering with the market forces. Lets see.

Has any young coach on the rise rejected Carlton? There's still 3 weeks before the season is over.

Lets hope the dominoes start to fall after cats lose this weekend. Fingers crossed.

Thanks for the post. I was beginning to think you may have been a disruptive plant on a high horse not able to see trees for wood.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 11:31 am 
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Bruce Doull
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jezzarules wrote:
CFC8795 wrote:
GWS wrote:
Beijing Blue wrote:
GWS wrote:
I loved what Lombardi said about explaining to the players the way they were going to play and if they played that way then most of the time they’d win.

I remember Parko once talking about markers which if the team met them they would inevitably win. Can’t remember what the numbers were and they’d be different these days but it was the stats without the ball like tackles and shepherds rather than disposals or marks that he was referring to and if the team hit certain levels they almost never lost.


As I recall, one of those off the ball criterion was "sacrificial acts".


Been a while since we’ve seen many of those... :lol:

Been a while since we've seen ANY of those :banghead:

Murphy retiring at 300?


Wasn't the sacrificial act getting Murphy to 300 games?!

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 11:51 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24756
Location: Bondi Beach
17th Premiership wrote:
I was interested in the stat reported in the paper this morning that only 2 premiership coaches since 2000 had coached at senior level before (Matthews & Malthouse). All the rest coached premierships at the first team that appointed them. And this year will be no different.

Yes, this could be used as an argument to have kept Teague but I think the broader point is to highlight that it may be good for us to go through a process with a younger coach (as long as we make the right choice...).

I also note that there are even more coaches who have not delivered a Premiership...


Haven't read papers today. Thanks

Very interesting.

Your last line is the norm.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 11:55 am 
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Whatever happens I just hope we give our next coach a proper midfield and a decent injury list so he can have a proper crack at it.

But young coaches lose players much easier than experienced coaches. So taking in a young coach is not without its big risks.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 12:05 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24756
Location: Bondi Beach
Walsh wrote:
Whatever happens I just hope we give our next coach a proper midfield and a decent injury list so he can have a proper crack at it.

But young coaches lose players much easier than experienced coaches. So taking in a young coach is not without its big risks.



True.

just posted in response to malbi re the importance of a ruckman who can assist the midfield, or at the very least as you mentioned, halve the ruck contest.

i wasn't a big fan of Kreuzer by the end of his career, but what he did do is halved the contest. The result? cripps MVP in 2019.

Now if cripps can win the hard ball, and lets say an improved (fitness and form) Williams and Dow supporting Walsh could be lethal.

Add Cerra...but we need the ruckman to halve contests. DeKoning is still a couple years behind in strength and craft....imo

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 12:15 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 1:23 am
Posts: 1566
Walsh wrote:
Sayers would be seen as an idiot in Europe - sorry to say. Too many people are involved in professional sports over there not to notice his actions where non transparent and agenda driven.

In Europe when a manager takes a job he is told outright in mid range leagues. "Top five by mid season or renewal is not possible" - over there salary budget dictates where you end up on the ladder and even then it's super tough to entice the right people. We had translators, nutritionists, home buddies and what not. We had a German coach that spoke bad English and had to tell him to speak German so translators knows what he is saying....and this Sayers guy is going half cocked because he doesn't like the game plan? Fair enough I reckon... but in these situations you must give them a chance to bring his players in. Because who knows it might be revolutionary especially with injury list... but that will forever remain a mystery now - and that never happens in a professional environment. Yeah I guess Europeans are more switched on.


First of all soccer has no budget and their success is based on owners at the time ,and this philosophy is based solely on how deep the pockets are of owners ,,,

Chelsea have a history of sacking coaches when they have won. Significant trophies
Man City were irrelevant before the scum of the uae bought them out
Sunderland were a premier league team only 5 years ago
Dortmund are owned by Bayern Munich
PSG again has Middle East money and their philosophy is based on money
Same with Barcelona and Real Madrid and all the politics
All soccer is based on politics and power play , I can give you more soccer clubs and their history if you want , just let me know!! Always happy to find holes in your theories ??

So I don’t know how you research things ( which clearly you don’t ) and you can’t compare the afl model to soccer model at all …

But as always you are
True to form with no logic

When are your Carltonions mates taking over the club ?? Are you going to be on their ticket with your knowledge you have to share ??

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 12:20 pm 
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azzablue wrote:
Walsh wrote:
Sayers would be seen as an idiot in Europe - sorry to say. Too many people are involved in professional sports over there not to notice his actions where non transparent and agenda driven.

In Europe when a manager takes a job he is told outright in mid range leagues. "Top five by mid season or renewal is not possible" - over there salary budget dictates where you end up on the ladder and even then it's super tough to entice the right people. We had translators, nutritionists, home buddies and what not. We had a German coach that spoke bad English and had to tell him to speak German so translators knows what he is saying....and this Sayers guy is going half cocked because he doesn't like the game plan? Fair enough I reckon... but in these situations you must give them a chance to bring his players in. Because who knows it might be revolutionary especially with injury list... but that will forever remain a mystery now - and that never happens in a professional environment. Yeah I guess Europeans are more switched on.


First of all soccer has no budget and their success is based on owners at the time ,and this philosophy is based solely on how deep the pockets are of owners ,,,

Chelsea have a history of sacking coaches when they have won. Significant trophies
Man City were irrelevant before the scum of the uae bought them out
Sunderland were a premier league team only 5 years ago
Dortmund are owned by Bayern Munich
PSG again has Middle East money and their philosophy is based on money
Same with Barcelona and Real Madrid and all the politics
All soccer is based on politics and power play , I can give you more soccer clubs and their history if you want , just let me know!! Always happy to find holes in your theories ??

So I don’t know how you research things ( which clearly you don’t ) and you can’t compare the afl model to soccer model at all …

But as always you are
True to form with no logic

When are your Carltonions mates taking over the club ?? Are you going to be on their ticket with your knowledge you have to share ??


AFL is no where near the league nor depth of $1b clubs.

I am talking clubs of similar size around $30-50m

You find them at second and third divisions all around Europe where real high performance professionalism kicks in and real football is played and they 100% have budgets.

If your salary budget is top five in the league then you are expected to win promotion. If your budget is 15th in the league then you are expected to finish between 8th to 12th etc and get any prize money you can get.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 12:26 pm 
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Craig Bradley
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Interesting take on it all.



https://twitter.com/premportfolio/status/1435169803040219141


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 1:55 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 8:22 am
Posts: 2742
So.... who should coach us next year??

I reckon we're looking hard at Brad and Chris Scott (probably why Brad hasn't taken the AFL job yet?). To me, both look good. However, I've heard not great things about Brad Scott from behind the scenes at the Kangas (from both a Kangas insider and an Essendon* insider). Not sure how much weight to place on this.

Otherwise, I don't mind exploring some of the younger crop but we will def need to go through a rigorous process to make sure we are really getting the right person.

BTW, even with the BB appointment - who i was keen on at the time - I don't think we really went through a deep and objective process!


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2021 1:57 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 1:23 am
Posts: 1566
Walsh wrote:
azzablue wrote:
Walsh wrote:
Sayers would be seen as an idiot in Europe - sorry to say. Too many people are involved in professional sports over there not to notice his actions where non transparent and agenda driven.

In Europe when a manager takes a job he is told outright in mid range leagues. "Top five by mid season or renewal is not possible" - over there salary budget dictates where you end up on the ladder and even then it's super tough to entice the right people. We had translators, nutritionists, home buddies and what not. We had a German coach that spoke bad English and had to tell him to speak German so translators knows what he is saying....and this Sayers guy is going half cocked because he doesn't like the game plan? Fair enough I reckon... but in these situations you must give them a chance to bring his players in. Because who knows it might be revolutionary especially with injury list... but that will forever remain a mystery now - and that never happens in a professional environment. Yeah I guess Europeans are more switched on.


First of all soccer has no budget and their success is based on owners at the time ,and this philosophy is based solely on how deep the pockets are of owners ,,,

Chelsea have a history of sacking coaches when they have won. Significant trophies
Man City were irrelevant before the scum of the uae bought them out
Sunderland were a premier league team only 5 years ago
Dortmund are owned by Bayern Munich
PSG again has Middle East money and their philosophy is based on money
Same with Barcelona and Real Madrid and all the politics
All soccer is based on politics and power play , I can give you more soccer clubs and their history if you want , just let me know!! Always happy to find holes in your theories ??

So I don’t know how you research things ( which clearly you don’t ) and you can’t compare the afl model to soccer model at all …

But as always you are
True to form with no logic

When are your Carltonions mates taking over the club ?? Are you going to be on their ticket with your knowledge you have to share ??


AFL is no where near the league nor depth of $1b clubs.

I am talking clubs of similar size around $30-50m

You find them at second and third divisions all around Europe where real high performance professionalism kicks in and real football is played and they 100% have budgets.

If your salary budget is top five in the league then you are expected to win promotion. If your budget is 15th in the league then you are expected to finish between 8th to 12th etc and get any prize money you can get.

Again even the lower clubs in the lower divisions are thriving for promotion and Bolton is another premier side that went into liquidation from bad owners

So your points don’t make sense at all

You can’t compare so stop bringing sooner concepts into how afl pick coaches

It’s not long.now for our experienced coach to be appointed after the Teague disaster and shit he did especially to the younger group

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